On this episode of the "All Things Fitness and Wellness (ATFW)" podcast, hosted by Krissy Vann, we're thrilled to have Desiree Guilliard-Young join us. As the former owner/operator and COO/CHRO of Sanctuary Fitness, Desiree is a beacon of leadership and innovation in the fitness industry. With over a decade of experience in client engagement, strategy, and business development, her journey is nothing short of inspiring.
In this episode, Desiree delves into her personal journey within the fitness world, sharing invaluable insights that propelled her from an industry novice to a formidable leader. She opens up about the hurdles and triumphs she encountered along the way and the pivotal moments that defined her career.
Desiree emphasizes the critical role of diversity of thought in driving innovation, arguing that a blend of perspectives is essential for breaking new ground. She also discusses the strategies she's employed to cultivate a strong company culture that values every employee, from L1 to L5, as integral to success.
Furthermore, Desiree speaks to the heart of leadership—mentorship. She shares her dos and don'ts, highlighting how effective mentorship can shape careers and foster environments where everyone thrives.
Most excitingly, Desiree introduces us to Femme Consulting Corp., her latest venture designed to revolutionize the fitness industry by prioritizing strategic solutions and emphasizing the value of human capital.
Join us as Desiree Guilliard-Young offers a masterclass on leadership, innovation, and the power of a supportive company culture. Whether you're a budding entrepreneur, a fitness enthusiast, or someone passionate about wellness, this episode of ATFW is a treasure trove of wisdom and motivation.
Tune in now to hear Desiree's incredible journey and learn how to leverage diversity, culture, and mentorship to transform any business into a powerhouse of innovation and success.
Available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get your podcasts. Don't forget to subscribe to ATFW for more episodes like this!
On this episode of the "All Things Fitness and Wellness (ATFW)" podcast, hosted by Krissy Vann, we're thrilled to have Desiree Guilliard-Young join us. As the former owner/operator and COO/CHRO of Sanctuary Fitness, Desiree is a beacon of leadership and innovation in the fitness industry. With over a decade of experience in client engagement, strategy, and business development, her journey is nothing short of inspiring.
In this episode, Desiree delves into her personal journey within the fitness world, sharing invaluable insights that propelled her from an industry novice to a formidable leader. She opens up about the hurdles and triumphs she encountered along the way and the pivotal moments that defined her career.
Desiree emphasizes the critical role of diversity of thought in driving innovation, arguing that a blend of perspectives is essential for breaking new ground. She also discusses the strategies she's employed to cultivate a strong company culture that values every employee, from L1 to L5, as integral to success.
Furthermore, Desiree speaks to the heart of leadership—mentorship. She shares her dos and don'ts, highlighting how effective mentorship can shape careers and foster environments where everyone thrives.
Most excitingly, Desiree introduces us to Femme Consulting Corp., her latest venture designed to revolutionize the fitness industry by prioritizing strategic solutions and emphasizing the value of human capital.
Join us as Desiree Guilliard-Young offers a masterclass on leadership, innovation, and the power of a supportive company culture. Whether you're a budding entrepreneur, a fitness enthusiast, or someone passionate about wellness, this episode of ATFW is a treasure trove of wisdom and motivation.
Tune in now to hear Desiree's incredible journey and learn how to leverage diversity, culture, and mentorship to transform any business into a powerhouse of innovation and success.
Available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get your podcasts. Don't forget to subscribe to ATFW for more episodes like this!
I think your next untapped revenue stream or big idea comes in that space of diversity of thought. That's where great ideas are born. And it's easy to talk about that it's super difficult to actually put together the infrastructure of the space to create that to foster it. This is all things fitness and wellness posted by Krissy Vann together we're uniting industry thought leaders and fit fluence errs on the mission to inspire innovation and encourage people to live a life fit and well on today's episode we welcome Deseret Gilly yard young does Deseret has been a lifelong athlete. And after spending years in the corporate world, she made the leap into the fitness industry. As studios grappled during COVID She was stepping into leadership at sanctuary fitness in Los Angeles. After successfully exiting the business last May Deseret was ready to embrace a challenge she had felt drawn to for years, the launch of FEM consulting. Not only will we learn about Deseret story, but this episode is jam packed with expert insights on cultivating a strong company culture, leadership styles, diversity of thought for innovation, and the do's and don'ts of mentorship. Before we get to it, be sure to hit like and subscribe. We have new podcast episodes every Wednesday featuring industry thought leaders and influencers. I'm your host, Krissy Vann and this is ATF W. Well, I am thrilled to have Deseret joining me today and Deseret. The last time that I saw you was at Ursa now health and fitness Association, and you were one of the thought leaders that was taking part in the women's panel. And I have to commend you, because your responses, were so thoughtful and resonated to such a strong degree with the audience. So thank you for spending the time with me here on all things fitness and wellness. No, absolutely. It's an honor and pleasure to be here. Krissy. I've been looking forward to this for gosh, since we did the forum, the DC last year. So very excited to have an opportunity to be on your platform, and very much looking forward to us chatting with old girlfriends. Well, and on top of that, why am extra happy to have you is because what listeners may not realize is that you have been in the thick of this incredible life transition. So before we even dive into the history of your story, tell me about them consulting Corp, what is it? And why did you bring it to life, I feel like the greatest opportunities or ideas come from stressful situations for necessity. And so if I think about my journey to consulting, it was a long one. As you know, my background is in corporate, I spent 12 years in the corporate space working for various fortune 100 companies, at&t ADP, the list goes on. And so I would say the first nudge happened around the time that I was in grad school. So would have been 2017 2018 had this idea, I knew I would go to personal resource for a lot of people in my cohort that were looking for career advice, or how to manage complex workforce or employees situations, being able to manage certain challenges that they were having with their business and certain departments their job search process. And I was like, Okay, I tend to be the landing spot for a lot of these questions and who people fielding these questions to but so that was, I would say the first nudge and I was so comfortable in corporate. So just bought into the Kool Aid and the ideology of that was going to be my path professionally. And when I retired that I just put the idea on the back burner. And it was something that I started to work on on paper with getting all the paperwork filed and we can get an official business. But aside from that, I didn't really do anything with it. And then the second nudge came from I had the opportunity to speak with BFS at last year's health and fitness Association Conference formerly known as prasa. And I just really enjoyed being able to share my experiences, my failures, my knowledge, I was on a panel, we were talking about HR challenges and workforce and culture diversity, and something lit up inside of me and I was like, Okay, I feel like this is something that I should be paying more attention to should we do? It was just the nudge from the universe that I needed to finally start. I hadn't seen anyone in the industry aside from the Santos and great work that she's doing from an HR perspective. hadn't seen anyone in our industry that had the background of knowledge on the business side. And so that was the second nudge to say okay, something inside of me was lighting up you You clearly enjoy this work, people have a need, there's a need in the market. why not explore that? And then lastly, what's the harder push. And so, sanctuary started in 2016, officially on paper in terms of conceptualizing, we sold our business to a VC firm called Fit lab last year, in May of last year. And at that time, I was thinking, Okay, we're gonna sit on for about a year to help change management and transition. But what do I want the chapter of my professional career to look like? What do I want to do next, and how to really until that moment, thought about my exit strategy, because we're so in the trenches, we had exit strategy for the business, but Deseret did not have a plan for what she wanted to do after sanctuary. And after we met our one year commitment with the new company. And so started journaling started talking to mentors more, I got Andrea, who's based out of Singapore, that's an amazing executive coach. And I just started to ask the hard questions and reflect on what I wanted the next chapter of my life to look like what inspired me what do I enjoy. And all of that idea generation brought me back to that consulting business that I had started but hadn't fully finished yet. It was an idea and a passion that had stemmed from something that was planted as a seed all the way back in 2017. And to know me to know that I'm very much a type A personality. And so I had to go over having all of the ducks in a row have everything perfect and finalized. Before I started like that first hurdle of just starting. Even if you're building the plane, as you're going and doing sprints type iteration, when it comes to development, I had to just start, I had to just start somewhere. And so selling our business staying on for just under a year to help with the change management and then exiting, that opened up the space and the opportunity for me to create FEM consulting. And really intentional about the name because I love the fact that our industry has so many dynamic females at every layer of organization represented whether it's owner, C suite, executive managers, instructors, there's just so much representation of female elders within the industry that I wanted to choose a name that celebrated that I wanted to choose the name that celebrated my love for male, female, female identifying owners, operators, etc. And if you were looking at a website, or looking at a business card, just being able to identify, Okay, this person probably understands my experience as a client probably understand some of the nuances and challenges that I face. We are not exclusively for female owners and operators. But I do want an angel reflect the fact that we do understand that demographic and are very intentional, I'm very intentional, rather about how we support those business owners. So this, them consulting came to be a lot of pushing from the universe and mentors and friends and experiences and stops and starts along the way. It's one thing to get those nudges, it's another thing to actually listen to them. And then it's yet another step to take action because of them. And that's a disconnect for a lot of people. It really is the difference of reaching that next level, because our brains can often find a lot of reasons to not and I think you speaking to your experience in the corporate world, it really is something that can just turn the same thing out of you over and over. And then before you know it, the hamster wheel spun and years have gone by and you've never actually sees the dream. Like I think that's something a lot of people can relate to. I'm curious, because you spoke to the fact that you do have this wealth of corporate experience. How did you make your first leap into fitness then what did that look like? Because sanctuary obviously was a huge part of your life and a success story. I'm a lifetime athlete. I have been competitive through sports since I was nine or 10. In some capacity, and team sports, athletics fitness has always been a part of my core DNA as a human being. It's something that's just innate and somebody who has always been a part of my lifestyle. And so I went to undergrad have the opportunity to play competitive D one volleyball theater University. Before that I was on the US national team for second and have the opportunity to really get introduced to competitive athletics and strew fitness, fitness routines, fitness regimen, strength training and nutrition during that time, because growing up in the bay area, we really didn't think too much attention on weightlifting and muscle building and having robust fitness training programs in high school, or junior high school is all about the sport and your form and your technique and perfecting that. And so my first introduction into fitness programming was a competitive athlete in college. And for me, it's always been something that I've maintained throughout the duration of my life, even though I'm no longer compete, or play, you know, in other cities and countries, I still remain an active even if I'm just an alternate on weekends. active member of adult leagues, whether it be sand or indoor court, because volleyball specifically is a huge part of my story. And so many of my relationships, my connections, personally and professionally have come from that shared commonality of athletics. And so the transition for me in the sanctuary versus seamless, I met Zack golden, the founder and CEO when we were both undergrad freshman at Baylor University, and study hall and he tells the story better than I do, but our friendship goes back 22 plus years. And that was my first professional entry to the market was him badgering me all those years I was in corporate, you know, don't be a fractional ch CHR V, something else, you know, you can come over and join the team full time. And we could build this and scale this into the vision that we've always had in terms of the business. And so that was my entry back in 2020. I've always had fitness as a part of my DNA. But it wasn't until right before COVID That I really jumped in as a full time owner and operator. Well, and obviously they saw the potential in you. I think that anyone that whether it's through athletics or just for myself, I was terrible at I was a professional benchwarmer, I tried for everything I collected participation ribbons, like a champ. But once I discovered the gym, I was like, That's my sport. And it's the same thing like whether it's athletics are doing it in a fitness space, it gives us this evidence that a we can do hard things, the mental resilience that comes with it. And all of those things can be applied to business, those same levels of consistency. And so I think it does really elevate our potential when that is a fabric of who we are in our foundation from the get go. Obviously, you exit, you're doing your consulting now, and I'm sure your expertise, really, you probably hear a lot of the same questions all of the time. But I think that's why they're important to reiterate. So I did some sleuthing on your LinkedIn page. And I know that diversity of thought is something that you speak to a lot when it comes to innovation. So can you explain why that's important to cultivate, and for those maybe that haven't entertained it, what exactly the root of that means, as your next untapped revenue stream, or big idea comes in that space of diversity of thought. That's where great ideas are born. And it's easy to talk about that it's super difficult to actually put together the infrastructure of this space to create that to foster it. You know, I want to think about where innovation lives wide diversity of thought and communication is so important. It's because you want to make sure that you're thinking about future growth, future opportunity, future needs of your client personas and consumer demographics, because anticipating that is how you maintain longevity as a business. And so you know, one of the things that I really pride myself in as a leader is creating environments to cultivate that diversity of thought and innovation. So what does that look like to simply that's physically having meanings physically being protected time and space off site, sometimes away from business operations, or you're sequestered as a group or leadership team to be able to really hone in on those areas of the business those challenges those ideas and expand upon that you have to prioritize creating protected time and space. And then also creating environments where people feel comfortable speaking and sharing their ideas. And so how do you manage and cultivate that environment? You ensure that there are very clear expectations about how that discussion will take place? How are you going to handle disagreements? How are you going to handle ideas that kind of go into the status quo? How is conflict going to be matched? Our active listening, are we speaking more than we're listening? Are we asking thoughtful questions to get the conversation started? I think if leaders are typically dominant extrovert personalities, right and so it's so easy for us just want to jump in and take over the conversation. And, and don't model the behavior that we want to see. But that can sometimes be intimidating to other members of your team that aren't always wired that way. And so I encourage leaders that are trying to cultivate cultures of innovation, and diversity of thought to listen more than Utah to ask open ended questions and challenge people with exercises, or small group breakout sessions to get the idea generation going. And secondly, don't be afraid to disagree or fail, you know, if you're going to fail, fail fast, but you want to make sure that you're encouraging that curiosity and asking people tend to stretch outside of their comfort zones, and look at situations differently that they might not have thought of like being uncomfortable, being comfortable with taking risks, encouraging the people at the table, and in a room to do the same. And maintaining that curiosity is what really Foster's innovation and diversity of communication and thought, you also hire people that think differently from you, and fill your gaps. You'll hear me say this all the time, I'm very aware of my strengths, and very aware of my weaknesses, I'm not in the business of perfecting everything, and anything, that's not a realistic expectation. So when I make hiring decisions, whether it's direct reports or members of the collective organization, I'm looking for people that fill holes that fill gaps, that bring strengths to the table in the equation that I don't personally possess or the team doesn't have. Because those individuals are going to look at those challenges those projects from a different lens, and be able to provide a perspective, or see blind spots or areas of opportunity that because of my lens in my experience that I might miss. But I as a leader have to be open to that alternative perspective. And celebrating the innovation and success. If someone is brave enough to throw out an idea. And it lands in it's something that really improves process culture, business operations, client experience, revenue, celebrate that publicly and privately really celebrate that in big ways, because that's going to encourage everyone on the team to contribute in a more meaningful way. I would also say, you know, lastly, because I don't want to be a dead horse, but you want to make sure that you have representation at those offsite debriefs. And so in corporate, one of the things that we would do twice a year, we would go physically to another state, physically somewhere isolated, we would get in a room in a creative environment and pick our biggest goals or challenges, whiteboard and brainstorm and idea generation for those challenges. Those offsite debriefs, you want to make sure that you have representation across every area of the business and every layer of organization. If it's just the executives, if it's just in your leadership, you're going to miss out on some of the insights that the people that are actually doing the work are going to be able to contribute to let me know if your idea is even feasible. Right. One of the things I hate and I know it's one of the questions that you sent off, but we'll talk about leadership, best practices, leadership, do's and don'ts. One of the things that I hate leading from an ivory tower, you have to make sure that you are in the weeds in some capacity that you understand the day in and day out, you might not be doing those jobs, but making sure that you have your finger on the pulse of what's really happening, what really is the employee experience, but really is the client journey, versus what you assume it to be, is extremely important. And so when we're thinking about innovation, invite people to the meetings, include them in the off site debriefs, not only will that help you generate more innovation that actually adds value at a faster rate. But it's going to increase your buying by your people and morale, because they're gonna feel like they're actually contributing to the strategy of the organization, getting credit and kudos for it while being heard. I actually love that you include that morale component, because I also escaped from corporate. And I used to say I use that word with so much intention. Because technically what it felt like you were a little bit shackled. And it was because I did have experience in an organization that had that kind of ivory tower model. And ultimately, that's why I say when you say morale, there's so much value in highlighting that because truthfully, you can feel it. And the thing is, it's kind of like, I know that we're all don't want to talk about viruses after what we went through with the pandemic, but it is like having a virus because it spreads and before you know it, it's infected through the team and you collectively can feel it. There's breakdowns and communication and I just think it's such an ineffective way to operate. Ah, but because of the way the morale was, it also didn't feel like a safe space to vocalize ideas. So one of the things you highlighted there was the fact that when these curiosity conversations happen, sometimes you may not see eye to eye. So how do you keep it a safe space for idea generation? If things, for example, aren't exactly landing on the same page for everyone at the table? That's a good questions. How do you stay honest to the needs of the business, right? And what you know, is or is not feasible. And it's difficult if you're a director or above, there's going to be strategy and information in terms of the long and short term goals of a company that you're privy to, that your team will never understand. And even if you shared every nuance, they probably still wouldn't get the gravity or the capacity of that. And so there's a certain weight that we hold in knowing that if I'm saying that, right, our no do an idea that probably passionate about nine times out of 10 is for a reason that you may or may not be privy to, and you have to trust. And so when I think about idea generation, and innovation, and communication in general, and building a strong team dynamic, one, you want to make sure that there's open, honest and primarily transparent conversation consistently. If I know that I can show up to a meeting, if my ideas to data, support my creativity, and present that in a way that is clear and concise. And it's going to be received and heard that establish trust. And trust over time builds the strongest team dynamic organically versus being something that you have to force and consistently talk about. It just happens innately. So I think that open and honest, transparent communication is key. That does not mean that you sugarcoat what you say that does not mean that you don't have objections, or questions or counter arguments, to really vet out the validity of an idea. But the how in which you execute those elements is extremely important, coming from a place of understanding and empathy. But also data and directness is a delicate balance. We also want to be my level we talked about this a little bit earlier. But when conflict arises when you have disagreements and differences of opinion, how you manage that in the moment and the words that are used, extremely important. You want to ensure that you validate the person's perspective, but also talk through the disagreement determine a path forward. And the equation is one of the books and authors that I love to know with Kim Scott radical candor out I feel like she sent me residuals in the amount of books that I've bought in time. I'm listening, hook her up. She's amazing. The work she's doing in terms of candor, and communication is spot on. And you take personal care, and then also challenged directly, that essentially equates to radical candor. And so being intentional about how you're saying something, the feedback that you're giving, coming from a place of data, but also being empathetic to that person. And their perspective, is extremely important. You know, we make sure that we're having clear conversations that are simple, not overcomplicating it, because that muddies the waters as well, but safe and transparent, to be able to foster that trust and that strong team dynamic. And then another element is a communication loop that's consistent. And you know, Oh, true loop versus that being a singular one directive conversation, being able to have meaningful feedback and say, the moment Hey, you know, this is how I experienced you or I get that you might have an issue with my particular idea. But going forward, it would be great if you would communicate me in this way. That continuous communication loop has to be something that's in place and example and exemplify and model by the leader so that the tone is set for the organization. I almost couldn't stand later when I was in my 20s that to give feedback that you take it you how many luckily, you can be super critical of me, but I can't give you data oriented feedback without there being an issue. Got it. So Jim Scott, if you're looking for examples, if you're looking for people listening to this, how to walk out creating environments and establishing healthy team dynamics, healthy team communication, have your Team Read that book. There's a corresponding exercise book that comes with it where you can have different exercises that you complete as a team to help reinforce and miss some of this stuff, stick to your employees and stick to your culture. But I would highly recommend reading radical candor as a team and taking it in stride and then Have a laundry list of other books. But leadership is a language by David mark, trust and inspires Steven Convy. dear to me by Brene. Brown is good. And I was gonna say all I can think of is to be clear as kind to be unclear is unkind. And I was like Brene, brown, totally changed my communication style, because this is the thing to like, and you highlight such a good point, those self audits, we should be doing them on ourselves, whether we're at the top tippity, top of a C suite or down the line, like you have to be able to look at our own communication styles and really take that time to self audit and give yourself feedback on an interaction. If it maybe didn't feel good. It doesn't mean that it's gone badly. It means there's something to be learned there. I agree with you wholeheartedly. And there's a difference between servant leadership and leadership that comes from a place of ego. And what I think it was probably around right before the acquisition of sanctuary I was going through my mother had just passed away health issues, business stressful, we're coming out of COVID are all these nuances that my team don't see or didn't see, rather, on a daily basis. And I wasn't aware of how that was making show up. And we were on a manager call across all the patients and I heard feedback about how I was coming across a short and Curt and stressed and intense. And you know, my empathy was lower than it had been. And it was hard to listen to, because I consider myself to be the exact opposite. But I listened. And I took notes. And I asked questions, and I had an offline conversation with that person to further understand their experience. And it was a wake up call for me to be like, Oh, managing this grief, well, oh, you're not managing your stress and your health issue well, and it's impacting how you're showing up as a leader, let's do an audit, let's call Andrea get some executive coaching on the books. To figure out how to navigate this season. Let's talk to him therapist a little bit more each week than we have been. Let's get some healthy outlets, like maybe hit the gym one time a week. But that audit wake up call. And I was able to put together a plan for myself to get back to how I'm accustomed to leading to showing up for the workforce that I support. But I think leaders often miss the mark in understanding that we are no longer in 1980 1990, the early 2000s, the workforce demographic has shifted. The most important people in an organization are the people that touch the client, and that deliver the service and that service experience. As an executive, I'm at the bottom of the totem pole. Because on executing, it's my job to block to tackle to create environments, infrastructure support training, and coaching processes, policies and procedures that make it easier for my people to show up as their authentic selves and do the job well, and service the client or provide the service and see your people are your most important assets. And if you don't have strategy or a leadership team that believes that then you might need to change that leadership team. If sales and revenue we understand that keeps the business going. But the people have to execute for there to be sales, revenue and targets to be made. And so if you prioritize the machine over the days that are actually executing, that's when you start to see high attrition rates, employee morale dropping dissatisfaction, lack of engagement, that clock in clock out mentality where people are literally sprinting to the door at 459, or end of their shift done. And so that's you know, that ego driven versus servant leadership is something that really shops my high because people don't leave a company, they think leader, people quit, they quit leadership, they don't quit a business, they quit, because they've had some sort of experience that was in conflict with their expectations, their values, cetera, that forced them to leave the job that they signed up for. And so that within itself is also an opportunity for companies and business owners to do audits is really check their exit interview seriously. And yes, they'd be filled with a motion from the departing employee, but there's always going to be a nugget of information that you can take to improve. Well, and it's exactly that same like broadening the scope on the landscape of doing a personal audit of exactly what's happening in our culture there. And you kind of touched on it in the previous part of the conversation there about team dynamics when you are cultivating a safe space for that conflict and ultimately that trust is what translates to a strong team dynamic or organically. So when it comes to fostering a culture within a company in a positive culture, do you have any examples of kind of done right done wrong? Gosh, I do whatever we can. I'm like, I'm thinking, let's make this size so that I don't eat up all of your time. And you know, I can talk but the first my favorite quality about you, let's just say like, because it's one thing you see like to talk, but it's quality. So thank you. I appreciate it. When it comes to cultivating culture people misconstrue that word and the meaning of culture. It's can be ambiguous, right? What does that mean? It's, of course, your mission, vision values. But more importantly, is how you treat each other how you communicate how all of the infrastructure works to support a common goal, you know, how everything is managed, and run all of that flows into culture, it's what's happening in between the idea of the strategy and it being rolled out all the way down to the end of the client experience. And everything in between is your culture. So the first thing that comes to mind is leaders leading by example, you can't have values, you can't have this define culture, all of which should be written out on a piece of paper, splattered all over the place so that you're being reminded of the expectation on a daily basis. But you can't have a leader saying one thing, and modeling something completely different. That is the quickest way to erode culture, but you also have to be an authentic leader. And so it's challenging because what I've my experience and careers, often people leaders are high performers. So they were top salespeople, top revenue generators, top performers that are placed in leadership, because there's this, you know, false notion of performance equals quality leader Well, that's not always the case. Typically, the sharks in the water are the worst at people leaders, because they're accustomed to solo operation, not having a tolerance for anything else out there process, singular minded, very focused, highly competitive. And so you know, I really, that's another tangent that I'm going on, aside from leading by example, making sure that you're putting leaders in leadership roles, not high performers in leadership roles, and then supporting them as new managers, or existing to ensure that they are set up for success. And you also want to prioritize second point for cultivating a positive culture, healthy culture in a company that's thriving. You want to prioritize employee wellbeing, you want to prioritize servant leadership, putting small infrastructure and process in place to say, prime example, we're not going to be on the Fourth of July, we're not going to be open on Christmas Day, we're going to do a little bit more than the standard bank holidays because we understand that rested, happy employees show up rested and happy. And so having feeding rooms for new mothers having policies and procedures in place, that really make it comfortable and easy for your employees to show up and be themselves and experience and do the work at a very high level is extremely important. Another component of creating a good culture is clear and simple yet defined goals and expectations. It shouldn't be ambiguous. It shouldn't be range, you should have very specific objectives, very specific KPIs, OKRs, whatever, you want to refer to them as very specific behavioral and performance expectations that are defined on paper so that if, if anyone ever questions what the expectation is, you can reference that if you're in your weekly or your bi weekly one on ones, you can use that as a coaching Guide to Reference to reinforce that expectation. I often think that as leaders, especially within the fitness industry, we fail to document those things, we fail to define those things and put thought behind it. That ends up being something that negatively impacts your ability to manage your workforce effectively. You also want to value continuous learning. We love internal sanctuary. We still love internal certifications, we love continuous learning. Not everybody has the budget to be able to do tuition reimbursement or cover some percentage of certifications, but there's a lot more resources out there than you might be aware of. And I SSA is a great resource. I plugged them all the time just like upload blood midship you're trying to sell your business. But I SSA is a great resource that you can tap into words basically a talent portal repository that you can customize to your business that will not only help you crude instructors operation rolls at various levels of their careers. But it'll also help you identify certification opportunities in different modalities at a fraction of the cost, the same quality as NASM, but a little bit less expensive. And so you can work with those third party vendors to really drive home the value of continuous learning and continue to be patient. It doesn't always have to be a master's degree, or an associate's degree, it can be as simple as Harvard Business Review or some sort of internal certification program that you develop with lead instructors or your management team that will add value. We talked about the importance of hiring people that fill gaps that plays a huge part in cultivating positive culture. If you have skill set gaps or strategic gaps in your organization, you want to recruit to find that and non conventional way that could be someone that you steal from corporate that's escaping, or someone that you take from another competitor, you know, it could be very much that and then I tower leadership at the time to come down for ivory tower. When I was the CEO and head of HR for sanctuary I worked for that shifts, every single officers person spent a whole day with me to truly drive home everything that they had already learned with their manager, yes. For hours with me during onboarding going over every policy procedure culture. And it was it was interactive, it was collaborative. It wasn't just me talking at them for four hours. And so you know, I took the time to understand, okay, what is my studio managers experience, what is my front desk person's experience, what's my lead instructor, the instructor, every level of the organization get as much of the work as I could to really understand if my policies and procedures and strategy makes sense, and were applicable. And that did wonders for our culture. Because if your team sees that you're willing to roll up your sleeves and do the work, there's nothing that establishes trust quicker, no, everyone can talk at you, and throw the title in there, wait around. But if you're not willing to do the most miniscule tedious tasks like cleaning the bathroom, and restocking and rolling towel before class and doing laundry, then it's just you're not able to gain the trust of your team, nor will you understand the little nuances about the role that can help you be more effective as an organization. Temperature checks are huge for our traditional survey tools that you can use, like 60 reviews, or skip levels where you just randomly pull people from the organization to meet with senior leadership, but creating a space where people feel comfortable to get coffee with you and checking in consistently, with more than just your direct reports, making sure that your team is responding to the strategy that you're implementing, and they don't have questions or ideas or challenges. Keeping your finger on that pulse is extremely important. Because that's how you're going to get towards your desired outcome. And if you have to modify it and tweak it, that's okay. But the key is to be aware of is my strategy and align with my workforce and my clientele base, because it might be off, and that could be the disconnect. What else is there don't be afraid to pivot. Don't be afraid to adapt and change, especially environment, you can change tomorrow, whatever Congress decides to pass or not, to our industry, right. And you want people to feel comfortable with that adaptability so that they're not so stuck in everyday mundane routine, that we kill off the innovation that organically happen. And give them a new take, as a leader, give more of your time, your energy, your thought your effort than you physically take 14, that last one's so good, because really, it operates like an investment that you are going to see an ROI if you take the time to do that without question. And especially having that boots on the ground mentality, the amount of nuggets of wisdom that you would get or data about your business from your people that you really wouldn't be able to obtain otherwise must just be invaluable. So, solid takeaways there. I know toward the beginning of that you were talking about, you know, really cultivating the talents and helping them grow. So how important have mentors been for you? And overall, what's your view on mentorship and its role in kind of elevating people to the next level? I love mentors, I would not be where I am in my career, had I not had the guidance and support of mentors and people often think of mentors as more senior more tenured, a little bit further in their journey. And yes, some of my best mentors have done that for me. But I also have a really solid peer group, really, really solid peer group and more My friend base, whether it be grad school or personal or my career, I've made an effort to maintain a lot of those relationships and cultivate them and spend time investing into them. Not just professionally, but getting to know him as people, and referring some really cool things. And it's been interesting to experience life in advance our careers in tandem, and be able to learn from their experience from their new ventures from their projects, and have a soundboard type of a person that can offer perspective through a different lens. I think it was a ray that talked about people look for mentorship and opportunity, when really they should look laterally left and right, because some of the greatest opportunities that I've had have come from people that are at the same place in their respective careers, versus being super advanced. And let's be honest, the CFO of Walmart does not have time to talk to me more than once a quarter if that. And so who am I going to get that weekly, monthly daily guidance, depending on the season, it's going to be for my peer group. And that's been such an amazing experience. I mean, I always say the ladder now online, and my mentors have definitely been ladders for me, in terms of exposing me to new opportunities, broadening my perspective, about what my own capacity was, and what I could do meet Laura from Wall was the first person that looks at me as one of my speaking events and was like, easy to do this, like you need to actually figure this out at full time. And I value her feedback so much, because she's brilliant. And I know she can say that if she didn't mean it. And so in addition to being a ladder, mentors are meant to be guardrails. And I like to call them stages in some capacity. Right. And so you don't know how to navigate a path that you've never walked, you meet someone, whether they're your peer, or someone that's a little bit further along in their career, to be able to give you that perspective to help build your confidence in some capacities, to guide you on where to step and how to step and how to manage the nuances of certain relationships or conversations. You need them to also challenge you to ask some hard questions to make you reflect and be introspective and think outside of your current environment, current capacity, I've had mentors that have they stretched and expanded the idea of what I thought I could do and what I thought I was capable of. And that was huge for me, because there are light bulbs that go off that could lead to opportunities or areas of innovation for me professionally. You want mentor that is a connector in one industry and multiple industries has to be the ability to create opportunity or open doors for you and make introductions. But you also have somebody that's personally and professionally invested in you, I mentors, I probably have, I would say, four, four core mentors that are older than me, established in their career come from corporate in some capacity, that have just seen everything like they're CFOs of companies that work on boards, done everything. But they also know me as a person. We've also had some very vulnerable, transparent, honest conversations about some of the difficulties that I've experienced throughout life. And they're present with me and they sit in me with that. And it's not just all business, they genuinely care about Deseret person, and that's hard to find it does exist. But it's, you know, takes work to find and cultivate. In terms of how I mentor to show up some of the best practices that I live by would be being available and approachable. You know, no one should feel like they're interrupting or wasting their time by talking to them. I try to make people feel as special as I believe this be. Anytime we have an interaction, you're gonna get eye contact, you're gonna get my undivided attention. I hand out my contact information, probably more than I should. But my cell phone that's just how I'm wired. And so you want to be approachable. You want to be a human being, you also want to be authentic, want to be present and actively listen, want to ask insightful questions, you want to be inquisitive. But I think a lot of mentors overstand or understand. So really be honest about what you can and can't support in certain seasons of your business of your life is extremely important. Like I have a mentor that's based in the Bay Area. She works for a tech firm and her kids are like transitioning summer home, some are going off to college. She's doing so much right now in this season. She's like, Listen, I'm probably good for about three conversations here and some text messages. But I'm here, if you have an emergency, just let me know. And so setting those clear expectations about what's the objective of the mentorship? What can I give as a mentor? What can you get as a mentee agreeing upon that mutually setting boundaries, setting a consistent cadence in terms of how often and the modalities modalities? Listen to me, the methods of communication, not the modalities they can fit. Like, I was just gonna say that's, that's a fair pass that would be on the brain. But you want to be clear on that, we want to be very clear on expectations, what's the desired end result this relationship? Is it a short term mentorship is a long term mentorship, establishing those boundaries, and those specifics will really make sure that no one feels like they're not getting adequate return on their investment. When it comes to mentorship, and then mentorship, provide guidance, not tell them in D what to do. And that's really hard, because I'm gonna fix it person. But you want to give the mentee the opportunity to come to solutions organically on their own, because that process is build the experience and the knowledge now if they're about to step off of a cliff, definitely warn them and give them some sort of a solution. But my mentors always asked me the most thoughtful questions. And half the time. I'm like, You know what, I don't have the answer for that right now. But I'm going to write it down. And I'll call you in a couple of weeks. And we'll talk through it. And it gives me something personally to work on. While I'm in those in between periods between our last conversation and our next one. I'm a huge science girl. And so I think it's important to also charge your mentees homework assignments and things to read as well. Well, you've already mentored all of us that are listening with your amazing vocalists. So I appreciate that so much. But I actually what you said there lands with me so much. And I like that you highlighted not just professionally but personally, like even it was just around before COVID That I had taken up a new hobby and all these new characters got invited into my life. And it's hard sometimes to make friends in your adult life. I mean, for me, I'm a really big extrovert. So I'm encountering people all the time. But I'm talking about those deep relationships and people that challenge you, and will tell you honestly, are blind spots and the amount of value and the exchange of energy and ideas that have happened in that space have been profound in my professional life and my personal and then same when it goes to finding the right mentors that exactly that aren't just kind of talking at you and telling you what they would do. Because that is a little bit ego driven, if you are having that type of advice come your way. But giving you the space to show that there is expansion that is possible. And guiding you are being the bumpers as needed to help you seize that. So I think so much value in what you said there to kind of round out our conversation because honestly Deseret I could pick your brain forever. I just love how you deliver information. And I'm so excited that you are going on this consulting venture because it's truly what you're meant to do. But what would be kind of your lasting nugget of wisdom for those that are listening that are aspiring to be future leaders. What's something they could really hold on to? Whoo. One thing you know, I struggle with one thing. I would just say, if you are looking to be more present and impactful leader, be a continuous learner. That's the hugest thing. I'm always asking questions. I'm always soliciting feedback. I'm always reading something. I just masterclass has been listening to my conversations via my phone on Instagram ads started targeting me. So now I've signed up. So now it's just you know, information from multiple sources, from people from different websites from different apps from different news periodicals, conferences, learn that you have the budget capacity certified. I'm a huge fan of continuing learning and staying current on the direction of my industry, or the industry's best support because it keeps my brain sharp and all of that information is going to factor into not only the advice that I give potential consulting clients, but also how I show up as a leader. I'm constantly taking best practices and leadership is a journey. Anyone that tells you that They have it all figured out is lying to you when themselves, you are constantly learning and tweaking and adjusting, because the people that manage are constantly learning and growing and adjusting as well. And so being patient, and timed and truly trusting that this is a process and a journey, not a quick sprint, and taking it in stages and iterations and appreciating the journey along the way, is really important but you're not in leadership for the you're not called to it because you see a need and you have a passion to serve, then you probably should be doing something else or just keep it high level I'm touching employee demographic and I'm strategy only, which is fine. There are needs for that but true people leadership, you have to be called to it and be passionate about it. Deseret I am so appreciative of your time today, you have this wealth of expertise. And I really admire people that are so willing to share that knowledge and huge congratulations for you to get nudge number one, nudge number two. And then the final one where you're like this is happening because it is much easier said than done. So kudos to you on this new adventure. Thank you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate the time and your attention to detail in the way that you manage the conversation the nature of your questions. It's just it's very, very, very evident that you're passionate about this and I appreciate the time to spend with you in these environments, so it's better. You've just listened to the All Things fitness and wellness podcast hosted by Krissy Vann This episode was brought to you by fitness a world your fitness your way. Be sure to hit like and subscribe. We have new podcast episodes weekly featuring industry insiders and influencers together we're on a mission for everyone to live a life fit and well