Let That Shift Go
Welcome to "Let That Shift Go," a podcast hosted by siblings Lena and Noel. Join them on their journey of self-awareness as they delve into meaningful conversations about the human experience.
Lena and Noel have decided to break free from the confines of private discussions and bring their heartfelt, and at times, humorous conversations to the public. They believe that we are all going through the trials and tribulations of life, and it's comforting to know that we're not alone.
In each episode, Lena and Noel will explore various aspects of being human, sharing personal stories, insights, and lessons they've learned along the way. From navigating relationships to dealing with challenges, they'll offer a refreshing perspective on life's ups and downs.
Through candid and authentic conversations, "Let That Shift Go" aims to create a safe space for listeners to relate, reflect, and find solace in the shared human experience. Lena and Noel invite you to join them as they embrace change, growth, and let go of what no longer serves them.
Tune in and be part of a community that celebrates the beautiful messiness of being human. Get ready to let go, laugh, and discover that you're not alone on this journey. Welcome to "Let That Shift Go" podcast!
Let That Shift Go
Perception vs. Perspective: The Key to Emotional Freedom
The episode highlights the significance of distinguishing between perception and perspective in shaping our emotional responses and relationships. We explore how perception can be reactive and emotionally charged, while perspective offers a proactive lens for understanding situations and experiences.
- Examining the concepts of perception and perspective
- Discussing personal anecdotes that illustrate the differences
- Sharing tools to create space between perception and reaction
- Encouraging curiosity to unveil alternative perspectives
- Introducing a breathwork exercise for mindfulness and reflection
- Highlighting practical steps for emotional freedom
Join us in diving deeper into self-awareness and effective communication for a healthier mindset.
Hello and welcome to the Let that Shift Go podcast. I'm Noel.
Speaker 2:And I'm Lina.
Speaker 1:And this is where we talk about the good, the bad and all the shift in between. We just talk mad shift, let's get into it, and on this week's episode we're going to talk about one of life's sneakiest patterns. Hold it up to the light and say, oh, you thought you had me, not today. Not today we're going to talk a little bit about perception versus perspective, but first let's get into these skin deep cards.
Speaker 1:All right, you go first All right, this is from the Friends edition. My question is what's the most ridiculous thing you've seen me do?
Speaker 2:Ridiculous thing I've seen you do.
Speaker 1:There's gotta be a lot of them.
Speaker 2:Oh, my gosh, um, I think. Oh, when you were a kid, I think you guys, like you and your friends, we had this dirt road and you guys put yourself into like a tire.
Speaker 1:Oh yes.
Speaker 2:You know, like a big tractor tire yeah. And then rolled each other down the hill.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we watched an episode of Scooby-Doo and in that episode, of course, they didn't say do not try this at home.
Speaker 3:And you know, performed by professionals at home and performed by professionals.
Speaker 1:But we watched Scooby-Doo and they had to take an old tractor tire and they got inside of it and then they used broomsticks to steer themselves.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's right, I forgot the broomsticks.
Speaker 1:So we thought that this was going to work. So we found an old tire, abandoned tire. We cleaned it all out. It had all kinds of nasty stuff in it. We put carpet on the inside so it wasn't too pokey for us. And I got into it on the first run and it was spinning unevenly because boom, boom, you know, because it was just me in it. And then when me and Chris got in it, two of us got in it. Then we went down the hill and we had our friends stand on either side of us trying on this dirt road, trying to steer us down the hill, and we started about halfway up the hill and they let us go and we started rolling down, Boom, boom boom, and it started going faster and faster and we tried to steer, and let me tell you that the broomsticks did not work.
Speaker 1:And the second, somebody, one of our friends, touched the tire. It started to wobble. Oh gosh. And let's just say at the end of it, we ended up in the cactus at the bottom of the canyon.
Speaker 2:I'm surprised you're alive.
Speaker 1:Honestly you made your own zip line before. It's like, this is how kids die.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we did a lot of crazy stuff. That was the most ridiculous thing, one of them what's your question? My question is what is something you never want me to forget?
Speaker 1:something I never want you to forget how much you make a difference in your family.
Speaker 2:Oh.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, there's so much. We have so many things that go on in our family and somehow things are filtered through you and me too. But you get a lot of it and I hope you never forget how much we appreciate, how much you look out for all of us.
Speaker 2:Thank you. I appreciate that I feel like constantly telling myself I could do more, I should be doing this or why am I not, and then realizing some spaces are for me to step back in Not all under my control, and can only do what you can do, but I really appreciate that yeah, and we also have each other's back, so there's more of us that can.
Speaker 1:This doesn't have to be on one sibling or one person yeah, none of us need to take all of it on.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, thank you for that no worries, all right. Well, let's get into this, because I like this one it's next level, self-awareness, I think. Yeah, it's like this one little distinction that can change your life, your relationships, your healing and, honestly, your sanity, and it was from a podcast we saw with Andrew Bustamante.
Speaker 1:Yeah, everyday Spy.
Speaker 2:Everyday Spy. He's really popular on a lot of podcasts. He was an ex-spy. I don't even know that he's ex-spy, so I'm still. I speculate that he's still in the CIA, but he talks a lot about like things that he learned in the CIA for training.
Speaker 1:Behavioral studies. Behavioral studies.
Speaker 2:And this one you brought up and it was really interesting because it was about perception versus perspective, and I don't think many of us make that distinction at all when we are perceiving the world, or we are in situations where we start to make stories about what's going on and it never really occurs to us that there is a difference between perception and perspective. So let's get clear.
Speaker 1:Okay, let's get clear. So let's break down perception. Yeah, Perception, that is the raw data you're taking in through your senses.
Speaker 2:So let's get clear. Okay, let's get clear. So let's break down perception. Yeah, perception, that is the raw data you're taking in through your senses, right, and it's what you're taking in through your nervous system.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's everything you see, hear, feel, taste, smell.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's just the objective data.
Speaker 1:It's your perception.
Speaker 2:Yep. But the kicker is, perception is filtered. Filtered how? Through our own viewpoint.
Speaker 2:It's through your past experiences through your trauma, through your beliefs, and that literal wiring in your nervous system and you think about. We have this thing called the default mode network in our brains, and I like to think of it as these deep grooves in our brains that tell us what something means. So, whether it's people or types of situations, you're already forming a judgment without really thinking about it. It's just so automatic. And so, for example, if you grew up with emotionally unavailable parents, your perception might be that you have to be hyper alert to rejection. And if someone doesn't respond to your text, you know your perception can say see, you're being ignored again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they didn't text me back. See, they don't care about me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but is that actually true?
Speaker 1:Not always no.
Speaker 2:And that's where perspective comes in. So what do you know perspective to be? What would you say perspective is?
Speaker 1:It's actually like the viewpoint if you're trying to take on the viewpoint of another person or trying to see it from another angle.
Speaker 2:Yep the mental angle you choose to apply to the perception. So it's how you interpret the data. It's not just the data, it's how do you interpret it. So it's your choice to say okay, they didn't text me back. Maybe they're overwhelmed, maybe they lost their phone.
Speaker 1:So it's taken a second to shift back out into perception, from perception to perspective.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because maybe it's not about you at all, you have no idea what's going on, but your mind is already sort of hyper alert, trained to rejection, let's say, in this example. So that's how that can work. It's just what is the story? You're making about it with only having minimal information and instead there is a way for you to be able to kind of switch out of that and be able to maybe step into the shoes of the other person, because perception is very reactive and perspective is proactive.
Speaker 1:Yeah, perception happens to you, while perspective is what you do with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's what you do with it. So you get the data and instead of just going to sleep with it, you know, and just be like, oh, that's what this means. They're, they, they're rejecting me, they don't want anything to do with me. As opposed to, what do you do with that data? And you know when we talk a lot about that. Observer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, cultivating the observer.
Speaker 2:Right and that space.
Speaker 1:That's awareness.
Speaker 2:Exactly, it's all about self-awareness. So it's that stimulus response and having you know the wherewithal to find the space in between.
Speaker 1:So when you find the stimulus and perspective, is your reaction right?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's whatever your perspective is going to cause you to react.
Speaker 2:Well, your yeah, whatever your perspective is going to cause you to react.
Speaker 1:Well, your perception is-.
Speaker 2:Perspective. Yeah, perception your perception is reactive, so your perception gets the data. There's the stimulus Got it? You didn't get a text back, or you didn't get invited or whatever? Fill in the blank, right. Your perception is based on what the facts are and then how your body's responding to it. Got it, and then perspective is proactive. That's where you're going to maybe take that space, so that is that's where your power is. Remember, you have stimulus and you have response, right?
Speaker 1:The pause is where you got all that power.
Speaker 2:The pause is your power. The pause is where you're. You would, you know, apply this knowledge and be able to gain perspective, to say what is actually going on here, and that's where it gets pretty deep. It's like Andrew Bustamante they're trained to constantly question both. They're taught to ask is what I'm perceiving real and from what perspective am I viewing it? So that's the question to ask yourself. Yeah, you know again, is what I'm perceiving real and what you're perceiving real like? What is the story you're telling yourself about what you're perceiving?
Speaker 1:Yeah, because if you're only seeing one point of view, especially if it's through a wounded lens, you might be missing the bigger picture.
Speaker 2:Oftentimes right, and that's exactly what happens in our day-to-day lives.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Because we can mistake perception for reality and when it's actually just a reflection of like how our nervous system is programmed.
Speaker 1:The programmed word again.
Speaker 2:Yeah, programming, Like are you watching, you know, like really volatile news. You know you're shaping your lens, Like your lens is shaped by the information you take in, which is one of the things we talked about more recently was the five things you know, the five people you're hanging out with, the shows that you're watching. It's like that mental diet that we talked about before, and if you, whatever you're taking in through your mental diet is also shaping the lens through which you see reality. Yeah.
Speaker 2:It's shaping your perception. So really being able to stop and kind of realize, like how much of this is what I'm making up and how much of it is actually based on facts Right, not just the objective facts but like what am I adding to this? Are you adding something to what's going on, which is then your nervous system gets activated, you go into, maybe like fight or flight, or anger, frustration, depression, even you know from being this is where you have the option to make a choice, yes, so how do we build a skill of shifting to perspective?
Speaker 2:Well, it is a skill, and so you know, like any skill, it's going to take practice. So, lots and lots, you're going to fall off many times.
Speaker 1:So how do we start? Where's the, where's the beginning place?
Speaker 2:Well, the biggest one is just pausing before reacting. And we talk about that all the time so that you know that same thing stimulus response, so pause before you react.
Speaker 1:When you notice you're triggered if you've got your little cues.
Speaker 2:Take a breath.
Speaker 1:Take a breath, yeah.
Speaker 2:Take a breath. The moment you feel your heart rate spike or your face get hot, or maybe you're clenching your gut. You know you're going to start spinning out into a story about what's happening. Stop Like right there, stop. Just create a space between the perception and the response. Right, perception is that stimulus. Create that space before you respond yeah. And the question to ask yourself is what am I perceiving?
Speaker 1:Name those facts right.
Speaker 2:Like I sent a text, they haven't replied. That's it, that's the raw data, that's all you have. But then you want to ask yourself more questions what story am I adding to this perception? Because maybe your mind jumps to they don't care about me, I'm being ignored. This always happens. So those are the stories we start to tell and really notice when you're starting to become a really good storyteller, because it can spin you up, take you out, take down your whole day, and then you get on this whole roller coaster of just negativity.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and those are stories you're layering on top of perception.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So once you're asking, you know what are the stories I'm adding, notice that those are perspectives, yeah, and those layered stories are. You're just like you said, you're just piling them on top, and then next thing would be to get curious.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is when you're starting to shift.
Speaker 2:Yeah, get curious about what are the other possible perspectives. Like, maybe they're busy, right.
Speaker 1:That's possible.
Speaker 2:It is possible. Maybe the phone's dead, maybe they're in the middle of something I know for me, like I'm going to tell you right now if you're texting me or calling me, I normally don't have my phone on because, if you know, if I'm with clients or if I'm with my family or whatever, I don't have them on. Have it on. And I got really trained that way because of being, you know, working in the hospital or working in flight, I could never have my phone on, like it just wasn't professional. So I mean, oftentimes I think there's probably people who text me and they're like she doesn't care, that's it, it's not true.
Speaker 1:No, I've learned that with you, yeah. Like she's just not available.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know what? You shouldn't always be available. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like in general, we shouldn't just always be available If you have kids small kids and you want to know you going on. Yeah, of course there are things that you can put in place where those calls get through or you get a notification or they notice and a text, but you shouldn't always make yourself available. But anyway, that's nothing to do with this, but one of the best questions to ask yourself, and it's a personal favorite from Bustamante's spy playbook. The question is what am I not seeing here? That's the spy mindset.
Speaker 1:What am I not seeing?
Speaker 2:That's the curiosity over certainty, and it's a little more playful, you know, rather than rigid. It kind of leaves an open space to like, yeah, there are other things that could be happening, one that will stop you from spinning, or it can, yeah, you know, just starting to ask more questions and be like is this actually what's going on? And this goes back to one of the other tools that we talk about using. Is you know, the work by Byron Katie is when you start to tell yourself a story about what's happening, is you want to ask yourself is that true?
Speaker 1:Is it absolutely true?
Speaker 2:Is it absolutely? Can I know a hundred percent that that's true? And oftentimes, I'd say, most times you? The answer is no, you don't know the a hundred percent that that's true. And then asking yourself how do I feel when I think it? Ooh, I feel rejected most times you, the answer is no. You don't know the a hundred percent that that's true. And then asking yourself how do I feel when I think it? Ooh, I feel rejected.
Speaker 2:I feel, sad, feel anxious, okay, but you just had to admit that you don't know that that's true. So who would you be without that?
Speaker 1:thought and you might just be like, well, they'll get back to me when they can. This is where those perceptions kind of lean in from like past experiences, past patterns, yes, making you feel like they forgot or you're not important All those little things start to build up in your perception, those layers.
Speaker 2:Yep, and that can become your personal reality and your personality, you know. And then, finally, it's just choosing the most empowering, compassionate perspective. And that's often hard, and it's not about gaslighting yourself into some sort of toxic positivity, but you can pick a perspective that soothes your nervous system and it widens your lens, like widens your, widens your lens. You know, just asking yourself a few questions, taking your breath, taking a minute and knowing, like you, absolutely don't know everything about a situation.
Speaker 1:I find myself overthinking things too many times.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:Really it just you know, that perception just gets me in trouble.
Speaker 2:So yeah, perception just gets me in trouble. So yeah, what was one of the other things that Andrew was saying that you brought up about this, like when, when you're going into that spin, there was something else that you were talking about that I thought was really important.
Speaker 1:I'm not sure I know, I can't remember. We'll think of it.
Speaker 2:We'll think of it. I mean, there's a lot of real life examples, I know. Did you have any real life examples of where you went into like a spin?
Speaker 1:You mean like with like I mean I've invited you know friends to uh, to go out, and then would be you know, texting hey, let's you know, we meet up and we're trying to set a time, but then it just goes ghosted like, stops responding and I'm like just waiting for that response and first it's like God, did I say something wrong? Did I piss them off or did I whatever? I just start spinning off in my head like how come they're not responding?
Speaker 1:And I go into these I stopped drinking, so maybe they don't want to hang out with me, because I'm not drinking anymore, and you know they're trying to make an excuse All of these things I have all of these insecurities. But then when it came down to it and I actually got to hang out or found out what the truth was, it was like, yeah, they were just busy. And actually when we did hang out, then it was none of that, it was just my perception.
Speaker 2:But you spent a fair amount of time kind of ruminating I was ruminating.
Speaker 1:I had a lot of insecurities about hanging out with my friends in a different capacity and I had a lot of judgments that I was how they're going to be, what they're going to say, what they're thinking, and none of it was true.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that can start to affect even the people that you are around, because now you have this lens of like I'm not well liked or whatever it is, and so you can even start to give off that energy of like pulling back and isolating and it had nothing to do with anything that was actually based in truth.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you see them and they're like what are you talking about? Yeah, that's the thing they're like are you crazy? You?
Speaker 2:thought way too much into that and I was like, yeah, I probably did, yep. And then you took a look, we talk about your energy is like a wad of cash in the morning and you peel off how much of it for each event it's like.
Speaker 2:well, I spent at least 50 on that man, I'm at a deficit by the end of the day. Yeah, you do end up in a deficit at the end of the day. I remember what the thing that was. That you said is that one of the other suggestions that Andrew had was stepping into the view of the other person, like really trying to see the situation from their view.
Speaker 2:It's not just about phone calls or getting invited about phone calls or getting invited, but even when you're having a conversation with somebody or you're interacting with someone is instead just step out of yourself and try to see the situation from their eyes. See what they're seeing.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I do this in therapy because I've had a conversation that didn't go the way that I planned, or I'm trying to have a conversation, and so in therapy I'll do some role play where I'm the other person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love role play yeah.
Speaker 1:And it really does. I love role play. It does shift how I feel and it really cues me into how it feels to hear yes, those words come from the other person and so it really does shift me and really try to see it from the other person's viewpoint, because then it takes a lot of that fuel away from my anxiety and my whatever resentment or whatever I had, if I just focus on what's actually happening.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like that. It's like taking yourself out of the main character of the movie you're watching.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's like pausing and then go. Oh, let me sit over here, let me just sit on this side.
Speaker 2:I wonder what it looked like from their view.
Speaker 1:I mean, it seems so simple, but I mean role-playing with another person to practice a conversation is so beneficial.
Speaker 1:I mean, I've done it hundreds of times probably, and it's it's. I've done it either with writing. First I'll do, maybe I'm if I need to talk to somebody. If I didn't have so my therapist wasn't available or somebody wasn't available, I would just do the writing and do a rough draft, and that's too much and go back and write and and go back through just to just to get perspective and see where it's at. And then, hearing it, then I tried to okay, now I'm going to read it as if I was the other person and see how that feels and how it comes across.
Speaker 2:You know, when we were um, when we were at fit for service, we did this really powerful exercise, and it reminds me of this role-playing, because what they had you do, without telling you how you were going to finish this exercise, was think about a conversation that you know you need to have, that you've been avoiding. Okay.
Speaker 2:Right. Think of a conversation you know you need to have but you've been avoiding because there's something really uncomfortable about it, You're afraid whatever, and so they had you kind of bring that up and journal about it. Then they had you go pick a partner look at them and have the conversation with them and say the things and man, it brought up all the things in my nervous system.
Speaker 2:And then their job was just to listen and tell you what they felt. And then you were able to hear it back and I'll tell you that was one of the most powerful exercises I'd ever done. And then, you know, when I got home, it was easier to go and have that difficult conversation because I'd already like all right, I know how this may be received, or how the person who was just, you know, role-playing for me reflected back on what they saw in me and all of that, and it gave me information. Gave you perspective, right or perception it broadened it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it like. It broadened my perception and it changed my perspective. It changed what I thought were the facts, um, and made it a very powerful exercise. So I think, role-playing, like if you're you know, think about those difficult conversations, or, um, because sometimes it's your perspective of how you think it's going to go that is limiting you from maybe healing that relationship or expanding that relationship or being able to bring closure to something. So why does this matter?
Speaker 1:Oh well, it matters for many reasons.
Speaker 2:It's emotional freedom.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Because when you're trapped in reactive perception, you're living in survival.
Speaker 1:Oh man, survival mode to the fullest yeah.
Speaker 2:When you consciously choose perspective and I mean consciously choose it. It's not something that you know. It's like driving right At first, you have to. You're like checking your mirrors Okay, how do I do this? How do I do this? What were the steps? Again, and pretty soon it can become more natural, but it takes practice. Like we said, it's a skill and it takes practice. But when you consciously choose perspective, you open up options, you can regulate your nervous system, you reclaim your peace. That's the biggest one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we need a little more peace in our life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and this is the way that you can reclaim that for yourself, and even the smallest way, right. So that's the task is really creating that space between the stimulus, between the objective information of perspective, stepping into the observer and be able to widen your perception and maybe change outcomes, at least change yourself internally. Yeah. So what do you think about doing a little?
Speaker 1:breathwork session. Let's do a little breathwork session. Okay.
Speaker 2:All right, let's close your eyes down, okay find a comfortable spot, hopefully not driving, y'all Like you know if this is something that you're you're doing while you're driving. Just maybe mark this part of the the podcast and come back to it, yeah. But yeah, just go ahead and find yourself in a seated, comfortable position. Feel that ground beneath you.
Speaker 1:Relaxing your body.
Speaker 1:Close your eyes down and we're going to take 30 breaths in and out of the mouth open mouth, big, deep breaths, full in through the mouth, into the belly, into the chest and up into the head. And we're going to repeat this 30 breaths real deep. And we're going to repeat this 30 breaths real deep. And we're going to begin now. As you breathe, bring your mind to a situation that's been sticky lately. Somewhere you've been caught into a stressful story. As you inhale, gather all the raw data of that situation, just the facts Deep, full breaths, almost there most of it Feeling the belly, the chest, the head, relaxing the breath out.
Speaker 1:And, at the bottom of this last breath, take a deep breath and hold, hold. And while you're holding, I want you to observe no judgment and in a few moments I want you to exhale, releasing the story you've been carrying. Okay, okay, now we're going to move into our restorative breaths in and out of the nose, deep, full breaths in through the nose and out through the mouth, and we're going to begin now, now. Now, while you're inhaling, I want you to invite curiosity. Pull deep breaths in through the nose and out through the mouth. Notice how curiosity feels in your body. We're almost there. One last round Deep, full breaths In through the nose, out through the mouth, relaxing With every exhale, releasing control with every exhale releasing control. And now I want you to take one last deep breath in through the nose and release, holding at the bottom, hold, hold, allow space for new perspectives to arise, relaxing and grounding, bringing in that curiosity. Okay, thanks for listening. Okay, thanks for listening.