#60 How Do I... Give Feedback That Builds People Up?

Ever feel a little anxious giving feedback, and worry it won’t land the way you intended? In this “How Do I…” episode of Be the Sun, Not the Salt, Dr. Harry Cohen and Connie Fontaine dig into the art of offering feedback that truly lifts people up and helps them grow.

Here’s what you’ll hear:

• Why feedback is more than just pointing out what went wrong—and how to make it a gift people actually appreciate
• The importance of “accountability with love,” and how holding people to high standards doesn’t mean being harsh or negative
• Candid stories and lessons from the workplace, family, and everyday life about giving feedback that inspires, not deflates
• How leading with what’s great sets the stage for honest conversation and positive change
• Simple guidelines to make feedback more constructive, easier to hear… and even welcome (!)

If you’ve ever wanted to turn tricky conversations into uplifting moments—or make people say, “thank you, I needed that”—this episode breaks down the subtle skills and playful spirit of feedback done right.

(Mini “How Do I…” episode, perfect for anyone working on communication, mentorship, parenting, or leadership.) 

To explore the book, or for more episodes, information, tips and tools to live a more heliotropic life, visit us at bethesunnotthesalt.com and find us on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn and TikTok.

Transcript

[00:00:00] 

Harry Cohen: So welcome to our Be the Sun, not the Salt podcast. This is another in our series, how, how, how, how Can We Practice Being Heliotropic? And this topic is giving feedback that builds other people up. I'm joined by my co-host, Connie Fontaine, chief super spreader and she is an expert at giving feedback that builds people up.

Connie Fontaine: I definitely, I don't know if I ever feel like an expert because I continue to learn, you know, this is, this is one, and, and I feel really blessed that I get this opportunity to continue to mentor and lead and, and do this at that, at my stage of career. But it's an art, um, and it's an art that I would, I would recommend everyone get really good at it and feel good.

And I think feedback requires, we're talking about work, we're talking about with our kids, with our spouses. Um, this is something you learn even at, at the cashier with the cashier at the grocery store.

Harry Cohen: And, and feedback. You know, when someone says, I wanna give you some feedback, it immediately gets your, [00:01:00] your hair on the back of your neck standing up because it usually sounds like, oh, you want to just give me some constructive feedback?

Connie Fontaine: And it's gonna be immediately negative. Like

Harry Cohen: Well, yeah,

Connie Fontaine: sometimes

Harry Cohen: yeah.

Connie Fontaine: is very negative,

Harry Cohen: And this specifically is feedback that builds people up, which may include the way you're doing something is suboptimal, could be better, but we're what we're remembering, and here's the way to think about it, for me anyway, which is, which is what is the goal?

The goal is the person walks away going, thank you. I'm really glad you told me that.

Connie Fontaine: Mm-hmm.

Harry Cohen: use that.

Connie Fontaine: Right.

Harry Cohen: You said it and you deliver it in a way that I really appreciate you telling me. Nobody usually tells me stuff like that, and I really appreciate it. So that's what you're after. You're after the person going, damn, that was hard to hear, perhaps, but I'm really glad you told me.

Connie Fontaine: Accountability with love.

Harry Cohen: That's right.

Connie Fontaine: about that a lot with [00:02:00] our team that we work with at Holman. This is a feedback. And holding people accountable isn't, doesn't mean you're being mean. It means you are giving a gift. If you do it well,

Harry Cohen: That's right.

Connie Fontaine: a gift to the person, to your point, something that's actionable, something that's concrete, and I think that's the, some of the principles of good feedback.

Let's talk about that. I mean, one, it's, it has to be specific. Um, two, I think it should be timely. That's

Harry Cohen: Yep.

Connie Fontaine: of the things that in corporate America and, and maybe in general, we have a tendency to wanna, that we, some people have a tendency to want to delay that feedback because it's uncomfortable to provide feedback and it's, you're not doing that person a service to wait and let them continue to do something that maybe is rubbing people the wrong way.

For

Harry Cohen: Or rubbing you the wrong way. Look.

Connie Fontaine: rubbing you the wrong way. Yeah. 'cause it impacts your relationship.

Harry Cohen: Yep. So the how do you give feedback? First of all, you have to really think about it to your point, how can I deliver this message in a way that will land and go in? And there's lots of ways to do it. But first you [00:03:00] start with an internal, I have to tell this person something.

I want to tell this person something that will uplift them. Okay? So that's number one. Number two, what could I say and how could I say it briefly, concisely, in a timely manner. That they would go. Got it. That I can immediately use. It's not character, it's not in, in general. It's, you know, you always, none of that.

Let me tell you something that will help you to be better after this conversation. One of the phrases and word tracks that I've used in, in professional. Context is I want to talk to you about something that's small, but it's not so small that I can ignore it. I don't want you to ignore it. It's small, but I don't want you to make it bigger than it is.

I want you to make it as simple as small and reasonable as you can get it. Like, oh, okay, so here's the thing that you are doing or did that I think you could do better, [00:04:00] and I know you can 'cause I've seen you do it. This is how I think you could do this more effectively, at least for me. Um, and I think for the organization.

But, um, keep it sim, keep it simple. Keep it concise, keep it behaviorally, keep it timely.

Connie Fontaine: Mm-hmm.

Harry Cohen: don't make it bigger or smaller than it need be.

Connie Fontaine: Right. And if you have a recommendation or you have like the, and this would be better if I, because sometimes it's easier to leave somebody thinking about it themselves, but it's not better for them. And I would say that one of the other ways to give feedback in I, I. I personally think that this is the best way, if you can, some ways you have to jump.

Sometimes you have to, from an urgency standpoint, you have to jump right in and be direct. But also if it's around a presentation, you and I had this conversation once I have gotten to know you so well, I have a tendency to be like, well, he knows he is really good. So I jump right into, Hey, next time I do it this way.

And you're like, oh, thanks, you know, thanks for the great, uh, uplifting [00:05:00] feedback. And the reality is you should always, if you can start with what's great.

Harry Cohen: And mean it.

Connie Fontaine: love Yes. And me well, yeah, right. It's gotta be authentic. Otherwise it's gonna come across, they're gonna smell it right away. But I love the way that you presented this material.

It was organized, it was succinct. Um, one of the one thing I'd recommend for the future, if you did it this way, this would work so much better for you in the way you deliver

Harry Cohen: That's a perfect.

Connie Fontaine: much better than jumping right in and, you know, have you walked off stage? And I would've said, well, I've got this small thing.

I wanna, I, I preferred the way you coached me to say no. How about you say, good job, and

Harry Cohen: Right.

Connie Fontaine: do it this week next

Harry Cohen: So the giving feedback after a presentation is really easy if you understand how to do it.

Connie Fontaine: Mm-hmm.

Harry Cohen: what I absolutely loved about your presentation with great specificity. Now, if you want, and if you're interested, a couple of things I think would make it much better. Let me give 'em to you. But don't forget, on on, on whole, it was fantastic or it was good.

It was great, it was, it was [00:06:00] wonderful. And that's the way you deliver in my mind, really useful, constructive, good, uplifting feedback. I've gotten so much feedback on my giving of feedback to people who have given presentations. I've done that for many, many years, and. You know, you basically, you state some of the most obvious and simple and easy to do things so that it's not a bridge too far.

You're not saying, why can't you be taller? You know what I

Connie Fontaine: Well,

Harry Cohen: mean?

Connie Fontaine: think contextually about who the person

Harry Cohen: Mm-hmm.

Connie Fontaine: Right. It has to be actionable, but we, one of the things that I think we also need to consider, especially you and I, we deal with all levels of people. So we're giving feedback to senior executives. We're giving feedback to people who are junior or new to us, and I think I'm always a little more cautious if it's somebody who is not used to receiving feedback, especially direct, timely.

It's to remind them. I'm somebody who does this. I, are you interested in feedback right now or I would like to provide some feedback. Are you open to hearing some [00:07:00] right now? And also, I, I say I'm, I'm someone who loves to give feedback. I, I really want you to be better. I'm on your, on your side. I'm on your team.

This is meant to be something that's a gift and I think that that helps people who are not used to it. Senior executives are like, it's a little more water off their back usually. Um, but I think it matters who that person is, how we handle it.

Harry Cohen: And feedback is such a loaded word, so. You can, you can over index on. I really want you to get what I'm trying to give you. 'cause I know feedback sounds so negative, but I don't want this to be negative. I want you to be uplifted after this conversation. Why not start with the end? I really want you to feel great after this conversation.

That is my intention and it's my job to. To deliver that, not your job to receive what I'm telling you. I gotta make you [00:08:00] feel great because that is my job, my purpose, my intention. Now let's see if I can deliver that.

Connie Fontaine: Right now, we do that better at work than we do at home sometimes with, with kids as they were growing up. And, but we're, we're much more dialed in at work. And I guess I'd, I'd recommend we all think about this. This is with our partners, with our friends, with our, with our kids, no matter who it is.

Harry Cohen: Yeah, I, I can't redo my parenting feedback sessions, man. Oh man. I wish I could, 'cause I would've way more done what we're talking about. Literally said, listen, I wanna tell you something and I want you to feel great after this. And it might, might not be easy to hear, but it's small, but I don't wanna make it unimportant.

Please say please and thank you to the server. Please. You know, it's important for you, for me, for them, for the world. Now my kids do that now. They're not kids, they're grownups, but so many things I could have done better. That's okay. I can still do a [00:09:00] good job of improving the way I give feedback to uplift people.

Period.

Connie Fontaine: That's right, and that's the point of these sessions for us and for our listeners, is to just get better every day. And we're, we're still not, we're still not experts. We're still work in progress and hope you listen along with us and, and continue to grow and share as well. So thank you for listening.