The Payments Experts Podcast
Expert payments attorneys discuss the electronic payments industry from a legal perspective.
The Payments Experts Podcast
Auto Dealership Payments Unraveled with Dealer Pay | Five Businesses Under One Roof Expert | PEP041
Julie Douglas, a 25-year veteran in the payments industry, shares how Dealer Pay (https://www.dealer-pay.com/team/) is revolutionizing auto dealership payment processing with innovative gateway technology and business efficiency tools. Her team has created software solutions that transform the traditional commodity of payment processing into valuable business intelligence across the five distinct operations within a dealership.
• Auto dealerships function as "five businesses under one roof" with complex payment needs
• Payment gateways serve as crucial tunnels for transaction processing, fraud mitigation, and interchange qualification
• Real-time fraud detection tools provide risk scores that help dealers avoid potential chargeback situations
• Integrations with dealer management systems enable data collection that improves operational efficiency
• Traditional payment processors often use a "smash and grab" model that damages industry reputation
• Future developments include integrating payables, creating unified platforms for financial management
• The industry faces compliance challenges with surcharging practices varying widely between states
• Customer feedback drives product innovation, unlike many software companies that resist enhancement requests
• Payments technology is evolving beyond simple processing to become comprehensive business solutions
Looking to modernize your dealership's payment processes with software that prioritizes security, efficiency, and customer experience? Visit dealerpay.com to learn more about our integrated solutions.
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**Matters discussed are all opinions and do not constitute legal advice. All events or likeness to real people and events is a coincidence.**
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Visit us at: https://www.globallegallawfirm.com/
A payments podcast of Global Legal Law Firm
Um, so then I went to them and I said well, look, what would make my life a lot easier is if I could just duplicate the transaction by hitting a button, and then all I have to do is change the time and make it no charge. You know what that got?
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:Got a no, nope, yeah, totally. Jeremy was with me on this one, absolutely Because we do like he would help me with the billing and he would see it. And he was like, yeah, this would make it so much easier. And I'm like, and it amazed me that they said no because I said, look, I don't even want anything. It says in our contract you get all the enhancements, no problem, right, like it amazed me. And I do appreciate, based on my experiences as a customer, especially around software, I do appreciate the fact that you really listen and I think that that's probably throughout your organization, because I do believe that the way that you operate, the people that you hire, they'll, they'll emulate that modeling and that I also think that you're identifying the people that kind of like you know fit the mold.
Speaker 3:Welcome to the Payments Experts Podcast, a podcast of Global Legal Law Firm. We hope you enjoy this episode. Welcome to the Payments Experts Podcast, a podcast of Global Legal Law Firm. We're really excited. Today in studio joining us managing partner of the firm, Christopher Dryden, as well as our special guest, we have Julie Douglas from dealerpaycom. Julie, welcome to the Payments Experts Podcast. Really excited to have you. How are you doing?
Speaker 2:Thank you, glad to be here.
Speaker 1:It's amazing, man. I've been on like three podcasts in like the last like three weeks. I didn't do a podcast maybe for like eight months, seven months, and just been rolling along with them recently. So this is great.
Speaker 2:Why are you all of a sudden so popular? Say it again why are you all of a sudden so popular?
Speaker 1:Because Jeremy bothers me for this stuff all the time and I have to tell you he's into me, Anjali.
Speaker 1:I have to tell you that. You know, it's the one cool part about this job. The one thing that keeps me coming back every day, especially the subject matter that we work in, is it's constantly moving, constantly shifting, becoming the center of all commerce, like when I fell into electronic payment almost 20 years ago, I would never have believed the trajectory of what it would become. Julie, why don't you tell us about dealerpaycom and exactly what it does?
Speaker 2:Okay, so we got to stop calling it dealerpaycom, because it's just dealer pay.
Speaker 1:All right dealer, pay LLC just dealer pay.
Speaker 2:I got you.
Speaker 1:So, julie, how did you get involved with dealer pay?
Speaker 2:Sure. So I have been in the payments industry for 25 years, so I have a little bit on you there, chris. But you know, I started just selling check processing and credit card processing in St Louis and I stumbled upon a dealership and what was cool about it is you were talking about payment acceptance. It's like a dealership is like five businesses under one roof. So you know the volumes are high, the average tickets are high and you know the synergies of all the moving parts are just exciting. You know. So when I was able to get my first dealer in St Louis, you know it was one of those things where I didn't even know anything about credit card processing. I'm quoting him rates that I had no idea how they worked, but it was great because I pretty much jumped in, you know, headfirst to learn all about it. So you know from there I actually, chris, worked at Global Payments for 10 and a half years.
Speaker 1:So I didn't know. I didn't know that. Okay, so you've been inside. That's what I call it. It's like big law for us. I've never worked for anything but like mom and pop, including this firm.
Speaker 2:So we solve a lot of problems and you know, as you mentioned before, you know payments just isn't credit card processing. So you know the ability to bring to the table what I've learned over, you know, many years working for Global and then also I had a little stint at FreedomPay for a little bit, and then also I had a little stint at FreedomPay for a little bit. You know we bring, like, the modern aspect of technology and payments to an industry, like I mentioned, that's traditionally antiquated. So solving problems and making things more efficient and allowing them to be more productive and ultimately more profitable.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, the thing that I find really interesting is I didn't know anything about automobile dealerships before we started working together and the interesting part to me is that you were like it's five businesses in one, and it is because when you qualify somebody for a merchant account, you're looking at what's the product or service that they sell.
Speaker 1:A lot of times it's not product and service. So the idea that you've got a parts section that does one thing, like a service section that's actually providing another thing, and then you got new sales and like how new sales and financing associated with new sales or leasing it adds like a whole other layer, at least legally. I mean I find it kind of fascinating because automobile dealerships touch so many different areas of the law, which is really interesting because on the payment side you actually have to pay attention to all those different areas of the law, and so it's been interesting to watch a dealership and I think it's kind of funny. But I don't think people understand payment gateways and I would actually call dealer pay not just a software but a payment gateway more than anything else. I think it would be really beneficial for the people out there to really understand what a payment gateway is and how dealer pay fits into that characterization.
Speaker 2:Sure. So you know you have the software, the point of sale, what the user is interacting with. That's the front, that's the, that's the creation of what dealer pay is. But we've got to communicate to all the processors and acquiring banks and that's done through a channel, or I like to call it, kind of like a tunnel, where there's back and forth transactions going to the processor, acquiring bank to get the approval and back. But what's happening in that tunnel is really important because you've got everything like mitigating fraud, you know, making sure you're qualifying for the lowest interchange rate, you know making sure we don't have duplicates or failed transactions. So there's a lot going on in that tunnel. So over the years we've really perfected or crafted our little magic in there to make sure that uptime always, you know, making sure that you know there's no errors, Because in the dealership space you can have someone coming in to put a $10,000 down payment on a car. If I duplicate that transaction or something happens, that person is in a pinch and the dealership's not happy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure. And look, I've seen other payment gateways operate software systems where they would have drops between the terminal and the POS system if they had terminals away and you would have like a duplicate charge where somebody would run it a second time but really like there was a suspense that was happening and it didn't actually cancel the transaction when there was a drop between the card reader and the POS terminal. And so I mean there's so much of importance to not only the checkout right and the checkout process, but I think it would be interesting to explain like the business efficiency tools dealer pay provides dealerships and how they can take the software and use the information that the software is gathering from a business standpoint, because I think that's where the real value add is is that you know you're aggregating everything and bringing it all under one place so that they can actually use the information.
Speaker 2:Right. So ultimately our customer is the dealership's customer right. So we need to provide them tools to make that customer have a great experience at the dealership. I always say the payment is the last experience the customer has at that dealership. So you've got to make it convenient, you've got to make it secure, you've got to make it fast. So a lot of that is really the software end of it. But because we have integrations with several other products or software solutions specific in the industry, it's called a dealer management system.
Speaker 2:We're getting a lot of data. So we're getting all the consumer data. We're getting all their repair orders, parts tickets, deals, customer information, vendor information and we're taking this data and we're basically utilizing it to make the processes in the dealership more efficient. So there's a lot of you know magic that happens behind the scenes, because if you do all that and you manipulate all these processes, you still have to turn it into a solution that's user-friendly for the dealership. You know these guys aren't tech savvy, these guys don't know, you know a lot of what's going on, you going on behind the scenes. So we want to make the solution work for them in a very simple form.
Speaker 1:So where do you see your best opportunities out in the marketplace these days?
Speaker 2:Well, I mean, we traditionally focus on franchise auto. We don't really grab the independents or the used car dealers as much. There's a little more risk with those guys and risk is something too, chris, that's interesting about it too, because a dealership, I mean one minute they could run a $5 transaction and the next minute they could run a $50,000 transaction. So when I work with my processing partners they've got to be able to account for all those levels of risk and not decline sales because it's, you know, uncommon or not traditional. So you know that's kind of a little sidebar onto the processors, but you know it's huge, it's a big thing.
Speaker 1:No, no, I mean that's everything is risk and understanding the merchant.
Speaker 1:I mean, as I, I was talking to somebody that today about you know, it was kind of like a platform where there was drop shipping and I was talking he was going to board this guy and give him like a great deal and I said, yeah, but I mean the underwriting and risk they might need a merchant reserve, like it's really important for the processor to have, if not independent understanding, but a liaison like dealer pay, with a system that can actually come back and feel comfortable with who the dealership is. And, like we were saying before we got on, the dealerships to me are very interesting because they are so diverse and they have bargaining power. Right, I mean, most merchants out there really don't have a lot of bargaining power, but when you look at the dealerships, especially the franchise dealerships, and they've got, you know, 37 locations over seven states and they've got the ability to actually go to the processor and bargain a better deal than most people could or even think that they could, because they bargain with everyone.
Speaker 2:Right, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that that's super important, that you're able to assist in the risk assessment and then also assist the dealership in minimizing risk Absolutely. What are ways that you feel like you are able to assist in that?
Speaker 2:So yeah, I mean the gateway that we talked about. We've got some behind the scenes products, a specific one called Count, and they're doing real time fraud mitigation for us. So if a certain transaction or card or customer kind of looks funny or smells funny, this company is giving them a risk score. So we're able to provide that notification real time to that user. To provide that notification real time to that user. So a big example, chris, is if there's a card that's associated with a high number of chargebacks, we're knowing that real time. So then that dealer user could say ooh, maybe I don't want to sell $10,000 worth of tires to this person over the phone.
Speaker 1:And that's data that's real time sitting in the software system as you're running the card.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. That's awesome. So you, because you work in a varied space, I know you also experience challenges at times Like what do you think your biggest challenge is right now of trying to build a better product or satisfy the auto dealership in a way, or any dealership in a way, that would benefit them going forward?
Speaker 2:Sure. So credit card processing for years upon years has been a commodity right. So you know there's thousands of processors, agents, companies out there trying to sling credit card processing in the dealer space. Unfortunately, most of them do not practice good business. They raise rates. They're not good partners. You know they're one of those love them and leave them type of relationships. So my biggest challenge is really fighting that reputation that the payments industry has gotten and, you know, being able to say OK, mr Dealer, yeah, you've got someone knocking on your door saying they're going to save you, you know, 10 grand a month, but what you don't know is three months later they're going to jack your rate back up. So you know it's been a challenge for me to kind of win back the trust and get you know real partners in the space. And you know, use all my you, all my reputation to show that hey, not everybody's dishonest or just out for the money grab.
Speaker 1:I call it the smash and grab model. But no, I get you and look. There's a lot of things that happen behind the scenes and it's interesting to me that people would actually look at a dealership like a more sophisticated animal and think that they can raise rates even like five basis points and because of the volume, there not be some sort of red flag that triggers right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, these guys aren't looking at their statements. You know they don't know how to calculate an effective rate. I've had so many webinars I've done. You know where dealers are like, so you divide what to what.
Speaker 1:Oh really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's. You know, obviously there's some that are way more sophisticated than others, but they really just think that this is what you have to pay for this commodity, right?
Speaker 2:So what I've been really putting a lot of focus on into last year and into this year is showing dealers that payments nowadays isn't necessarily a commodity. It's got to be backed by software, it's got to be backed by tools, it's got to be backed by things that actually you know help you, not just you know a terminal that sits at a cashier's office that you know collects a payment and sits at a cashier's office that collects a payment and all of a sudden there's a deposit in 24 to 48 hours.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean that's where the dynamism like it's super dynamic to me of what payments has become, because it's really been an avenue where you always have to have the checkout mechanism. But the fact is, is that what's truly pushed payment are all of these business management software systems. And, as a business grows, like analyzing their payment and having like real time talking between a dealer management system and the payment gateway, can reveal a lot of data that will help identify problems within the business. I find it really fascinating because they built like and it keeps getting better and better. We're a law firm. I will tell you.
Speaker 1:We've been through a couple of different law firm management systems. Some of them are really good on time, some of them are really good on workflow, some are really good on something else, but nobody's really built like something that has a comprehensive, complete product. That really, to me, I mean and not only did they not built it, like they don't even want feedback when you have a really good idea for it, because we've given them really good ideas and they don't want to hear any of them, which is kind of fascinating to me. But it's that idea that we're so dependent on software as a business, as this law firm is.
Speaker 1:And it's interesting to me because I didn't know a lot about technology until technology invaded payments. And I don't know if you saw this working at Global, but I'm not a software person like maybe a user, but I wouldn't have really like thought how software would help until it becomes an integral part of your business. But then, like the gateway takes it one step further, which I find fascinating, because you're taking raw sales data and you're computing that based on the uniqueness of the dealership, and you've parlayed your knowledge of doing payments from selling, check processing to working at Global and to really identifying what the industry needed in a particular sector, right, so where do you see it going from here? And I'm not saying give away the secret sauce, but where do you see payments going, because I've found that this molding of technology and business efficiency with payment is natural. What's the next step?
Speaker 2:Well, it's just evolving. What's already there, you know, and the good news is, you know we're probably, you know, 10 steps ahead of a lot of our competitors in the space right now. They're just now starting to figure out hey, maybe I need an integration, or maybe I need a processing partner that does level two and three, or you know, whatever it might be, I just you know we've, you know we've tripped and we've fallen down a lot, but we've learned from our mistakes and we got back up and made it better. So the future is bright because, you know, there's still a lot of payment options out there that I want to bring to these dealers so that they continue to be profitable, offer their customers options. I think we're going to convert crypto to cash for some dealers this year, so that's going to be interesting, it's funny.
Speaker 1:I was just talking to somebody about that today and and they said where do you see it? And I say I think the advent of it is in POS systems. It's just that the banking side of everything has to treat it like any other currency and that means the banks have to carve out their foothold to get paid.
Speaker 2:So when they figure that out but I think the avenue is going to be the POS system for sure, yeah, and then you know, my philosophy is, you know, payments point of sale, it's youCH to where basically it's one platform that the dealer uses to not only collect their payments but pay their vendors. So in the middle of that is some banking right. So directing traffic, what deposits go where, what batches are split to do this, and really making it automated for them. So I mean, we're taking a ton of the accounting work out of their normal jobs.
Speaker 1:Yeah, look, I've worked on all sorts of interesting technology products.
Speaker 1:A lot of them I can't talk about, but I will say one of the things that I find interesting is this idea when you have a dynamic business, that, as we move away from physical cash and you could be a deposit account acquirer, and you could be, you know, like there's a way for if you want to set up your employees, if you have a lot of employees on a debit card tied to a deposit account where there's no fees associated with it, where they're making a spend on a debit card tied to a deposit account where there's no fees associated with it, where they're making a spend on a debit card, and you're actually making money back from having to pay payroll tax.
Speaker 1:I mean, I hear what you're saying there. The payable side is really fascinating to me. Um, I think it's a lot more complicated, or maybe I've just made it more complicated, but I do think that that's really interesting. I haven't really given that thought from your perspective, but now that you say it, it just seems like a natural progression. That's pretty awesome. What else do you think might be out there as far as because what you just talked about, I almost feel like it's a draw to maybe get the unbanked into the banking world.
Speaker 2:You know I think about the banks and the dealer spaces. These banks have their floor plans Right, so they have a lot of financial interest in the dealer. So you know, when I come in and I take the bank out, you know now the bank has one less thing in there. But you know, the merchant services to a bank is just a commodity. Some of the banks are just referral partners and put their name on it. Some of them are actually doing the processing, underwriting, etc. But now what's interesting is these banks are coming to me saying how can I resell your product because you're taking me out of all the dealers.
Speaker 1:And I think it's pretty awesome that you've made enough disruption with a quality product that the banks see the value in it and that you're able to actually find new partners where you didn't think you could, because who knows what opportunities lie in the. No offense to the banks out there. They're paying the ass to work with personal opinion, just leave it there. But I but, having them as referral partners, there's probably opportunities that are very similar to what you're working on now and I think that that's uh, I think it's pretty awesome that you're outside and outside the box thinker, because I think that that's what's required in today's payments business is. You know the people that I've seen maintain longevity from the days of you know the terminal and you know you're trying to sell qualified rates versus non-qualified, or I mean the payment processing today. It's like it is a commodity, like the revenue made off of it in in comparison to what it was a long time ago. You know it. Just it kind of gets condensed and squashed and and it's what you're charging, I mean agreed on.
Speaker 1:Those are huge no, no, I agree, I, I agree. I mean that's that's another opportunity out there and that's another thing where there's so much disparity. I said this on another podcast. It's very, very interesting. But with the dismantling of the federal apparatus, there's going to be a natural inclination for the states to fill the void and so when you don't have like consumer oversight on a federal level, that you're going to start to get oversight in spaces that you didn't normally think of. And because there's not going to be a uniformity among states and the laws, I mean that's obvious Like you see it. I mean you mentioned surcharge is a really good thing to talk about, not, we did on another podcast, but the states are so disparate in how they look at it. Right, and then, as they get educated, I'll just tell you a quick story.
Speaker 1:I we represent a really small POS provider. They contacted like not in automobile dealership, totally different stuff, but they they work in liquor stores. It's a big vertical for them and they contacted the state of Oklahoma and had a communication with the state oversight agency in Oklahoma and there were two laws that they quoted where this guy was asking hey, can we do dual pricing in the state of Oklahoma? There's no laws related to dual pricing other than New York, really. I mean, the card brands have regulations, but there's no laws. And so they quote this guy, two laws, and they're basically like no, you can't do dual pricing.
Speaker 1:And I read the laws and one of them is like the right to actually surcharge, which was very clear. And then it was like very promoted, as long as it was done uniformly to all customers and it was like the list price. And then there was this other thing that you couldn't have an inducement as a liquor store operator to sell your goods. So it was really random. But then I read them and I didn't think either one of them applied, and not because I was advocating, I just read them. The people that pass these laws have no clue sometimes what they're passing, or they're not even effective. It's crazy in certain respects. So I think there is a real opportunity. I think those are just going to expand too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I sold a dealer group in New York today on dual pricing and you know it's interesting how you can do that program and pass fees in the sale price on a credit and debit card, right, but then you know where it's, you know, scrutinized in those states. They're actually allowing them to have more benefit than other states who are, just, you know, surcharging on the credit, not the debit. So it's interesting. But you know there's a lot of companies really doing it wrong and they're not compliant. And that's another thing that I run up against is some of these DMSs or dealer management systems that I work with. They're trying to play in the payment space. So even though they're my partner, they're also my competitor on some levels. And even some of these big companies, they're promoting surcharging in their platform. They can't do it compliantly, so they're. They're saying, hey, you can surcharge up to 4% and you know the extra money that you're making. You know, on that you can pay for your debit card transactions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, which we know is if you, if you're in any state, that there's a cap on the amount that you can charge, or it's limited by what you're charged, or it's just prohibited or like yeah, totally. Good luck with that, guys.
Speaker 2:A huge company like this is telling dealers they can do that. So you know the dealer's like, well, they said I could do it. Why are you telling me different? You know, so it's, it's interesting for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean it's even more interesting because that directly violates Visa's 3% gap. You know, I mean that's the thing that you know, even allowing somebody to go above it. You know, I mean maybe there's some secret shoppers out there, maybe not, but I find that interesting that that's also an opportunity where you find people doing things incorrectly in the space that could actually cause. I mean, last Visa find I looked at it was extraordinary. So you know, I mean it could be a real problem.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that one thing I talked to you about a couple weeks ago, where there's a big player out there that's doing rebates, so they're way overcharging the dealer and then cutting them in on their profits, the dealer and then cutting them in on their profits. I just think that's ruining it, ruining the whole system and how it's supposed to work. You know, just just give these people like competitive rates and make money. Don't be dishonest, don't do stuff like that, because again it goes back to that reputation. So that's that's the industry reputation I fight every day. Is these, these salespeople or companies out there that are, you know, just making fools of themselves?
Speaker 1:in my opinion, yeah, well, I think it'll get obsoleted to a certain degree. I mean, I feel as though there will. I mean the auto dealership space, all dealers like I don't know much about. I don't really pay attention when I drive around all that much, to be honest with you, because I basically drive around in the area I grew up in, but I don't pay attention to dealerships all that much except if I go to service my vehicle, and so you mentioned motorcycle dealership. I mean there's all sorts of dealerships that I don't even think of.
Speaker 3:There's probably like tractor dealerships, I mean it could be, rv sales is a big one.
Speaker 1:Totally dude, like I don't even think about it as much, but I think it's very creative what you've come up with with dealer pay. I know I work with you so like I actually watch your mind work and your innovation actually watch your mind work and your innovation and I'm consistently impressed with it's really nice to see somebody operating at a high level every day. I mean that's part of the great part about my job is that I'm a lawyer. Most lawyers are horrible business people they won't tell you, but that's the truth and to get to work with really dynamic businesses such as dealer pay and see how you, as their leader, identifies different areas that most times. So here's my plug for dealer pay.
Speaker 1:Most of the time that I talk to Julie about dealer pay, it's because one of her customers has brought an issue to her attention that she does not know. The answer to that involves something legal and that we have not discussed. And she can call me and I can tell her what I think. If I know and if I don't which very often I don't then I have to go and research it. But the cool part about that is that dealer pay listens to its customers and is actually trying to find answers and solutions for them. And I know that because the work that comes to me from dealer pay is all about questions from customers that are using our service or going to use our service that they don't know. And she dutifully wants to answer those questions and make dealer pay better. So I will plug you there because I do see where all that comes from and I find it impressive that you listen to your clients because they know your product probably better than you do in ways.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. And my theory to that is if one dealership has this question or problem or concern, or maybe they want something new, there's a good chance many more do as well. So that's kind of the thought behind it.
Speaker 1:I said we use the software. I had two things in the billing module for the software system that we use that I thought every single law firm out there of any size would want it. It was something that they would use. It was if you wanted the no charge time within the same. Like, say, somebody works five hours on something and you want to give half of that away in the system that we use. If I want to do that, I have to either no charge the whole thing or duplicate.
Speaker 1:So I went to them and I said, hey, could you do this, and can you do it so that it calculates I want to no charge this portion and then it calculates a total with the no charge and the build time. And they said no. And I said, okay, well, everybody would want this. And they said no. I said, can I create it? They said no, yeah, I mean, it's rocket matter if anybody wants to know the name of that software. So then I went to them and I said, well, look, what would make my life a lot easier is if I could just duplicate the transaction by hitting a button and then all I have to do is change the time and make it no charge. You know what that got? No, gotta know. Nope, yeah, totally.
Speaker 1:Jeremy was with me on this one because we do like he would help me with the billing and he would see it. And he was like, yeah, would, this would make it so much easier. And I'm like, and it amazed me that they said no, because I said, look, I don't even want anything. It says in our contract you get all the enhancements, no problem, right, like it amazed me.
Speaker 1:And I do appreciate, based on my experiences as a customer, especially around software, I do appreciate the fact that you really listen and I think that that's probably throughout your organization, because I do believe that the way that you operate the people that you hire, they'll emulate that modeling. And then I also think that you're identifying the people that kind of like you know fit the mold, and so I think it's good that you guys do that. That's my big plug for dealer pay. Yeah, for sure, I'm always impressed by that and I'm always impressed by you and I appreciate working with you. And you know, give us your closing thoughts about what you would want to put out there, out into the podcast world, of what you would like to say about anything but primarily dealer pay.
Speaker 2:Sure. So you know just of my career's experience in, and continue to evolve it and make new fun things that generate revenue. But yes, I like money, we all like money but I also like that I can provide something that also helps my primary clients or my customers also make money.
Speaker 1:And you know if you're selling a car and you're providing an estimate on a repair or it's not one size fits all with all of this stuff, so the laws associated with it, from like the first time you see a cost associated with the dealership till you actually get to the checkout, right, there's a lot that takes place, that that in and of itself, like all of the advertising laws, and I mean it's really kind of crazy.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 3:Awesome. Well you guys, it's been a great conversation. I want to thank you for listening this long to the Payments Experts podcast. We've had our special guest, julie Douglas with DealerPay. Please go find them. They are great friends of Global Legal Law Firm. Chris, thank you for joining us today in studio. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Payments Experts podcast, a podcast of Global Legal Law Firm. Visit us online today at globallegallawfirmcom.