#320 Pressure is a Privilege?

Sogand sits down with Sunny Brar to talk about legacy, service, and why making people feel seen can be more valuable than any title. We dig into resilience, mental health tools, and the small daily choices that help us lead by example when life gets heavy. 

• Defining legacy as making people feel seen 
• Seva and the mindset behind Project Love 
• The men’s mental health flowers initiative and why it matters 
• Reframing struggling as normal and learning affect labelling 
• Seeking help, journaling, and building neuroplasticity through words 
• Lessons from sport about loss, growth, and teamwork 
• Brain versus mind, metacognition, and pushing past comfort 
• Gratitude, perspective, and “pressure is privilege” 
• Coping with trauma exposure in first responder roles 
• Transition rituals, movement, sleep, and not taking work home 
• Trying different mental health supports and not giving up when fit is wrong 
• Sunny’s book You Knew This All Along and uncovering wisdom 

Tune in to Wellbeing Wednesdays with Sogand on The Universal Radio Network, 97.9 FM in Edmonton, or globally at www.theuniversalradio.com.

IG: @theuniversalradio

Transcript

Welcome And Meet Sunny Brar

SPEAKER_02 0:07

Welcome back to Turn It Up. This is Sogan. I am excited to share my latest episode with you. Let's get into it! Welcome back to Well Being Wednesdays with Sogan. Today we have a special guest, an extraordinary guest. I guess you're going to take motivation from and take inspiration from. I introduce to you Mr. Sonny Barrar. Hi, Sonny.

SPEAKER_00 0:47

Hi, Sogan. How are you doing today?

SPEAKER_02 0:49

Good, how are you? Thank you for joining me.

SPEAKER_00 0:51

Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_02 0:52

Okay, so I've taken some time to learn about you, but for those who don't know who you are, who is Sonny Barrar behind the medals, behind the accolades, behind the resume? Who are you?

Legacy And Making People Feel Seen

SPEAKER_00 1:04

Yeah, outside of titles, education, um, playing hockey and getting championships and stuff. Outside of that, because all those things collect dust anyways.

SPEAKER_02 1:14

Yeah, humble break.

SPEAKER_00 1:15

Outside of those things, I actually let's talk about legacy.

SPEAKER_02 1:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:20

Um, I would love, if I was to leave Earth tomorrow, I would uh love for people to remember me as someone who made people feel seen, who made people feel like they left better after having interacted with me in one way or another, whether that's one time or unfortunately for other people a thousand times. Um I think it's really important to make people feel seen. I think that's something that's missing in the world.

SPEAKER_01 1:45

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:45

Uh, you know, when you make people feel seen, you make people feel like they matter.

SPEAKER_01 1:49

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:49

And when you make people feel like they matter, you empower people.

SPEAKER_01 1:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:52

And when you empower people, you implore them to, you know, reach within themselves and possibly find the best version of themselves. And whether that's by an interaction that you have with them or I'm a big proponent of leading by example.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:06

Anything that you ask of others, you make sure that you do of yourself. Facts. Right? Don't don't be a hypocrite. So that's how I want people to remember me. I want them to remember me as a person that was a man of his word and someone that always followed through and uh someone that leads the way.

SPEAKER_02 2:24

I like it. Well, you definitely do all the above. And I'm sure for those who've had more than one encounter with you, it's been wonderful. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 2:32

All right, me.

SPEAKER_02 2:33

All right. We're we're gonna have humble breaks here.

SPEAKER_01 2:35

All right.

SPEAKER_02 2:36

You seem really dedicated to serving others. If anybody has just a quick scroll through, which you should look through his socials, there's a lot of serving and giving, and you have something called Project Love.

Seva And The Roots Of Project Love

SPEAKER_02 2:49

What is that? I mean, it's about giving love, but tell us more.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

Yeah, let's uh okay, the serving piece. Yes. Um, that's something that's near and dear to me. Yes. I think uh what is really uh resonant with me is one of the pillars of Siki, Seva. And that goes with me everywhere I go. Seva is selfish service, and uh that's been ingrained within me since I was a kid. And uh my mom is a big part of that. Um, she would always do things for other people without expecting any type of reciprocation. And uh I'm talking like secondary, tertiary levels. Like if someone had a broken arm, she'd be thinking, like, oh, they probably can't cook for the week. I'm gonna make them food for seven days, you know, things like that. And it would just end up at their doorstep. So for me, one is having a good role model like that. And then two, it in how it serves meaning to myself is I'm a big believer in if you have the capacity to help others or the capacity to do anything that is gonna make the world a better place, you should. And frankly, a lot of us have that capacity to do that. And I think that's what separates leaders from followers is uh I think, you know, people like to think of themselves as leaders, but actions speak louder than words, right? If you have the capacity to lead in some way and find a way to help others, you implore others to do the same. You know, for example, what I mean by the leaders and followers thing is let's say that uh I was to start an initiative tomorrow for prostate cancer. I'm raising funds for prostate cancer. I can go out and a lot of people would be willing to give money towards prostate cancer because they recognize the cause. But there aren't enough people doing the first thing, which is creating that program to go and do that, right? So the herd will come, the herd always comes. It's just being the one to actually um take the initiative and implore those thoughts into action. So tying that to Project Love, um the second part that you mentioned, Project Love was an encapsulation of all that. And I think Project Love has been going on since I was a kid. I just finally gave it a name. Um, Project Love specifically started from me holding a sign on a street saying, I have to remember what the first one was. It was uh I held a sign that said, I hope your heart heals from all the things that people didn't apologize for, or all the trauma that nobody apologized for. That's what it was. I hope your heart heals from all the trauma that nobody apologized for. And uh I realized that that just hit with people, right? It connected with people, and things like that gives you a notion of like, you know, there are people out there that are fighting these isolated battles, and they think they may be the only ones that are feeling a certain way, and they realize that maybe I'm not alone in this, and that is an empowerment itself, right? Whether people recognize it or not, that is an empowerment itself. And then Project Love rippled from that into you know, carrying out initiatives where we spoke on mental health events at the university and other venues. Um, specifically, there is something that I do yearly towards men's mental health awareness on June or in June because June is men's mental health awareness month. I find men and I give them flowers.

SPEAKER_02 6:10

Beautiful. They need it. They need it.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

I find men and I give them flowers. Yeah, I'm not getting it. I find men and I give them flowers and I give them a note. And uh there's a symbolism behind it, and I usually give them a statistic. There's a statistic out there that 88% of men don't receive flowers for the first time in their life until their funeral.

SPEAKER_02 6:29

I believe that. And my notion they will done honour let our audience resonate on that. Okay, they don't receive flowers until their funerals.

SPEAKER_00 6:37

88%.

SPEAKER_02 6:39

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 6:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:40

Okay. I I I had to let people marry and all that. Carry on.

SPEAKER_00 6:43

Yeah, absolutely. And there's a symbolism behind that. And to me, it's like, why give them flowers on their funeral then? Right? Why not give them flowers before if it's it's one way or the other, right? And the reason why we give men and women flowers on their funeral is it's a sign of remembrance, it's a sign of love, it's a sign of showcasing what that person meant for you. But however, why do we wait for people's funerals to tell them how much they mean to us? Yeah. To me, that's very paradoxical. Yes, actually. So why not take the opportunity to tell people what they mean to you when they're right here in front of your face in your living form where they can actually interpret what you're saying and it can empower them? You know, any I think all humans look for connection. I think that is a commonality between every single human being is the importance of connection. And reassurance is also something that we all look for. Am I doing the right thing? Are the things that I'm doing providing value? And are they reciprocated? Are they appreciated? And you know, that is a form of reassurance. So that's how the flower piece came to be. And uh project love continues. Anything that I um carry out is geared towards project love. I've started these kind of sunny talk segments where I'm just I'm just thinking things on my way home from work and I'll be like, I'm gonna record it and I'm gonna put that message out in the in the world. And if it resonates with one person, then it's a success. And you know what, Sogan? I didn't expect um the reciprocation from it that I got. Because like I will get messages from people that I have never interacted with. They won't like any of my stuff, they won't comment on any of my stuff, but they'll send me a direct message. Yeah, they'll send me a direct message saying, Wow, your message was so powerful. I thought I was the only one who thought that way. Or you truly put my thoughts into your video, and it makes me feel like I can relate.

SPEAKER_02 8:36

That's how you know you made it.

SPEAKER_00 8:38

Thanks. I appreciate it. And yeah, for me, anything that I do if it resonates with one person, even uh I'm writing a book right now. Uh, if that book even resonates with one person, then I'm calling it a success.

SPEAKER_02 8:50

Well, now you're gonna have to tell us about this book. What is this book? Congratulations. That is a that is a feat.

SPEAKER_00 8:58

Maybe we'll leave the book as a concluding part to the segment. How about that?

SPEAKER_02 9:02

Okay, we could do that. All right. Good boundaries. Okay.

Struggling Is Normal And Naming Feelings

SPEAKER_02 9:05

Um, you spend time speaking in schools, workplaces, athletic communities, mental health initiatives. I'm sure there's more, and I'm not covering them all. If someone listening today feels like they're struggling, they're not seen, uh, but doesn't know where to begin, what would you say? To that person particularly.

SPEAKER_00 9:23

All right, let's talk to the audience. Talk to them. Yeah, for anyone that's out there struggling, first, I think how we label things is very important. Uh note that struggling is not a weakness. Struggling is a normal part of life. Struggling is a trade-off that we get for being given life.

SPEAKER_01 9:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:41

We are given life as a privilege.

SPEAKER_01 9:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:43

To be able to live is a privilege, and suffering is a part of life. That's something that we need to accept, truthfully. You know, uh, there are me, there are gonna be times when you have good things going for you in life, and you should try to make the most of it. And that's why I implore being present, you know. Like if I'm having dinner with you, my phone's not on the table. You're you want to try to aim to be present for anyone that you're exchanging energy with, because that exchange of energy is also a privilege from the individual giving it back, right? And you're gonna inevitably suffer. So recognize it that suffering is a normal part of life. However, for anyone that is struggling, uh, I think one thing that uh society as a whole we have difficulty with is uh it's called affect labeling. It's when we're we aren't able to label the emotions that we're feeling. If you can label the emotion that you're feeling, you're already halfway there, right? Um, there's actually a term, it's uh the abbreviation is anime. It's uh normal male lexithymia. And it talks about how especially boys who grow up into men, they are never taught how to label any of these emotions. So I may be feeling a certain way, and I may be told, all right, I need to be tough. I do believe that people should be tough. I do believe in that, but I think it's injustice to expect a person to be at Z when we haven't given them the foundations of A, B, C, D, E all the way up to Z, right? How do we expect someone to be at Z when they don't understand how to get there? Right? It's just as simple as, oh, be tough. Well, you're gonna feel some things along the way of being tough, right? And how do how do I know what being tough is if I don't know what the other side is? How do I know what heads look like if I don't if all I've seen is tails? Yeah, right. Um, so that's that's one piece there and reach out. You know, I myself, this is psychology and everything is things that I've have I have worked on my education in a long time, right? I've worked on educating myself for a long time, and even I have sought help because there's a difference between looking at things from a logical level and an emotional level, right? It's a logic and emotion are like a tipping scale. When one outweighs the other, like when you have emotion being that heavy, your logic is thrown out the window. That's why so many times we'll be like, I can't believe that person's in that relationship. Like it is so unhealthy for them. Well, they're probably more emotionally driven, and their logic was thrown out the window like a month ago.

SPEAKER_02 12:19

The prefrontal cortex is shut off.

SPEAKER_00 12:21

Yeah, the prefrontal cortex is gone.

SPEAKER_02 12:23

There is a reason why. I'm sorry I have to say, there's a reason why they say love is a drug because it is.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Oh, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 12:28

Yeah, that oxytocin, those hormones, yeah, yeah, it shuts things off. Yeah, that's why it feels good.

SPEAKER_00 12:33

Love can be absolutely beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 12:35

Can be.

SPEAKER_00 12:36

That's what makes it beautiful, yeah, but it can also be quite dangerous. And uh trying to define the lines between is really important. But uh yeah, to anyone that's struggling, um seek help. There's also a notion of being able to articulate your thoughts into words. Yes, and uh that uh ties into neuroplasticity, yeah, right?

SPEAKER_02 12:58

Where you rein-oh, our audience knows about neuroplasticity, but give them more, Sonny.

SPEAKER_00 13:02

Let's go. Yeah, neuroplasticity is when you reinforce those neurons and those synapses. Yeah, and uh articulating your thoughts into into words, whether through writing or verbalization, that's why journaling is also important too. Um helps read. Yeah, absolutely. Um I don't know if my journal looks that great, but it says pretty little thoughts.

SPEAKER_02 13:23

I thought it was fitting for what we have going on.

SPEAKER_00 13:25

Let go. Um, yeah, aim to seek help. And as well as people think that to be a good therapist, you have to be like a licensed person or you need to have some sort of accreditation. Sometimes the best therapist is just being someone that is gonna be willing to sit there and listen.

SPEAKER_01 13:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:42

And let someone feel like they're being seen.

SPEAKER_01 13:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:45

Feel like they're being heard, back to empowerment. We're gonna make um empowerment the theme here today.

SPEAKER_02 13:50

I like that. Yeah. I mean, as somebody who has gone through the Masters of Accounsing program and has gone through all of that, there is so much emphasis on holding space, uh, unconditional positive regard. And it's true that a lot of times you hear these athletes yourself probably, they see that in perhaps a coach, uh, whether it's like uh a coach of um mental health nature or a coach of a sports nature, or they will get that from a mentor, or they will get that from perhaps somebody who is like um somebody who's respected in the community. So I see where you're going with that. It's it's holding space, making people feel seen, and credentials help, but they're not always everything, especially for a lot of these things that are so hidden that you gotta fish for them out, you know?

SPEAKER_00 14:40

Absolutely. Sometimes it just takes a good friend that is gonna be willing to uh give you an year.

SPEAKER_02 14:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:45

And you feel so much better. That's why sometimes a venting session feels so good.

SPEAKER_02 14:49

It does, right? It does, yeah. So vent, don't keep it in.

SPEAKER_00 14:52

Absolutely. The more you keep it in, it's like a taking time bone. Absolutely. Find ways to get it out. Uh otherwise it's gonna continue to um go down uh a hill that you don't want. Facts, right?

SPEAKER_02 15:04

Good answer, good answer. Okay, wow, wow, wow. Okay. You have represented more humble brags, okay? Canada and India internationally in ball hockey competed at world championships and world cups, won multiple national championships with your Edmonton team.

What Sport Teaches About Losing

SPEAKER_02 15:24

What has sport taught you about life? Because you're obviously very involved and athletically built.

SPEAKER_00 15:31

That's subjective. Um, but yeah, to answer your question, I think sports has shaped me uh mostly into who I am, truthfully. There is such a beautiful thing about sports. One is, you know, growing up as an adolescent and teen, um, there was obviously a lot of like drugs and alcohol going on around me. It kept me away from all that stuff.

SPEAKER_01 15:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 15:54

Um, because I saw how competitive some of these things could be.

SPEAKER_01 15:58

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 15:58

And some of the things that you could attain. And uh, I remember uh running was always a nice outlet for me. It still is a beautiful outlet for me because I am an introvert by nature. And uh yeah, it's that always seems to surprise people.

SPEAKER_02 16:14

But uh just personable, and I think people have an idea that introverts they are personable, but they are selective with who they're personable with. They they don't share their energy with everybody. I think that's what it is.

SPEAKER_00 16:26

Absolutely. It makes your energy more quality for the ones that you do share with. And um people have this notion that introverts are shy people. That's not the case. Like, I'm not a shy person. I'm gonna speak up if I see something happening that needs to be spoken up about. It's just about how you gain your energy, right? I gain my energy by by doing my my me stuff. Yeah. So that I could be the best version of myself for the rest of the world. Um, sports, I think is a beautiful thing, and I recommend parents put your kids into sports. You learn so many beautiful things through sports, you know, how to win, how to be a good winner. But I actually think that you learn more in losing. You learn more in losing because you know, when you're when you're winning, it's the notion that, all right, everything is going right, let's keep reinforcing um what we're doing, which is beautiful in itself. But losing, whether it's in sports or in life, forces you to take a look with the deeper lens and and see, you know, what type of corrective actions can we do here to get better. And um I think that's a beautiful thing in itself because it promotes growth, right? Uh, both internally and externally. And and learning how to take a loss in life, in sports, um, learning how to be a good team player, right? Learning how to navigate through challenges together as a team, uh, that translates to the workforce, right? And um, just competing at the highest levels, there's a there's a notion to that of like, all right, we we're playing against the best of the best. And uh to have to elevate yourself to that level, I find that when you are forced in situations like that, you become a better version of yourself in everything that you do. That's why I'm a proponent of I promote people to do difficult things, do things that you know are difficult to do. Uh, I was on a radio show talking about uh I climbed Mount Kilimanjaro in Africa, and uh one of the things that I got from that was someone said, What was the biggest takeaway for you? Uh, how did it feel when you summit at the top of the mountain? Like, was it pure euphoria? And I was like, honestly, it wasn't. I said it was the top of a really large hill, and you see a beautiful view, and then a few minutes later you're on your way down, and that's it, right? But it's actually the journey in getting there that makes it beautiful. Uh, the journey and getting there and uh the preparation that you do, and uh do those difficult things because you unlock different levels in your mind.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

Let's talk about uh sorry, I feel like I'm go tangential here, but go. I'm very passionate about this. Yeah, keep going. Um, let's talk about the separation between the brain and the mind.

Brain Versus Mind And Comfort Traps

SPEAKER_01 19:06

Let's.

SPEAKER_00 19:06

I I like I like separating the brain and the mind. I think of when I think of the brain, you know, your brain is think of your brain as like um a hard drive from when you were born. Can I swear? No, that stuff's outdated. That stuff's outdated, all right? Think of your brain as an as an internal hard drive, and uh that stuff's outdated, and your brain is wired to bring you to a level of homeostasis and comfort in all of your facets of life. Yes, the separation there is your brain is your unconscious and subconscious. I like to think of your mind as your conscious. Your mind, you need to convince your brain of all right, that stuff's outdated, let's grow, let's move on to bigger, better things. That's why doing difficult things like climbing on the world's highest mountains is something you should do. Because you unlock new thresholds for your brain to be like, oh yeah, you know what? Maybe we can do this. And that translates to everything else. You know, one of my biggest reasons for success in life or uh perceived success is uh actually due largely to running. And I've run my whole life, and I was like, okay, I'm gonna do 5K in a few months. A few months, I'm gonna jump up to 10K, then I'm gonna do 21K, then I'm gonna do a marathon, right? And that translates into the workforce because you realize like it all starts here. Everything starts in your mind, and your brain and your mind are constantly battling each other. I think of the mind as like the lawyer for your brain, the lawyer against your brain. And there's a space between this called metacognition, and metacognition is being able to consciously ask yourself questions of like, all right, is what I'm feeling really true here? Like, what is the evidence that supports what you're telling me here? Like, be willing to have those type of conversations with yourself because many times it's like if you can't point out anything objectively as to why you can't do something, then you could probably do it, right? It's just your brain trying to bring you back to this level of comfort. Did you watch the Odyssey?

SPEAKER_02 21:14

No, but I've heard of it.

SPEAKER_00 21:16

Okay, I don't actually watch a lot of movies, but I love any of Christopher Nolan's movies. So the Odyssey, let's talk about the Odyssey quickly because it's irrelevant.

SPEAKER_02 21:24

Go right now, you can take this wherever you want.

SPEAKER_00 21:28

The Odyssey, the Odyssey shares so many beautiful life lessons. Okay, and one of those is actually the um the perils of being in comfort. Okay. The bad thing about being too comfortable is is a double edged sword.

SPEAKER_02 21:44

I actually had a question about this, so keep going. Because you do talk about that, like you should experience hardship and struggle and keep going.

SPEAKER_00 21:52

Yeah, and put yourself in situations where you can and then navigate yourself out of it. But yeah, in the Odyssey, so it's by it's Homer's Odyssey. Um There's a man who goes out, he fights a war, and his name is Odysseus, and then he gets kind of entrapped in a place of comfort by someone named Calypso, a female named Calypso, and she provides him like the life of paradise. And then he's stuck stuck with her in comfort, in the life of paradise for seven years, I think it is, and he he doesn't come back to his family, right?

SPEAKER_01 22:24

I see.

SPEAKER_00 22:25

And the the lesson there is when you get too comfortable, you're not gonna grow, right? And that translates to our life as well. Try not to get too comfortable with things, try to keep yourself pushing and try to keep learning and growing. Because the moment you get comfortable, then you hardwire yourself back to that original brain that you had, right? And our brain is wired for comfort, our brain is wired for homeostasis, right? Our brain doesn't want, our brain is afraid of doing things that are out of the norm. Yes. That's why it's up to our brains, our minds, to push against the brain and be like, I'm gonna do this and I'm gonna show you that we got a whole nother level to this, but and the thing with uh our I would say Western civilization, like North American, is we live pretty sedentary lifestyles. We do. We truly don't have appreciation for um the human body mentally and physically until we do difficult things. And that's going out there and doing those difficult things. And that's why, like, I implore someone sign up for a marathon, sign up for a half marathon, or do something outrageous that seems outrageous to you and just wing it and just see how it is for you. At least you'll come out of it a better person and you'll actually come out more motivated, truthfully.

SPEAKER_02 23:37

Yeah, I know you're a fan of Dr. Andrew Huberman, as I we've referenced him many times on the podcast.

SPEAKER_01 23:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:43

And we um have talked about and he's talked about how when you do hard things and you stretch that comfort, it actually your brain will reward you in time because it you can't replace fear circuits, but what you can do is do things that are hard. And then that malienation and just doing it more and more with neuroplasticity is going to reward you towards more hard things that were once like, whoa, so scary.

SPEAKER_00 24:12

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 24:12

So I agree.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

Myelination.

SPEAKER_02 24:14

Speaking of myelination, you often incorporate psychology into your work as we just did

Resilience Through Gratitude And Perspective

SPEAKER_02 24:19

right now.

SPEAKER_00 24:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:20

Um, so I want to go back to that resilience and that struggling piece because I think it's really important. Uh, the reality is a lot of people are struggling. Yeah. And it's not always just mental, it's also psychosocial. There are real things happening in the world where people feel helpless. Right. There, you know, I saw a CBC report of just how many people are living below the poverty line when it comes to feeding their families. Like there are real things happening. Yeah. And it's important to hold space for that. So tell me about that resilience. What does resilience actually look like for you? Because I know you grew up, you weren't always who you are right now. There were some really tough periods in your childhood. What kept you going? What is resilience to you? I guess those are two different questions, but go for it.

SPEAKER_00 25:06

No, absolutely. I think that's great you brought that up. I think uh when people think of resilience, it's understood. They think that uh to be resilient is to, you know, not be overwhelmed, not have fears, not have worries. No, resilience is actually still feeling and having those things, yeah, but knowing that you have the willpower to walk through it. Resilience is understanding that there is a storm and and weathering the storm. Whereas I think most people's uh concept of resilience is, oh, there's no storm. I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna go through it.

SPEAKER_01 25:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:39

Right? I'm just gonna do this, which is also a good attitude to have sometimes too. But it's also important to be realistic that whatever I'm navigating here, there's gonna be friction and recognizing that there's gonna be friction and I'm still gonna push through it. I'm gonna take it as it comes and still push through it. That to me is resilience. And resilience is uh usually um defined by practical events or things that have happened in actuality for you to truly understand it. But it's important to employ yourself with the tools to try to be resilient when that friction does indeed come. You mentioned uh the psychosocial piece and like world events and stuff. I think that is first of all, that takes a conscious effort to do. And I think that is also really important because when I think of my foundation, my foundation is built off of gratitude and perspective. And uh I see how much other people have in the world compared to me, and and sometimes it's like, am I even deserving? And I am deserving. You're very the thing is you wish that those people could deserve it too. You wish that those people could attain it too, and just having that outlook of like the only difference between me and you know, some of the people that I've met in Tanzania, Africa, who are some of those tour guides are like some of the absolute physical beasts I've ever met, some of the most absolute physical beasts that I've ever met. They're hauling up and down these mountains like it's nothing. They do this like on a weekly basis, right? And they're living well below the poverty line. And the only difference between me and some of those people who are probably a lot more capable in a lot of the things that I do than I am, is the fact that they were born there. And that's it. That's the only difference. But yeah, that's the only difference. So it's important to have that sense of gratitude and perspective when you're walking and navigating through life. And that's why it's important to be conscious of you know what we complain about. It's in it's it's uh inevitable. We are gonna complain about some of the things that happen to us here and there, but try to carry it out, carry out um that peace with uh I would say a higher lens. Um we're very gracious in what we have and the opportunities that we're provided here. People would kill to have the lives that we live here. The fact that we have freedom of choice to do what we want on a daily basis, the fact that we have freedom of choice to become whatever we want, you know, there are a lot of capable people out there who just don't have the resources, as you mentioned. And um I think that ties into the resilience piece too, is having that sense of gratitude and perspective and just being like, you know, anything that comes my way, I should look at it as an opportunity, right? Pressure is privilege. Um to have pressure is a privilege.

SPEAKER_01 28:32

Yeah, I think that's what we're gonna call this segment.

SPEAKER_00 28:34

Pressure is privilege. Let's go. I like that. Yeah, prep pressure is privilege because you know, anything that you're feeling pressures towards, you know, if I was feeling nervous coming into this podcast and chatting with you, my friend, it's uh should be taken as a privilege because um all of these are opportunities that people would probably kill for. Yeah, even something as simple as coming and having a conversation in a podcast, two people connecting with uh the fam in the back. Let's go.

SPEAKER_02 29:02

Yes, let's go. That's her and fam shout out. Yeah, okay, all right, switching gears a little bit.

Trauma Work And Transition Rituals

SPEAKER_02 29:09

I just want people to know how cool you are outside of this. You've also worked as an emergency responder and alongside emergency response teams and high-risk industries as firefighters, paradigm, paramedics, and other first responders, where people regularly witness so much trauma.

SPEAKER_00 29:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:28

How do you think people can cope with difficult experiences, whether you're in those industries listening to this or not? What does self-care look like then? How do you not take it home, I guess?

SPEAKER_00 29:39

Absolutely. So, first I want to acknowledge um, you know, police officers, people in the military, firefighters, paramedics, they and everyone else that is uh related, they see their professions require them to see uh humanity usually at its um lowest. Lowest, right? And that is a difficult thing. It comes with the cost, right? Yeah, it comes with the cost, and it can come either through secondary trauma or uh things called uh compassion fatigue, right? Where you're just overstimulated with emotion. You're a human being, you're a human being first, and you're gonna have emotion when you turn up to events where uh peculiar things have happened, yeah, to put it lightly. And um some coping mechanisms for that is one is seek pure support before you feel impacted, see what those um services have to offer that that your agencies have, and try to aim to have a proactive uh approach to building resilience, yes, right? To building resilience to your mental health. You know, we we often uh I want to tie this back to your question about uh what would you say to someone who's struggling? Think about when you have an physical injury. If I have a knee injury, I'm gonna go get some rehab, I'm gonna get some physio, I'm gonna go to the doctor, and I'm gonna be like, hey doc, what's up with my knee? Like, help me get back to hockey, right? Mental health should be looked at the same way. Is if you feel like you're starting to veer a certain way, or you're proactive, you're physically we're proactive by going to the gym and trying to build strength, or if you're proactive in your mental health and try to build yourself with these tools and resources, then you're able to cope with it and build that resilient sense of self when it does indeed come. Um, there's these uh things called transition rituals as well. It's uh a transition ritual is when you can subconsciously wire your brain to separate home from work. So a transition ritual would be like anytime I'm out of uniform, I remind myself, all right, I am now civilian sunny, and I'm gonna go home to my beautiful family and I'm gonna go live the life that I deserve to live, regardless of what just happened at work, right? Um, or I'm gonna have a select playlist when I go home that reminds me of me. This is who I am, right? Because usually when you're in those professions, you're sometimes required to be like a robot, right? You have to be an autopilot for something. Yeah, especially when you're responding to very difficult situations. Um not only are you a robot for yourself, but you're a robot for the people that may be impacted by someone's death. You might end up being their crutch, you're their sense of strength. And if uh you show up and you show up as an emotional wreck, well, that's probably gonna translate and ripple. Because usually a lot of the times you're the superhero at this scene, right? And uh especially when someone has lost a loved one and stuff, that is that can be a very difficult scene to show up to. Yeah. Right. I have a friend, and if he's watching this, he'll reference this because we chatted about this literally like just weeks ago at the world championships, and he said, you know, I'm expected to show up to work, and if and the example he provided was I have seen someone that uh had committed suicide, and an hour later I'm showing up home kissing my wife, pillow, and and my child, and they're asking me how my day was, you know, like that is two extremes, right? And uh the expectation there is to show up at home and be a father because that's his second role, right? That's his other role. So um employing in these tactics and and these notions of support programs, transition rituals, also exercise is actually so important. And the reason why it's so important is it helps with cortisol regulation, helps battle that anxiety and depression. You know, my personal example, actually, a time when I went through a really tough battle with mental health, it was actually exercise that brought me back.

SPEAKER_01 33:43

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 33:44

And the reason why exercise brought me back was it reminded me of my capabilities. And that empowered me from within and then allowed me to become the best version of myself. But it was actually exercise more than anything, along with family support that brought me back to where I wanted to be and even stronger. And it's because it reminded me of my capabilities. So not only is it the hormonal piece and the chemical and biological piece, but it also just gives you a notion of like, you know, lifting heavy weights and stuff. It is good to do because again, it's building resilience, right? That resistance, it builds resilience and it reminds you, it reminded me of like my capabilities and what I can do.

SPEAKER_02 34:25

Yeah. Yeah. I was actually looking at neuroscience of this, and there are particular times where I like to call it movement of body because there's so many different things that work for people, whether it's Pilates right now, there's a surgeons of Pilates, I like weightlifting, yeah, you like running, just movement and just different kinds of movement, and it has a different toll on you at different times of the day. So if you're not feeling great after you do it during the morning, maybe do it later in the afternoon. Some people do it right before they sleep, and then they take a shower to like relax their body, and then they have the best sleep of their life. So, yes, definitely there's research on the impact of movement and uh building resilience that way. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 35:08

Wonderful. Yeah, movement is so important and just even getting a sweat is a natural form of detoxification. Facts, yes, and it helps you sleep better.

SPEAKER_02 35:17

It does.

SPEAKER_00 35:17

Yeah, and sleep is one of those coping mechanisms to try to find good ways to go to sleep. Yes. And um, you know, at the same time, let's say that you are being impacted um traumatically by the events that you're showing up to uh in one of these professions, yeah. Um, try to have a conversation about it. Maybe you could be deployed somewhere else for time being, etc. I know people that have done that too, right? Yeah. Try not to hold it within and and you know, back to this notion of being tough. Yeah, be tough, but it takes a lot to get there, right? Yeah. And and being tough is a subjective definition. Yes. You know, yeah, you know, for anyone that feels like they're not at a level that they want to be, who thinks that it's weak to speak up, it's the exact opposite. It's actually a sign of courage. Yes. It shows that, yeah, it shows that I'm recognizing that I'm not where I want to be, but I know that I can be here. Yeah that is an act of courage and it's and and it takes a conscious effort to be able to employ that within yourself.

SPEAKER_02 36:20

Yeah, it's uh it's not easy, yeah, actually. It's quite tough to speak

Finding Mental Health Support That Fits

SPEAKER_02 36:24

up. Yeah. And I just want to say not all mental health professionals are the same. And we live in a really cool time, interesting time with AI and uh, you know, artificial intelligence, but cool time that there's a plethora of resources, right? Yeah. So if you've tried therapy, it doesn't work for you, there's coaching. If you tried that hasn't worked for you, there's different kinds of therapies now with uh psychedelic drugs that are legal, you know, for people who've experienced a lot of trauma. There's research now that's being done on that. Yeah. There is um natural path things that people do. There's sound bats, there's Reiki, there's energy healing. So if one doesn't work for you, don't give up. I think there's there's a lot of stigma because people will try it and it doesn't work for them because the practitioner doesn't vibe with them. Yeah. Or the way the practitioners maybe they work together and one outgrows the other and it just is not working. That's okay. That's totally fine. There's a lot of people doing a lot of really cool and a lot of out-of-box things when it comes to mental health. Yeah. So don't give up, right? I think it's quite tough to shop around, you know, and if this one doesn't work, try something else. If that doesn't work, try something else. Look at Groupon. There's always free or like cheaper trials. I have found some incredible practitioners doing really out of the box things on Groupon, which I would have never done because I would have never wanted to pay the full price to try something new.

SPEAKER_01 37:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:48

But or sometimes I just wrapped up a promo that I had, for example, for mental health coaching. So just like be cognizant and look around. Don't give up. If it doesn't work for somebody, don't shut it down. I guess is what I'm trying to say. Because that is also resilience to me, is figuring out, okay, this this way that this person is, it just doesn't work with me and that's okay.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:10

I think oftentimes people will tap into those resources.

SPEAKER_01 38:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:13

And they'll be like, that practitioner doesn't get me. It doesn't make me feel make me feel seen or whatever. And then they just give up. Yeah. Don't give up.

unknown 38:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 38:21

Absolutely. That's so powerful. Um, so again. Oh, good. Okay. I just want to reinforce uh that piece that one, first of all, I wouldn't have thought to look on Groupon.

SPEAKER_02 38:30

So look at Groupon. It's very interesting. And Eventbrite also has like interesting meetups where people do like breathwork exercises sometimes for free.

SPEAKER_01 38:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:41

And it's there's so much stigmas in different like pockets of our population.

SPEAKER_01 38:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:46

You gotta find what works for you and just go to it. So yeah, I that's also out of the box, right? Group on Eventbrite, yeah, people's bios, people sometimes have random promotions going on. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:59

Yeah, something that uh you said that resonated with me is don't give up. Yes. You know, many times it can be like, uh if if this practitioner can't help me, who's gonna help me?

SPEAKER_02 39:07

Who's gonna help me? It might be it must be. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 39:10

It must be me. It's so easy to bring it upon yourself. Yes. But give yourself the grace to try it with different people or through different uh media. Yes. Right. Through different um uh outlets, and and you may find that it might be the exact opposite. Something might work out for you way better than you may have thought it was going to be. But just give yourself the grace and the opportunity to at least see rather than assume.

SPEAKER_02 39:34

Yeah. Right. And like someone like again, Andrew Huberman, like he started off being a scientist and now he has this podcast. You should check it out because he has like three-hour lectures on how you can improve your sleep. Yeah, from the lighting that you take in to snoring, to like the environment of your room. And what I appreciate about him and people like him is they recognize that they're listeners, as what I try to do with our podcast, is our listeners come from different walks of life and they have access to different resources. You want to make it so there's options. Right. So whoever you're working with, whoever the practitioners makes you feel like there is an option, it's not that you're at fault or they're at fault, it's just not a good click. And the cool thing about the world right now, and that we're all so connected, is there's other ways to click with people, right? Yeah.

The Book You Knew This All Along

SPEAKER_02 40:24

Okay. Absolutely. All right, before we wrap up, I I want to get back to that book. Okay. Um, you've titled it You Knew This All Along.

SPEAKER_00 40:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:33

What can readers expect from it? What do we know all along?

SPEAKER_00 40:36

Oh, this is the book teaser, right?

SPEAKER_02 40:38

Tell me, tell me.

SPEAKER_00 40:40

Uh, you knew this all along, ties into the notion that from a holistic level, okay, we think of wisdom as something that we gain.

SPEAKER_01 40:48

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 40:49

But I look at it differently. I think of wisdom as something that we uncover.

SPEAKER_01 40:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 40:53

That the wisdom is already there. Yeah. It's just going through and blocking out all this noise of like fear, um, comparison, social comparisons, and social media has a big part to do with that. And just um peeling back these layers of finding the ultimate version of yourself.

SPEAKER_01 41:12

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 41:13

That to me is what wisdom is. Is we already have the wisdom. It's just tapping into yourself. Yes. And you know, people like David Goggins really preached this. He says we only use 40% of our brain. And and uh tapping into yourself and really recognizing your capabilities from a physical, physiological, um, emotional, spiritual, and mental level. Yeah, right. And I also speak in it about uh intuition. Yeah. How your intuition is there for a reason. You know, when you have that really bad gut feeling about something and and you go ahead with it anyways, and then later down the road, you realize, oh, that was that was my gut telling me, you know, your intuition is such a strong thing, and it's there for a reason. It's usually subconsciously and and unconsciously driven, that is where your brain is good for. Yeah, you know, we talked about the battle between the mind and the brain. That is where your brain is good for. Is it has these like memories or or experiences that you may have repressed or suppressed, maybe they're traumatic responses, yeah, right? And uh, usually your brain is the driver for that. And the difference between intuition and impulse, you know, let's say that you give me some alarming news and uh I respond, and I think that that first response is my intuition speaking. Many times that is not my intuition, that's just me giving an impulsive response. Yes, right? So separation between intuition and and impulse. And you know, while writing it, that there's this metaphor that I like to refer to, and it's uh, you know, Michelangelo's sculpture of David.

SPEAKER_01 42:47

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 42:47

So uh people would ask him, How did you create David? It's so beautiful. He goes, I don't, I didn't create David, I just removed everything that now is David. Oh, I removed the layers, you know, I removed the pieces of the stones that now stands David. Wow. And now David is this beautiful, okay, mesmerized uh structure and sculpture, right? So I peeled back the layers, and now what you see is David. Yeah, so I didn't create David, I just allowed you to see who he is by removing everything that he's known. So that's what that's what you uh knew this all along. Beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 43:25

When can we expect it?

SPEAKER_00 43:28

I would say I'm about 80% done.

SPEAKER_02 43:30

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 43:31

So my goal is to launch it sometime this year. Okay, and yeah, if it even resonates with one human being, I call it a success.

SPEAKER_02 43:38

I like that. Yeah, I like that.

SPEAKER_00 43:40

No expectations. The moment you create expectations, you create disappointment. So if you have no expectations, then you can't be disappointed.

SPEAKER_02 43:47

Facts. And I I like bringing the bar to just one person, yeah, because then, you know, yes, pressure is good, but we have to be also realistic in this world that we are in. There's something called competition, there's a lot of people with books, you know? Yeah. So I like that. I like that it's always if one person can benefit, because we know one person can, for sure. Yeah, I could already guarantee that.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

Let's go.

SPEAKER_02 44:09

Let's go. Then it's a success.

SPEAKER_01 44:11

Yes, yeah, absolutely.

Lead By Example And Final Takeaways

SPEAKER_02 44:13

Anything that we didn't cover in our conversation today that you would like to share?

SPEAKER_00 44:17

Uh something that uh comes to mind. Um be the change you wish to see in the world. You know, it's so easy to complain about how the world ought to be, but it's harder to actually do something about it. Right? It is so easy to complain about things that you have no involvement in, but get yourself involved instead of being the person who sits there complaining about how the world should be, lead by example, and along the way, you liberate others to do the same, right? Um the first question that you asked me was um something geared towards how would I like to be remembered, or at least that's how I turned it into.

SPEAKER_02 44:58

Yeah, was who are you outside of the accolades and the resumes? But yes.

SPEAKER_00 45:02

Let's finish this with the with the quote that I like. Kamaya Angelou.

SPEAKER_02 45:05

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 45:05

She said, uh, people will forget what you said, people forget what you did, but they'll never forget how you made them feel. Yeah, exactly. So make people feel empowered and and you know, in being yourself and going out and leading certain initiatives and everything, you may be liberating others to do the same. And that is your mark on the world. That's the ripple effect.

unknown 45:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:25

The ripple effect is gonna be the name of my second book, by the way.

SPEAKER_02 45:28

I love it. We're already getting his part two t art. Let's go. Let's go. Thank you so much for sharing your light with us. Yeah. In the beginning, I said that we are gonna be motivated and inspired, and I think it lived up to it. Thank you so much for being here and turning it up with us.

SPEAKER_00 45:44

No, thanks for having me, and uh love turning it up with you. So hey, let's do it again.

SPEAKER_02 45:49

Let's do it again. Catch you next time.

SPEAKER_00 45:50

Cheers.

Closing And Staying Connected

SPEAKER_02 46:04

Make sure you stay connected with us across socials at the Universal Radio.