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REality
Welcome to the REality podcast--the best podcast for real estate agents. Join us each episode as we talk with industry experts and top producing real estate agents to peel back the curtain and reveal what it takes to make it in today's ultra competitive real estate business. This is real life, in real time, sharing real experiences of industry professionals to help both new and seasoned agents achieve their goals and realize their potential. Are you ready to take your real estate business to the next level? Let's get started now. Sign up for Gary's weekly FOCUS newsletter, delivered right to your inbox each Monday morning: https://mailchi.mp/e3771e6a2516/focus-email
REality
Mike Staver on Overcoming Transaction Anxiety, Strategic Clarity, and Personal Growth
Unlock the secrets to overcoming "transaction anxiety" in the real estate market and finish 2024 on a high note with insights from Mike Staver. As a returning guest and seasoned expert, Mike dives into the importance of focusing on units over volume and how to maintain strategic clarity amidst the chaos of external distractions like elections and market shifts. Prepare to equip yourself with actionable strategies to not only conclude this year with strength but also lay a solid foundation for a successful 2025.
Our discussion takes a deep dive into effective strategic planning through a simple yet powerful three-step approach—results, strategy, and action. Discover how to sidestep common pitfalls such as complacency and misalignment by setting clear objectives and aligning your actions with these goals. Through real-life examples, including missteps and successes from our own experiences, we emphasize the need for business leaders to consistently evaluate and refine their strategies. Embrace vulnerability and courage in leadership to foster growth and stay ahead in the competitive real estate industry.
Leadership and personal growth are at the heart of our conversation, as we explore timeless principles that transcend titles and pay grades. Drawing inspiration from Mike's book, "Leadership Isn't for Cowards," we discuss bridging the gap between intention and execution while maintaining personal values like authenticity and freedom. With insights from leadership literature and personal anecdotes, we stress the importance of accountability, incremental progress, and self-investment. As we wrap up, we reflect on personal transformation and the transition from success to significance, setting the stage for a transformative 2025.
Welcome to Reality Podcast. I am your host, gary Scott, and excited to have the first three-time guest, my great friend Mike Staver. Mike, good morning.
Speaker 2:Good morning, good to see you, friend. I hope it's not three strikes and you're out. That's what I hope.
Speaker 1:It is our commitment to have Mike Staber on each and every year. Mike shares some incredible insights about mindset, accountability, consistency, navigating a crazy world that we live. We're excited, mike, to have you on, certainly near the end of the year. I said good morning, realizing that our listeners are listening at all times, but in full transparency. To the audience today, first, thanks for joining us, but second, it is the morning before Thanksgiving 2024. So first thing I want to say, mike, is happy Thanksgiving to you and to yours.
Speaker 2:Happy Thanksgiving to you as well. I'm always so thankful for our relationship over the years. I'm thinking that man we probably met 20 years ago close to it, maybe not exactly 20, but it was pretty close to that probably so, mike.
Speaker 1:It was every bit of 20 years ago I think it was 2004 when the Allen Tate Company engaged you for an accountability program. I remember it like it was yesterday. We were at a leadership advance and we were just about to enter. This might've been 05 or 06. And you did this exercise, which I still use today. You should be scared if.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's exactly right. That's right. Remember that, yeah, yeah. And then you and me and Pat Riley have talked, and then I think you and Pat got in the car after that because we did remember we did that exercise, called you better have plenty of plywood in storage, oh yeah, because a hurricane's on the way. Yeah, and little did we know how big that hurricane is going to be.
Speaker 1:Exactly. Well, so we'll get to today's topic. But the one thing I remember, and it's so appropriate today, where number one on, you should be scared, if you should be scared, if you are not. Laser focused on units, not volume.
Speaker 2:Is that appropriate? Oh my gosh. So much and I'm still shocked. I actually heard somebody say this week I have no idea an agent, I have no idea how many units I do. I only focus on volume, because that's what pays the bills. I'm like, hmm, that story could end badly, you know.
Speaker 1:Well, I think we know that we've been spoiled by the last three years of the volume and anyway, so we've got that. You did a great program, the Excusathon I'm going back in the Mike Staver archives, but you know it's about making excuses. So everything you, everything we always say, the more things change, the more things stay the same. And what we want to talk about today, mike, is we're ending 2024. And I want to talk a little bit about how our listeners can get themselves right for finishing strong, clearly about a month left, but also really jettisoning into 2025. So you've spent a lot of time this year talking to not just real estate companies but other industries. Share some of your observations, really about the individual's mindset and the noise in the world, whether it was the election or interest rates or inventory. What are some of your key observations that you want to share this morning?
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you for that and thank you for that question. One of the things that I have really noticed this year and actually last year as well, but mostly this year is an increased level of transaction anxiety. And transaction anxiety is we have a hard time, it seems, being really focused and clear on what our process is and then trusting the process. I coach a person out in California and agent California and she has a whiteboard in her office and every when we first talked she looked at her whiteboard. She said I only have this many deals and I'm really nervous. I want to talk to you about what I need to do. First thing we need to do is stop looking at that whiteboard. That's the first thing.
Speaker 2:And transaction anxiety is I'm so concerned, I have so much anxiety about what's going to happen next, that I there is a tendency to grab this and grab that and have the strategy du jour or program du jour of the day, and I think what we need to do is get really focused on two things strategy and structure. And strategy and structure are the two elements that I think will overcome transaction anxiety by saying am I structured for success in 2025? And do I have the right strategy for 2025?. And then I think you mentioned it. I think you're absolutely right, gary, as you always are that the noise has been in such a fever pitch with the NAR issues and the election and you know what's it going to look like. And then great brokerages like yours are doing all they can to equip agents, but I think the agent wants, needs to grasp this notion of I need to focus on the right strategy with the right structure so that I can execute the right strategy, with the right structure, so that I can execute.
Speaker 2:And then the final thing somebody asked me recently Gary, mike, if you could change two things about the real estate business, snap your fingers and change it. What would you change? And I thought that was a great. It might've been a podcast, I don't remember and I said two things. I think individuals and teams and brokerages struggle to get clarity of vision and they struggle to execute. And so if we could get clarity of what we're looking for and get good I call it flawless execution I think we would overcome a lot of the ills we've suffered.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to piggyback off strategy and structure, because I think one of the challenges, mike, is that there are agents out there that have no strategy and have no structure. So I think what you were talking about is a clear strategy and a structure that I bought into. So let's talk a little bit. You know, I want to make sure that everybody that's listening to this particular podcast it understands what strategy means. You know, I think sometimes you and I, because we've been doing it for so long, we make assumptions, yeah, and so let's really dig deep into strategy and what that structure might look like and maybe provide a little bit of a game plan or a playbook for those that are out there saying I understand what Mike is saying, but I maybe don't know exactly how to do it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I use a three-step process. It's results, strategy, action. The result is the outcome that I seek, the strategy is how I choose to go about executing on that outcome, and the action are the activities necessary to put gas in the tank of my strategy. So let's take a personal example. Let's say that I decide I want less stress in my life. That's the outcome I want. And I decide that the way I want less stress in my life is I'm going to go on a vacation. So I'm going to choose vacationing as my strategy for executing on less stress. So I go on vacation, I go to Maui, where I love to go, and I feel great. And then I come back and the wheels hit the runway and here comes that rainy day feeling again. So I call that misaligned strategy. There's nothing wrong with taking the vacation, but there has to be a direct connection to what you're doing and the outcome that you seek, and the outcome needs to be something pretty high.
Speaker 2:So if somebody says, I want to do five more sides next year, make $100,000 more money, that is not an outcome, that's a strategy. More deals is the strategy. Why and so I use a question like this Gary, you want to do more deals and do five or 10 more sides so that you can be, do or become what. So the first thing we do is set the target Like what? What's the story? I do this with all my clients. What's the story a year from now, when we're getting ready to cut the bird? What is the story? We will tell about the year and we don't tell stories like well, I made $100,000 more, I did 10 more sides, that's what you did, but what did you create? So you got to get clarity about your outcome first. Clarity about outcomes first. Here's the three things to remember Firm on results. Flexible on strategy. Quick in your action. Firm on results, flexible in strategy, quick in action.
Speaker 2:So if I say there are a lot of ways I can reduce stress and have more peace in my life, so I'm just going to be firm. I am unwavering that I want more freedom in my real estate business next year. I want more flexibility. I want a life that is, I'm in control of, not somebody else. So do I run the business or does the business run me? And then the conversation you and I would have if we're coaching them is what are all the pathways that would lead us to more structure. That would help us achieve a greater level of flexibility. That would help us run the business and the business not run us.
Speaker 2:And then we operate at the strategic level so that we filter everything we do and this is what I use with my clients, everything we do through this question to what extent is the strategy I'm using, the pathway I'm building, have a reasonable probability of getting me to this outcome? And what a lot of people do is they say, well, my strategy is more deals. No, your strategy overall is focusing on buy side or list side more or whatever. I'm going to be more of a listing agent next year. Okay, that's one strategy, but that's not the only strategy. And what I see a lot of people doing, gary, is I see a lot of people that choose a strategy that cannot in any efficient way, really get them to the outcome they want. So they keep getting frustrated, so they dig the hole, they dig the hole, they dig the hole. So to me, strategy is the pathway, it's the overarching pathway that gets us to the outcomes that we seek.
Speaker 1:So highly confident that the segment Mike just shared needs to be listened to again when you're sitting down with a notepad. So I'm not going to reclaim what Mike just said. But what I want to do is kind of role play a little bit and share with you a couple of things that we're looking at as an organization, and this is a real clarity of purpose and some strategy. So I'll be a little vulnerable. And some strategy, so I'll be a little vulnerable. So last year in 2024, one of our three wildly important goals kind of the four disciplines of execution right was to grow our agent count by 20%. Well, obviously that's really hard to do. You've got 1,700 agents. Are you really going to hire 340? Net gain in the world we live Like I can imagine our leaders said Gary, that's a really good one, but I'm going to put that in the closet because we're not going to get there.
Speaker 1:Okay, Well, Gary, I don't know what happened, but apparently you hit your head, yeah exactly, exactly, and so you know it's interesting because I was well aware of it and I tried to defend it. And you know it's interesting because I was well aware of it and I tried to defend it. And you know I, you know I don't care how long you've been doing this you know we make, we make mistakes and I think that's OK. I've shared with you many times, as a great friend and coach of mine is, you know, I think leadership is about trust, vulnerability and courage, like, I think, those three things. There's a lot of three words that can nail leadership, but those are the ones that are kind of the tenants.
Speaker 1:So this year, we think 2025 is going to be a good and better year in the real estate business and we're going to go back to the basic fundamental, which is if you dominate listings, you will win the day and the game period. So our outcome is we want to grow our new listings to market by 20%. That's what the sitting down next year, the Wednesday before Thanksgiving and Mike and I are doing our year-end podcast I'm going to say, mike, guess what? We did two things. Number one we grew our listings by over 20% and we outperformed the market. Those are our two most significant.
Speaker 1:So that's the picture and if everybody in the organization sees that picture with clarity, then it's our job to create the strategy. It might be grow agent count. That might be a strategy, but not an outcome. We might talk about an open house initiative that we believe. In today's world, more buyers are going to go to open houses as the first step to their journey, and maybe that's a strategy. We want to make sure that 30% of every one of our active listings is open every. And maybe that's a strategy. We want to make sure that 30% of every one of our active listings is open every weekend and that's a strategy. So walk me through and maybe help me say is that the picture that you've just painted, but on an enterprise perspective?
Speaker 2:I, I. This is what I would say. So tell me what the outcome, tell me one of your outcomes again.
Speaker 1:Well, one of the outcomes is we want to grow our listings by 20% in 25 over 24.
Speaker 2:So that, so that you can be, do or become what as a company?
Speaker 1:We believe that because if we do that, we will grow our market share in every market that we're in. Because we believe everything will follow the listing growth.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 2:So I would say that your outcome, your result, is growing market share. The strategy is whatever you just said. The outcome was, yeah, the listings. So one of the strategies to grow market share is listings, but there's one of the strategies to grow market share is listings, but there's a lot of strategies to grow market share Yep, and the activities are open houses, deeper penetration with our marketing, that kind of thing. So you always want to ask yourself when we say, this is our big hairy. I'll give you an example.
Speaker 2:As you know, we certify coaches and our coaching methodology, and a leader of a company yesterday sent me an email and said I'm kind of confused on the difference in a strategy and an outcome. I said, well, a strategy and an outcome pretty straightforward or a result. You just ask yourself all right, we want to do X so that you can be, do or become what. Well, ultimately, our result is we want to do X so that you can be, do or become what. Well, ultimately, our result is we want to grow market share. Okay, we want to grow market share. Well, what is the pathway to growing market share? We believe agent, count, deals, listings, whatever. That thing is All right. Well then, how are you going to do that? There's got to be some activity, there's got to be fuel in the tank. And so, when your listeners are thinking about the outcome, you just want to keep asking yourself okay, so I can do be or become what, so that I can do be or become what, and then you'll get to the ultimate outcome, and then you filter whatever your strategies are against that, and then what that creates is strategic flexibility, because if you go sideways and we're like I don't really know, I'm not, this isn't really working. That's why you're firm Once you get to the outcome. You can afford to be firm on the outcome because it's aspirational in nature. It is the ultimate thing that we will measure our success by. If we go out and, do you know, 20% more open houses next year, we could do that and not grow market share by a percentage point. Right. And so I think if I say and we're just obviously just playing with an idea but if we say, all right, ultimately the result for 2025 is to grow market share by 5% or 10% or 20% or whatever, all right, I'm your coach.
Speaker 2:My first question to you, gary, is going to be all right. Well, what's the strategy for growing market share. Well, we could do agent count, we could do increased listings, we could do whatever, all right. Well, what are the activities that are going to drive listings? What are the activities that will drive share? Then you can cascade that to every department in the organization. You can go to marketing, you can go to relocation, you can go to IT. You can go to all those people and say your job is to roll your strategic intention around market share. And you've got to justify to me and to the executive team that the resources that you're using to do the strategy that you're using has a direct connection to market share in your area of influence.
Speaker 1:So the good thing we did in June of 2023, mike, was we took, at that time, our wigs to the entire enterprise to make sure that insurance and accounting and marketing understood where the enterprise was going, because every single action and activity and behavior needs alignment in all of the different disciplines and shared services. So I think we took a big step. I love what I just got a free coaching session, by the way, for you know, so I we had listings in market share. I've moved it. It's going to be grow market share and then we'll use the funnel. I love firm, flexible, quick. I want everybody to remember those three things. So great, let's shift gears a little bit. Great, let's shift gears a little bit.
Speaker 1:I know that you coach a lot of business leaders, some in the real estate business and some outside. What do you think? Some of the big, big challenges that our industry is confronted with? That might be less obvious, and what I mean by that is we've got the NAR lawsuit, we've got interest rates, we've got inventory, but one of the things I like about your first segment was talking about transactional anxiety. One of the things I wrote down in preparation for our time today, mike, was this laser focus that I believe and I'm interested in your insight and input in how important relationships are. And if I'm transactionally based, I've got limitations. If I am relationally based, I've got no ceiling. Can we talk about that a little?
Speaker 2:bit, yeah. So I think one of the issues that is seldom talked about in our industry and I'll probably never get hired to do anything again after I say this, but I believe our industry and I watched it happen throughout the pandemic, I mean throughout the lawsuit which felt like the pandemic is complacency. And let me I'm not you know, gary, and your listeners who know me, know that I'm not very smart, so what I tend to do is I tend to look up words. Most people in my business just make up definitions to fit whatever they want, but I figure you know the Websters, they did a pretty good job and so I look it up. So I looked up complacency. What do you think? Just take a wild guess what do you think the definition of complacency is? Become bored, yeah, I thought it would be something like that. Or I don't care so much. No, that isn't what it is. And I love this care so much. No, that isn't what it is. And I love this definition so much. Have you ever looked something up and thought, oh, that definition is so much better than anything I would have ever come up with? This is it. I love this.
Speaker 2:It is self-satisfaction while ignoring danger. Think about that Self-satisfaction while ignoring danger. So what I heard a lot was a lot of chest puffing, a lot of we're the biggest, we're this, we do this, we do that, which is great. We should be satisfied. We should be. We should be proud of our companies. We should be proud of our, our book of business, we should. But there are dangers that are inherent in any business that if we ignore those dangers, we'll get in a lot of trouble. And what I think is seldom talked about is are we really willing to look at the strategy and structure of the business and question it? Or do we look at the strategy and structure of the business and justify it? And I'm not saying that the strategy and structure of the business and justify it, and I'm not saying that the strategy and structure needs to be changed. I mean, I'm sure you have listeners who run books of business. You know a hundred million plus 10 million maybe we've got rookies listening, great. I believe that every year at least we should be looking at our business and saying where am I really happy and where is the danger I'm ignoring because I'm so satisfied? So think about that. That is a big definition Self-satisfaction while being unaware of or ignoring danger, and so I think, if we're going to be successful at this time of year and your listeners are going to be screaming up against the end of the year, like all of us, I do something every year called a fearless inventory, and a fearless inventory means I just put the business myself, my relationships, my health in front of the mirror and I do an inventory and say where?
Speaker 2:I am not concerned about the places that I want to improve, I am concerned about the places where I am doing well, the places where I'm really satisfied. Not to buzzkill myself, but to look around and go. What might my, what might my satisfaction be insulating me from observing? What might I not be paying attention to? That, if I paid attention to, it could either help me with momentum, which you brought up earlier, which is exactly what we need to do for the first of the year, but it could also help me avert a challenge, right? Let me give you a very simple example.
Speaker 2:Speaking of structure, I had a call recently and this agent it was an agent said I just lost a $4 million listing and I am devastated. I said well, why are you devastated? I mean you make a ton of money. She said I have worked with this family for 20 years. I have done every real estate investment transaction or otherwise for 20 years. And they went with somebody else. I said why did they go with somebody else? She said well, I knew you were going to ask. And she said she said she, they felt like I had gotten too comfortable and didn't use the word complacent and to and assume too much that the business was just theirs. And they went with somebody that was more hungry. Now I know this agent, gary. There's nobody more hungry than this agent. She was so satisfied, she was so, so comfortable in her business that she lost a customer. Now they'll probably come back eventually.
Speaker 2:But the point is that, I think, is the biggest thing that we're not paying attention to. We're not rigorous. I mean rigorous in our evaluation of the areas where we're satisfied is where we're satisfied. And if we get rigorous in the areas where we're satisfied and we observe or we think about whatever could be dangerous, we don't have to get paranoid and scared. We just need to say do I need to address it or not? And if the answer is no, let's move on down the road. If the answer is yes, then let's get busy addressing the danger.
Speaker 1:Self-satisfaction while ignoring danger. Mike, I'm going to go back about six years. You and I were working together and you did a session complacency versus momentum and you broke us into pairs and we had to be vulnerable and we had to share with our partner. What have I become complacent with? And I'll never forget it. I know exactly who I was with a gentleman named Bob Albanese, who, bob Albanese, works for Howard Hannah Rand. So we're all. We're back together again.
Speaker 2:Back together.
Speaker 1:And I remember telling Bob and I remember it like it was yesterday I said I had become complacent in not believing at the time that I had to actually go to the events in the company throughout the region because, yeah, it was hard, it was a lot, it was travel, and what happened is I wouldn't go to this and everything seemed fine. I wouldn't go to this and everything seemed fine. I wouldn't go to this and everything seemed fine. And then, a year and a half later, you know, you find out that says where's that guy Like, where's that guy Like, what's that guy doing Like?
Speaker 1:And I think I became complacent because it felt and the danger was, you know, lost sight of how we have to make a big company feel small. And one of the greatest assets to our culture Alan Tate, howard, hanna is big company, feel small Family, and it's about caring and all of those emotional things that do draw people to our company. And I think, complacency versus momentum. And then I remember the exercise. Then we got back together and said if I went back and did the things that I knew I had to do, but better than I had been doing, what might that outcome be? And boy, it really resonates.
Speaker 2:And what if I had the courage? Because sometimes the danger is in the things you're doing that are working. Because you know, I gave an award last year, I think it was to the one of the co founders of Netflix and when we were Mark Randolph, and when we were standing backstage in the green room, I got to spend about a half an hour with Mark and I said is the Blockbuster story true? Is it true that you really wanted to sell Netflix to Blockbuster, because all the people in my business use it? He goes yeah, $50 million, mike, we wanted to sell it for $50 million. That is zero money given the cap value of Netflix.
Speaker 2:And he said Blockbuster didn't want to do it. And I believe Blockbuster didn't want to do it. And he and I believe Blockbuster didn't want to do it because they got complacent. They really believed that you and me and our families were going to stand around that stupid return box at a Blockbuster store looking into the return box. Remember we used to do that. Come on, titanic, somebody drop it off. And he said we looked the other way. The train was coming down. They looked the other way. Train was coming down the tracks, they could have stolen it. So I think that's really important.
Speaker 1:Well, I think there's a lot, you know, again, we could go through, whether it's Uber or, you know, you can name the industries that got complacent, believing that whatever they had and were holding on to was the future. And I think our industry has to continue to have this incredible awareness because in a meeting last week, you know, I think we all realize that you know, some of our future competitors aren't haven't yet to be identified, like I know. I know we believe an Amazon. I know, we believe, I think we believe these. You know, these entities that just have capabilities that are extraordinary are going to look at our space and you and I know this. For 30 years, everybody's looked at our space. Number one, thinking how easy it is. Number two Number one, thinking how easy it is. Number two, wondering why it feels to them to be archaic. But it isn't archaic. There's archaic components of it, but the people piece of it say every year you have to challenge the traditions of the past year to make sure they're relevant in the future.
Speaker 2:That's such a great, that's so great, yeah. And and then, once you challenge them, you have to have the courage to what was it? Bob Kriegel, I think. Somebody wrote the book Sacred Cows Make the Best Burgers and I just love that. I love the thought of it.
Speaker 1:I just am writing that down because I'm going to get to some book recommendations.
Speaker 2:Sacred Cows Make the Best Burgers, yeah it's an old book, but it's a good book.
Speaker 1:Well, sometimes the oldies are the goodies, right, when you think about? It I go back in leadership. You know, the one minute manager is forever right.
Speaker 2:You know it's the best. I read it every year and it's just you can. You can knock it out in a plane or in a quiet time in the morning, yeah.
Speaker 1:So, mike, let's talk about that. I don't know how many years ago it was, I don't know 10, 12 years ago. You wrote a book that is entitled leadership isn't for Cowards, and you know, one of the things that we stress here is that you know, leadership isn't a title, leadership isn't a pay grade. Leadership is everybody, every day, in many, many ways, and leadership is impact influence. You know every one of our sales professionals is a leader. You know they're leading families in this journey, complex journey of homeownership, important journey like critical journey. You know, generational wealth, American dream we can talk about that, you know. I know it sounds cliche, but those are really true. And so I think that every single person, regardless of title or job, is a leader to some degree, to some extent. So share some of the keys to your book Again, 10 or 12 years ago. Clearly, the basic pillars and tenets and foundation of that book remain true today. You want to just share a few thoughts about the book.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you said the word you said is the word that I believe is true. I believe leadership is influencing an individual or a group of individuals to achieve results beyond which they're currently capable, not results they are currently achieving. I don't need you to lead me to be a public speaker. I don't need you to lead me to be a coach, but I'm going to follow you to the ends of the earth if you can help me bridge the gap, if you can influence or help me bridge the gap between where I am and where I need to be. Leadership happens in the gap. Leadership happens in the gap between intention and execution, or Gary Scott or Phyllis Brookshire, whoever understands that? Leadership, to your point exactly, is not a pay grade, not money. It has nothing to do with rank.
Speaker 2:It has everything to do with influencing people to. And here's the big thing we, I think I did a segment recently called it's okay to lower the bar. I thought people were going to throw up in their mouths when I said that, but this is what I meant by that.
Speaker 2:If I can influence as an agent, if I can influence as a sales manager, if I can influence as a exec, the narrowing of the gap ever so slightly, it will have exponential impact downstream. But what most people do is most people want to swing for the fences all the time. They want to swing for the fences all the time. And my father-in-law is a baseball coach. He's in the Hall of Fame for baseball in Arizona. They just named a field after him. He's amazing and he has this philosophy. He calls 21 outs and he says it is not the first inning, it's not the second inning, it's all the way through. He's a high school baseball coach, was high school baseball coach for 45 years and I said that's such a great way to see life leaders play. They aren't always swinging for the fences. That you know. A single is fine. Accepting a strikeout occasionally is fine.
Speaker 2:The work is about how do I influence an individual or a group of individuals to achieve results beyond which they currently believe they're capable, and we do that by just helping them narrow the gap slightly. So if a person says, well, if I'm working with a buyer and the buyer says, I'm really frustrated because this offer, I really wanted this house and they didn't take it. Ok, well, let's just. Let's just look at the offer and let's look at what the factors are and see if we can narrow it just a little bit. We don't have to go all the way one way or the other. You know, if I'm coaching somebody, I'm not working to get them to close the gap and become a superhero somebody. I'm not working to get them to close the gap and become a superhero. I just want sustained gap narrowing over time. If I can influence somebody to narrow the gap slightly and sustain it over time, they create exponential results.
Speaker 1:Awesome, let's talk a little bit. I shared with you before we got on the air that one day last week I was talking to two individuals that are very close to me we're talking about a lot of different things and they both said to me oh you know, you know, mike Staver. I said, yeah, one of my great friends and mentors and they're like you know, he's coaching me. And I said well, you know, you can't go wrong with that investment. And I think a couple of things I want to focus on that word investment, Right. I want to focus on that word investment, right.
Speaker 1:I think that one of the things that I want to encourage everyone listening today is, as you build your plan for 25, let's make sure, mike, that we spend a couple minutes on the importance of investing in ourselves. Now, that could be professionally, that can be familially, that can be spiritually, that can be physically. But you know, if we don't invest, not expend, not a cost, but invest in ourselves, then we're going to find our you use the word sustain you're going to find the ability to sustain a high level of performance, to be really challenged. And again, I'm not here to have you tell people why they should use Mike Staver for coaching. But let's talk about the importance of investing in ourselves.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, right, what is the old cliche you get? You miss a hundred percent of the shots you don't take, and that that circles back to complacency, doesn't it? I mean, if we're not, I don't know. You know people, I don't know if you ever saw the meme. Did you ever see the meme, gary? It's a picture of Confucius and there's a little thought bubble above his head and he says I never said any of that crap. It's so funny, it's hilarious, I love it so much. So I don't know who said this. Maybe it was Lincoln. He gets blamed for it. I don't know who said it.
Speaker 2:But if somebody said, if you gave me two hours to cut down a tree, I'd spend an hour and a half sharpening my saw, and that's what speaks to investment, right, but it's not a check necessarily. It could be, it could be time. What if you decide you really want to invest in relationships and you decide I'm not answering my phone after six o'clock until the dinner hour passes and I've spent great time with my kids and my partner investing, pouring myself into their lives, so that I get long-term return, because when all the deals are done and all those things happen, it isn't going to matter, right Unless I have good return on investment right, and so I think that I'm a big believer and you've heard me say this for 20 years that energy is the thing you want to pay attention to. If you're investing your energy in the things that have and here's the important point If you're investing your energy in things that have a high probability of a positive return on your investment, you will get success, as you define.
Speaker 2:However, if I am not jealous of my energy and I invest my energy in low return things watching the news, listening to gossip, not surrounding myself with positive things You've heard me say in webinars and I'm sure your listeners who have attended have heard me say whatever your eyes see and your ears hear is what your brain uses for nourishment. Whatever your eyes see and your ears hear is what your brain uses for nourishment. So that's where investment comes from. What am I seeing, what am I hearing? And is that investment storing me up to draw on the reserves and to help me grow and scale me up to draw?
Speaker 1:on the reserves and to help me grow and scale. So I want to piggyback off that. You know this is airing, probably first week of December, holidays coming up, family, friends, all those things, those precious times that we need to re-energize ourselves. And then you know I was going to ask you about New Year's resolutions, but I think what we just said is you know, those are fraught with failure. It's really about intentionality and investment, and I love you and I talked before we got started less is more, do fewer things great.
Speaker 1:And you know execution and I think you used the term flawless execution of your well-thought-out business plan will most likely increase the probability of a successful return. And we just all have to be very, very careful about the shiny penny, the new idea, the new vendor that comes to town that somehow gets in front of the agents and says I've got the greatest and latest AI that is known to mankind and the world is probably going to change because I invented right. And you know what happens Some agent business isn't where it needs to be and that's the next. You know it's interesting as I prepared my thoughts for our interview today, always want to know what you're thinking about go forward, but I like to lean in on the lessons that many of us have learned in the past, that we. The irony is that we actually use like we do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, and like you, and I laughed about you know if I should be scared if and we laughed about the excuse-a-thon Well, those were 20 years ago. That I think about in those moments. But one of the great decision making I'll call it processes best case, worst case, most likely case Share with our listeners that because every day we have choices to make yeah, some bigger than others, was it? Thirty five thousand decisions a day? We make some crazy number, and thirty four thousand nine hundred and two of them are ones that we don't even think about. The other ones we think about. So think you know this journey of decision making, particularly the big ones Best case, worst case, most likely. I love it.
Speaker 2:So those are most. And then there are three other questions what is my specific plan in the best case? What is my specific plan in the worst case? What is my specific plan in the best case? What is my specific plan in the worst case? What is my specific plan in the most likely case? Those six questions are the six power questions that we should use whenever we're up against ambivalence.
Speaker 2:I'm working with somebody right now who's looking to sell their company and they have a lot of angst about it. Right, it's a multi-generational firm. They you know they've got a lot of angst about it. We did that exercise yesterday and all the anxiety and fear went away. Well, it didn't all go away, but it went to a quiet enough level that it was manageable that you feel maybe even anxious or nervous about. It's critically important that you create a space where you intensify your focus on the three scenarios. So, if I do this, what's the worst thing that can happen? What's the best thing that can happen? What's the most likely thing that will probably happen? Imagine, for the agents that are listening, that they are trying to get somebody to do a price reduction and the person won't do the price reduction. Well, rather than getting a debate about a price reduction, why don't you just do the three scenarios? Well, what do you think the worst thing is if we do the price reduction? What?
Speaker 1:do you think the?
Speaker 2:best thing will be if we do the price reduction. What's most likely to happen? And they'll probably look at you as the agent and say, I don't know, tell me. Well, it doesn't really matter what we believe. What matters is what is our specific plan in each scenario? And what I hear people doing is I hear people being flippant oh, we'll just cross that bridge when we come to it. Things work out for people who think they will. That's not a specific plan, that's a hope and a prayer. And so when we are faced with ambivalence or faced with challenges, you want to look at the best case, worst case and most likely case, and then what you want to do is you want to create a space where you have a specific plan for executing on that thing and then put it away and go about your business and move forward, and one of those things is going to happen, or some modification of those things, and then, you have the plan those things is going to happen or some modification of those things.
Speaker 2:And then you have the plan. Caterpillar Tractor, in 2007, had a meeting and they brought all their country presidents in, and the CEO of Caterpillar International said we've had the best year in the history of Caterpillar. We're the darling of Wall Street. Our dividends are amazing. All of you just got a big seven figure bonus. Here's what I want you to do. I want you to go back to your countries and I want you to build what he called a trough plan. A trough plan is simply what happens if we go off a cliff, and I want you to put it in your bottom desk drawer and never worry about it again. Gary, that was in 2006 or seven. We know what happened in 2008 and Caterpillar had the most shallow crash of any construction, major construction organization or equipment manufacturer in the world. Why? Because they had the right plan at the right time to mitigate a crash and have a softer landing. That's what intentionality looks like.
Speaker 1:Well, and they had a plan when they didn't need a plan. It reminds me, before we got on the air, you and I were talking about the importance of mentors in our lives and on this day before Thanksgiving, I want to thank you for being a significant mentor in my life. And so I want to say thank you on air for all that you have contributed to my both personal and professional life and, along the way, some successes. But we're talking about my father and what's interesting, it's so funny. You say that because every year, if you worked for my dad I don't care what the market was going to do you had to have a 5, 10, 15 plan in the drawer. Yeah, and that was expense reduction 5, 10, 15,. Revenue increase 5, 10, 15.
Speaker 1:And so every year you had to do those plans so that, in the event the world changed, you didn't have to build a plan. You went into your top drawer and you built your. It's what Caterpillar did, right, they, the trough, the what was it called? The trough plan. So dad had the 5, 10, 15. Decrease expenses, increase revenue Clearly, it's all part and parcel of every year's business plan, but you got to be able to activate in real time. The other thing you talked about earlier was firm, flexible and quick. You know the other thing you talked about earlier was firm, flexible and quick. You know, I think quick is so critically important in certain things that we have to deal with in today's world.
Speaker 2:Which is different, by the way, than fast. So quick has to do with precision and execution, and I think it was Wooden it might have been John Wooden, I don't remember who it was that said it but they said I don't need the fastest team, I need the quickest team, because speed sometimes creates chaos, speed sometimes creates challenges. But quick means I'm surgical, I make the right move, I don't get paralysis of analysis, I don't overthink things, I get the data in front of things, I get the data in front of me, I get the information in front of me and then I act. I'm not chaotic. Our business can be very chaotic. We can have an inspection one minute, a closing the next hour, listing, presentation tonight, boom, boom, going a thousand miles an hour, and it can feel very chaotic. So I don't want people to hear us say you need to be fast, you don't need to be fast, you need to be quick, and quick means better at decision-making, more intentional in your activities, better at saying no to things so that you are able to move quickly.
Speaker 1:Our good friend Mark Bardot. I just saw a presentation that Mark did and he had five A's and I'll remember the first two. One was the adaptability to adapt. Number two is agility, and what he said was which really resonated with me is agility is the ability to adapt quickly. It's exactly what you just said. I've got to be agile, which is not fast.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's right, it's interesting. Quick agile and Mark shared the same thing. A couple more questions as you look at 2025, what are some of the things that you're going to do different in your business, Because complacency challenged traditions of the past? What are some things that Mike Staver has thought about in your business that you're either going to do more of, less of start or stop Anything that you want to share?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm going to do better at boundaries. What I realized is we set goals last year for some of the strategy and structure for the business of the strategy and structure for the business and I got a little drunk on the results that we were creating in the practice, in my individual practice in particular. So we set a budget for the number of clients that I would work with in 2024. And we did not adhere to that, like by almost a multiple of two or three, which has put excruciating pressure on me on my calendar. Very, very and this is said with all due humility it is very difficult to find time on my calendar for me. So the first thing I'm going to do is I'm going to get much better at boundaries. You know, focus, gary, is not about the things we decide to say yes to. Focus is about the things we say no to. So I'm going to get better in 2025 at saying no. I'm going to get better in 2025 at building a discipline that trusts the process.
Speaker 2:I watched an interview with Nick Saban, which is hard to do when you're a Florida Gator fan, but I watched it. I love Nick Saban's leadership. I mean he is just brilliant. And he said if you do the right things, the right things will happen, and I love that. You said it earlier. Right, are you executing on the things that you need to execute on to create the outcomes that you want, and so that's one thing I'm going to do.
Speaker 2:The second thing I'm going to do is I'm going to be more intentional about does this serve the ultimate outcome? Does this serve my desire for freedom and my core values? My top two core values are free. My number one value is authenticity. My number two value is freedom Freedom. I've done a lot of things this year that have compromised the freedom value in service of the authenticity value. I'm going to get a lot better at honoring the freedom value. Those are the two big things because I think from that, that's an outcome. Right, I'm going to have more freedom, I'm going to aspire to greater levels of freedom, and whether that means financially, whether that means personally, whether that means time, those are big things, because sometimes success becomes the thing you battle with and it doesn't always end up like the brochure promised. So I think boundaries and discipline are the big things for 2025.
Speaker 1:So I want our listeners to really take note of that. Not necessarily what they are I think they're great but the fact that Mike didn't spout off seven things I think sometimes more is more and I think we have to get out of the more. Mike Staver leadership coach a lot of success, probably a lot of failures that have led to success, because I think we know that's how that journey works. Right. We can all lean in on those things. We wish we had done different, but grow from it, and I just I want everybody to just take note that you know we've been consistent in our recording today and in our interview today. Less is more, that's right.
Speaker 1:And so when I asked Mike Staver about 2025, boundaries and discipline, yeah, and the two most important things for 2025, boundaries and discipline, yeah, and the two most important things for me are authenticity and freedom.
Speaker 1:Ok, so every single day, every single decision, the question becomes are they aligned with these four things? That's right. That's right. And then then discipline to make sure that if I'm compromising my boundaries and I'm lacking discipline, you know, am I able and that's one of the things I thought we might talk about for a minute before we wrap up is, you know kind always say you know, the hardest thing for any one of us in this world to do is hold ourselves accountable by ourself to do what we know we need to do. I know that sounds so basic, but it is hard. And you know, I think, that accountability partners they come in so many shapes and forms. So, before we put a bow on this, mike, spend a minute or two on the importance of accountability Partners. Then I'll ask a couple final questions and you and I will get on with our holiday weekend.
Speaker 2:Great. The accountability is often treated as something angry. We need to be more accountable. We need to have a more accountable organization Like somehow, it seems people seem mad when they talk about it and I think my experience has taught me that all of us need somebody who will speak the truth in love to us. There needs to be an equal measure right of grace and discipline, right Of grace and discipline and we need to be in the presence of people who will speak the truth and love to us. And the way that I have found in my life is the easiest way to do that is to put people or a person in my life who I trust to ask me the questions, to say, hey, you said you were going to get this book done. Let's talk about what's in the way of that book, what has happened with the book, you know, so on and so forth, and it's not always comfortable, but I know, if I trust this person to speak the truth and love to me, that it's going to be meaningful and I'm going to know what's happening.
Speaker 2:I have a coach. I have a fitness and nutrition coach. He could kick my behind. I was on the program. I was doing great. I lost the weight I wanted to lose. I was in really good shape, and then my travel schedule went three weeks in a row. He sends me a video and says hey man, you know I care about you, you know I'm on your team, we need to get back on the horse. And he said here, here, you know I've got your back. And I'm like you're absolutely right. You're absolutely right. And so did I all of a sudden get back in the gym and work out an hour? No, but he's top of mind. You know, I got a text from him yesterday. We're going into the holiday. Let me give you a couple of tips. And so we all need that. When you need a person and we need to meet with them regularly I hold myself accountable. Nobody holds you accountable as well as somebody who can speak the truth and love.
Speaker 1:I think the other thing is I read in the last six months someone recommended replace the word accountability with ownership. As you said, accountability has an anger tone to it. I think people can get confused between a high accountability and micromanagement. I personally believe the highest performers demand accountability. I think it's part of what makes them high performers.
Speaker 2:And anybody who says I don't want to be held accountable, it's probably they perform at that level. But that's probably the greatest. Look at the greatest sports teams, the greatest musicians, the greatest. I think of Sydney Christmas, who she won Britain's Got Talent, and one of the things that she said when she won Britain's Got Talent was she said I'm so glad I won. Why are you so glad you're one? Because now I can afford to hire a vocal coach who I can answer to every day to help me get better. She's got an unbelievable voice, but her whole focus was how do I subject myself to a person who can help me take up my game? You look at champions. I will just tell you. I do a program called what Champions Know and I do another one called Winning is no Accident, and at the top of that pyramid is are you subjecting yourself to the rigor of accountability and discipline?
Speaker 1:Awesome. A couple of final thoughts. Any books on anybody's Christmas list, mike Staver, that you would recommend today as we put a bow no pun intended around?
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a book called the Second Mountain by David Brooks that I love. Sorry, david, but you could probably read the first 100, 125 pages and get all you need. I love David Brooks as an author. I think. I think he writes great books, um, and it talks about we have two mountains in life One is our achievement mountain and one is our purpose mountain. And then most people get lost on the achievement mountain and never make it to the purpose mountain. And you need to. You need to balance that. That's great.
Speaker 2:David also wrote a book and I was just looking for it, um, called, uh, how to deeply know someone. I think is the title. Um, that's a really good, really good um book. I was gonna show you a book that's here in the studio. Um, I, uh, I've read some of it. I haven't read all of it, but I love this. Don't believe everything. You think it's a great quick. Don't believe everything. Unconditional love and creation. If thinking is the root cause of suffering, how do we stop thinking how the human experience is created? The three principles of human experience. I love this quote. If the only thing people learned was not to be afraid of their experiences, that alone would change the world Isn't that awesome. Right, quick read, really simple. You know it's a little new agey, but I think it's a. It's a really great. Those are. Those would be my big ones.
Speaker 1:Awesome, awesome. Well, I'm going to leave one book on my list to add before we say goodbye list to add before we say goodbye, and that is one that I read. I got this day nine years ago, the day before Thanksgiving, from a good friend of mine, dave Sanderson. Dave's been a guest on the podcast a couple of times. Last man off the miracle on the Hudson. He tells that incredible story about Sully and his preparation, and had he not been prepared to manage a glider, it would have never worked. Great story for another day.
Speaker 1:A book written by a gentleman, mike Staber, named Bob Buford, and his book is Halftime. And Bob Buford, I say tragically, lost his only child at age 22 or 24. And he went on to journal the incredible impact of that loss in his life and the journal became a New York Times bestseller. And basically what he talks about, using a sports analogy of halftime, is that every one of us, whether it's 35, 45, 55, 65, you don't have to pick an age is when our life goes from success to significance. And the best teams are what? The teams that go in at halftime and make adjustments, the best teams to define boundaries and discipline right. And so you know, I add that to the list, to the ones you shared.
Speaker 2:I'll pick it up Halftime.
Speaker 1:Halftime. And with that, mike Staver, always a pleasure, great to see you. Happy holidays to you and yours.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:I'll let you and I stay in touch, my friend, thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Matt Take care, Take care buddy.
