Navigating Food, Body Image, Diet Culture, and Mental Health with Amanda a licensed counselor and registered dietitian

If you are a mom navigating her health and wellness in the sea of being raised in diet culture- SAME. 

Amanda and I have a conversation about how societal pressures and cultural narratives often distort our understanding of health, reducing it to a number on a scale. Instead, we explore how to raise future generations with a more empowering perspective on body image.

We touch on intuitive eating and mindful living, emphasizing that the journey to self-acceptance is far more important than chasing perfection. It's about tuning in to what our bodies truly need, not succumbing to external ideals. 

As we unpack the harmful effects of diet culture and then the swing to perfectionism and intense rigidity with food, Amanda advocates for shifting away from self-criticism and embracing personal growth. With insights on moving beyond black-and-white thinking, we offer a balanced approach to food and exercise that nurtures both mental and physical health. 

About Amanda:

Amanda is a licensed therapist and registered dietitian. I started my counseling career at an inpatient adult eating disorders rehab center that was wonderful. I lived through the 90s and 2000s as a young woman in a family of mostly women in the pre professional dance world. Luckily I didnt have a high level eating disorder but definitely learned some disordered eating patterns and body messages that I’ve healed through personal work, education, and the beautiful experience of helping and watching wonderful women also heal.

Where to connect with Amanda:

Website

Chapter Markers:

00:02 Navigating Food and Body Relationships
09:38 Empowering Body and Food Relationships
18:26 Understanding Food and Body Narratives
31:49 Exploring Nutrition and Body Connection
41:06 Transforming Food and Body Relationships
47:33 Navigating Body Respect and Nourishment
01:00Unpacking Diet Culture and Mental Health

Chapters

• 0:02 Navigating Food and Body Relationships
• 9:38 Empowering Body and Food Relationships
• 18:26 Understanding Food and Body Narratives
• 31:49 Exploring Nutrition and Body Connection
• 41:06 Transforming Food and Body Relationships
• 47:33 Navigating Body Respect and Nourishment
• 1:00:06 Unpacking Diet Culture and Mental Health

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:02

Welcome to the Motherhood Mentor Podcast. I'm Becca, a somatic healing practitioner and a holistic life coach for moms, and this podcast is for you. You can expect honest conversations and incredible guests that speak to health, healing and growth in every area of our lives. This isn't just strategy for what we do. It's support for who we are. I believe we can be wildly ambitious while still holding all of our soft and hard humanity as holy. I love combining deep inner healing with strategic systems and no-nonsense talk about what this season is really like. So grab whatever weird health beverage you're currently into and let's get into it.

Speaker 1: 0:43

Welcome to today's episode of the Motherhood Mentor Podcast. Today I have Amanda with me and I am so excited for this conversation. I met Amanda I think we met at a networking event where we like briefly talked at a table, like barely met each other, but then it was one of the next events where we really got talking about what you do and we started talking about food and body image and we just clicked, and so I'm so excited to have Amanda here today. We are going to talk about our relationship to food and our bodies and all of the nuance and the depth that goes into it, because for so many of us it's not just simple and easy of what to do, what not to do. So, amanda, will you take a minute and introduce yourself just what you do and kind of how you got into it?

Speaker 2: 1:34

Okay, I'm Amanda, I am a therapist, I'm a licensed counselor and I'm a registered dietitian. I began this a long time ago. My interest in nutrition came from probably at least middle school and on. My dad was diagnosed with diabetes when I was 14, and so that became an interest for me of how to help or like just hearing about it and how he was like having carbs but a lot of just I wouldn't say there was a lot of body talk, but there was just awareness of attractiveness level and I was also the youngest, so I unfortunately compared myself to my siblings at times and so I kind of was aware that like bodies were different and different shapes and sizes. And then I was also a dancer and athlete. So I even read books about like how to support your like dancing energy levels, like how to make sure you're, you know, have enough energy to do everything you need to do and getting enough protein for muscle high school and then just kind of going into that and then I will say going into college, I so there's a lot of parts to it. I knew I wanted to help people and I liked the medical field and science kind of area and but I didn't want to be a nurse and I wanted it to be done for me in four years. At that point, when I was like 18, I was like four years is good and I can go do what I want to do. Um, and so I really liked nutrition and helping people. I was already interested in it, um, oh, and I also say I when I was dancing with the like junior company my senior year of high school. One of my classmates, friends, one of her moms, was a dietitian and helped people with eating disorders. Um, so I connected with her and she was an ex-dancer so it was like a lot of like connection and mentorship. She was a very like she was a great lady. Um, so I got into nutrition because of just helping people, science and four years, honestly. And then, once I got into it, I really enjoyed it. I liked how nutrition impacts everything. I loved helping people.

Speaker 2: 4:38

My favorite was outpatient nutrition and that was right around when people were starting to require master's level education for dietetics and I was like and the master's program where I was was very similar. I felt like to the undergrad program, with just maybe a few more like papers and projects and maybe a couple more courses, and I was like, well, I don't want to do the same thing and I feel like counseling would make me a better outpatient. You know, nutrition motivator for change? Cause I knew nutrition was often sometimes about knowledge but often it wasn't about the knowledge level of a person. So I went to counseling and I loved it. It's just like connecting with people, helping people heal. I don't know, it's just, it's definitely my natural place to be and I that dietician I knew I interned for nutrition and then they loved me and then they had me interned for counseling Um and it was at an adult eating disorder rehab center.

Speaker 2: 5:48

So I interned there and then worked there for four and a half years as a therapist and did you know process groups, body image groups, I did. I did a little bit of the nutrition support. I was not a dietitian role, um, because they had separate, you know boundaries for that, just for the client's needs Um. But I was very involved in that and like could support if I needed to Um. So that's where all of that started. And then, as I've grown um, I've just continued to stay in that area because I enjoy it and I will say I do. I mean, I think it's a super important area and I'm very lucky to have had the training I had with it. But a lot of counselors don't know what to do with it, so I'm glad that that is my area and I enjoy it and I know how to work with people with disordered eating and body image.

Speaker 1: 6:47

Well, I'm curious too, as someone who's had disordered eating, different types of disordered eating.

Speaker 1: 6:55

It's been interesting for me, you know, as a coach nutrition or eating or body image often comes up with women, or eating or body image often comes up with women, and I think I have yet to meet a single woman who doesn't have at least some sort of part of her that doesn't feel healthy in this area.

Speaker 1: 7:15

And when I say healthy, I don't just mean like physically, I mean like mentally and emotionally, the way that she relates to her body or to food or to body image. So like there's the like, the health of her body, and then there's also this, the body image, which can be very connected, but they can also, you know, be two different goals for the woman. But it's so fascinating for me of how many women struggle with food on such a wide variety, but not even outside of like, even outside of having an eating disorder or disordered eating. I think our culture in general, I don't even think women know. So I'm curious if you work specifically with women with disordered eating or you also work with women who are just wanting to change their relationship to the body and food, because I've met a lot of women who they're not like drowning, they're not struggling, but they're like I can tell I emotionally eat, or I can tell the way that I'm eating isn't serving me, or they're running on coffee or things like that. I'm curious who you work with specifically.

Speaker 2: 8:27

So eating disorders are like the clinical level diagnoses like anorexia, bulimia, orthorexia, binge eating disorder kind of thing. I can work with those people but if they need a higher level, I usually honestly refer them to somebody. Um, I prefer the people that maybe have disordered eating of like maybe they emotionally eat. They don't always treat their body in a loving way. Um, they need to figure out their balance of like health, physical health and mental health, like that's also part of how I think about. Food is like food is for nourishing your body and your soul. So it's kind of finding that place of if I'm worried about food all the time for nourishing my body, what is that doing to my mental health and to my soul? So kind of finding that balance for people is what I really like to do.

Speaker 2: 9:25

I like to do, I like to work with people who are probably like a lot of your clients of um, I feel okay in my body, but I know that I don't. I hold myself back because I feel not quite right or I still have these messages that I hold on to, even though I don't want to. I want to like figure this out and like let go of them or maybe they don't feel like they have really bad body image, but they do kind of feel like, you know, if I lose weight, things will be better, and you know that that is not usually the case. Um, I will say I was like I'm also not against weight loss, Like if it's for certain people, if they have a medical need, and, um, like it's something that does feel better, especially if it's like they it's.

Speaker 2: 10:20

I'll go into this too. But, like in intuitive eating, sometimes people gain weight, Sometimes they stay the same, Sometimes they lose weight just because they're having a, they're doing a better job of listening to their body and responding to it in a loving way. Yeah, but that's not guaranteed either, you know, for any individual. So I will just say like I like to work with people, um, that maybe need help and want to heal their relationship with their body and food, but it might not look like a certain type of eating disorder.

Speaker 1: 10:54

Yeah, can we just talk about that for a minute? Just the like the. There's a commentary I feel like in our culture there's a commentary I feel like in our culture where I feel like there's. You know, I think I think our, our culture likes to create these like black and white camps.

Speaker 1: 11:12

And I've struggled so much because I remember when I had my daughter, I remember looking at her and as she, as she started to get older, I remember thinking she's going to see not just how I speak about her body and teach her about her body, she's going to see how I treat my body.

Speaker 1: 11:31

She's going to see how I talk about my body, how I think about my body, how I dress my body, how I feed my body, and I was like I want her to learn how to love herself from how I love myself and it just kind of I feel like that was around the time when body positivity was kind of starting to be a bigger movement.

Speaker 1: 11:49

But I remember seeing the body positive and being like well, I want to love my body, but I've spent an entire lifetime hating my body, but mostly just completely disassociated from my body as more than just a thing, as more than just an object Like my body for sure was an object for me before birth, but I got frustrated because it felt like I was also beginning to be obsessed with health and nutrition at that time, and it felt like I wasn't allowed to be honest about how I felt about my body and someone helped me from there. It's like people telling me to just love my body didn't actually help me learn how to love my body. It just made me feel worse for not liking my body. So I'm just curious what your thoughts are when it comes to women and our bodies and health and weight loss and how those all intersect how those all intersect weight loss, body image and health.

Speaker 2: 12:51

I would say that, um, I feel like if you are in a place that's honoring your body and your mental health, um, your body will probably go to a set point generally of like, if you are, you have learned to kind of balance your nutrients, to cut in a way that listens to your body, that you feel satisfied and not in like an obsessive macro counting kind of way, and then and then moving in a way that feels good to your body. And again, not like a rigid type of way, but knowing that like maybe some days I don't feel like going for a walk, but I also know that my like mentally, I feel better after I go for a walk and even just like your joints and muscles might feel better after going for a walk. So kind of listening to your mental and physical response to food and activity is where I feel like people are. I would love people to get to. But the whole weight loss part is it's just I kind of I look at people based on health, not weight, I would say.

Speaker 2: 14:10

And so if there is a difficulty with your physical and mental health that you need specific guidance with, that might be a place to go from and then whatever happens to your body from, that is probably where your body might need to be when you're in a healthier place physically and mentally. But if you're pushing yourself past that where it causes strain on you physically or mentally like you're working out so much that like you're exhausted all the time because you've gone too far or you start having knee pain because your joints are overworked or something that's like a physical part of it, or if you just feel so much stress about if you miss a day, yeah, like that's not good for your mental health part of it either. Yeah, so that's like it's kind of responding to your physical and mental needs with exercise and then like the same thing with food, of generally knowing that like maybe if I have protein, like because protein is huge right now, right, if I have some protein at breakfast, yes, that does help me with my amino acids and my you know brain hormone chemicals. It also helps with muscle growth. That's great.

Speaker 2: 15:40

But then if I have a carb with fiber in it too, that gives me energy plus good gut health. Right, and focus for the brain, because your brain is fueled on carbs and then fats give you the satiety part of it, as well as a lot of the other mental health, hormone production and other things for your body. And then I'm trying to. I did protein, carbs, fat, fiber.

Speaker 1: 16:08

Yeah, so I've did all of them.

Speaker 2: 16:09

So if you have all those things, that's great and you can kind of respond to your body in that way. But then there's also those days where you might not be able to get all those things right or you might not feel like those things, and that's okay too. Like I do generally try to have like those things in my food and I'm a very millennial classic. I love an avocado, toast and eggs, yes, fruit or something you know. But some days I don't feel like making it or that doesn't sound good and so like maybe I'll have a bagel and cream cheese and that has some fat and a little protein in the cream cheese and then like a little from the grains and I'm satisfied when I have that. But then I kind of know that I'll probably be hungrier a little earlier and so that day I'll just have a snack, kind of responding to my body in that way and knowing that it's okay to have like I, I would like this, and responding to it that way.

Speaker 1: 17:06

And what you just shared feels so simple and easy. But I want to get I'm like curious if you resonate with this what I'm hearing from you underneath what you're saying, is that you trust your body and you trust yourself to make those decisions. Because what I see a lot of women do and I think our culture created this space, especially with women and our bodies and eating that we don't trust our bodies, we don't trust our hunger, we don't trust our fullness, we don't trust our cravings, we can't tell if what we want is emotional or physical. But ultimately, I think so many women are looking to someone outside of themselves to say you tell me exactly what, when and how to eat. And there's such like a disconnection and disassociation with body where it's like when you are connected to your body and you trust yourself, you will know how things make you feel. And if you can learn to be kind to yourself and care for yourself and parent yourself, you'll be able to know when that choice serves you and when it doesn't, so much so that, like you, don't have to overthink it. And I think a lot of women want these quick, easy fixes for weight, for body, for health, and I have learned that changing the relationship to my body and food.

Speaker 1: 18:26

Food isn't like a thing and I don't like. I love food, I'm a foodie, but like there's not this obsessiveness, there's not this like constant confusion. It doesn't take a bunch of mental or emotional energy for me to eat things or not eat things, or how much of things, or when or how. It's like there's this deep sense of peace and trust and that's that's saying a lot for someone who, like that was one of my primary coping mechanisms was restriction or binging on food. Like that was my go to for a very long time, both in disordered ways but also just in very like most people would probably have laughed it off of. Like oh, what's the big deal if you're not over binging? But it's like well, it didn't feel good and it wasn't meeting what I actually needed. Like it Brene Brown once I can't remember if it was in one of her books, but she talked about like you can't get enough of what you don't need and that was like oh, that's sugar for me.

Speaker 1: 19:20

Like because when I'm eating sugar, not to enjoy it but to, you know, eat my emotions if you will, it's not what I actually want, it's not what I actually need it's this bandaid for me. And until I actually dealt with that, until I had understanding and worked through some of that part, it didn't matter how many people told me what to do and what not to do with sugar. I couldn't feel in my own body what was happening before, during and after, and I couldn't trust myself with it because I was again. It was almost trying to like fix my body disassociation with more disassociation of like here you tell me what to do instead of like wait, my body knows, my body wants me to be healthy. My being wants me to be healthy. My like, my being wants me to be healthy. How do I create that?

Speaker 1: 20:07

So I'm curious when you start working with women, where do you usually start? Like, how do you help someone who's struggling with food or body image and obviously, like, those can be two very separate things. But let's say someone comes to you and they want to work all these things Where's? Where's like a really good place for them to start?

Speaker 2: 20:32

So that's what is tricky about food is because it's like something you have to do every day, right? So we can't just like separate and take a break.

Speaker 1: 20:40

Yeah, you can't just like stop drinking.

Speaker 2: 20:42

You can't stop, so usually the hunger scales the lower numbers are hungry hunger and the higher numbers are fullness level. So zero is like you are having sounds come out of your stomach because it's so it's growling, because it's so hungry. Right, um, one is pretty hungry and you're empty. Like two is like usually a pretty good place to start. Two to like three or four, and then five is medium and I would say seven to eight is like satisfied, and then 10, it might be overly full. So I try to get people to like start thinking about a hunger scale, of where they are in their hunger and then slow down when they're eating and be a little more mindful while they're eating about how things are tasting and going and kind of, because there's also the habits of like cleaning the plate and so it's kind of like okay, do I really want those last two bites or is that just like a not wasteful message I've held when that's really not being wasteful because it's two bites, it's not going to feed anybody and it's just making you feel uncomfortable, you know, or even what, what, what not um.

Speaker 2: 22:12

And then I will try to like work with people on looking at um, like is it a true hunger, is it a emotional hunger? Um, and clarifying that and then, if it is an emotional hunger, like doing the thing that actually will help them, um, you know, with whether that be like I'm, maybe I'm exhausted and tired and I'm trying to eat for energy because your body will do that, and so I'm like maybe you need to like nap or go for a minute, or maybe you're tired and need energy, but maybe you need to go out in the sunshine, or or there's an emotion happening that like you're frustrated with a situation, with your family or work, and maybe that might even just be like voicing it and be like okay, family, I'm getting frustrated because you know, I don't know no one's listening and I'm trying to communicate what we need to do. Yeah, and I'm feeling frustrated. Can you like talk to me for a minute?

Speaker 1: 23:14

So this slowing. So I'm hearing like slowing down and kind of building awareness that's in your body and your mind while it's happening and not just like this over. I think a lot of women get overwhelmed because they, like they try to do all of it at once and they try to change everything without understanding why this thing is happening in the first place. Can just slow down and figure out what's creating the symptoms. Like if we don't see the symptoms as a problem but as different signs to like what might be going on, we might be able to actually figure out what you need and how you can get it. Like that is so much simpler and so much easier and so much less intense. I'm curious, you mentioned the like not wasteful and clearing the plate and I was just like ooh, can we talk about that for a minute of like? You know, I was raised in a house who, in their best intentions, it was like finish your plate and drink your full glass of milk, like that was, like that was, that was just what that generation did, like they were doing their best on what they knew.

Speaker 1: 24:23

And as an adult, I remember one time I was listening to someone who talked about decluttering your home and she was like your home is not a trash dump. Like you've already bought the thing, so you keeping it is not preventing other people. Like it's not preventing the waste. The waste has already happened, it's already in your home. You just get to decide. Is your home more or less valuable than the like the dump?

Speaker 1: 24:48

Like, and because this was talking to people who were like over consuming things and all of a sudden I realized, like me, not eating this food is not preventing it from go to waste, like it's, it's gonna either go in the trash can or go down the toilet later, which I know sounds so gross. But to me this was revolutionary. It seemed like such a simple thing, but like and also realizing food on my plate didn't actually feed children who didn't have food. There was this weird thing of like you should eat what's on your plate because other kids don't have it, which I don't think teaches children gratitude. It taught me how to feel guilty. It taught me how to feel guilty and overconsume, and so I'm curious what other like cultural narratives tend to show up around food and body that are just kind of sneaky.

Speaker 2: 25:40

The wasteful one. There's that one and I will say like we briefly hit the like if I'm smaller, I'll be happier, things will be better. But even I think people have kind of grown from that and not necessarily being sized, luckily, we're around like a little more body types in 20 years, like compared to the 90s, and people are more about like, like getting their muscle strength and everything. But I do think there's still this part of like I have to be the best version of me and so I think that even comes into play of like um, so it's like I'm being physically and mentally healthy, but I'm a little bit honestly, too in tune with it and I didn't become worried about that. And like you're strong and you're healthy, but you think you need to be I don't know more cut or something.

Speaker 2: 26:40

Yeah, you know, like a perfectionism, perfectionism thing that still happens, even though it's not necessarily about losing weight. There's still like a perfectionism level of trying to always better yourself or in some way. And then I, you know, definitely think there's that whole line of whole foods and health, based on what type of food you're eating, which, again, every dietitian you know will say, yes, like it's good to have, you know whole foods, some fiber, fruit and vegetables, protein. However, like having something that you want that maybe isn't a specific whole food, is also very normal and acceptable and okay for your body. I think the nuance of extremes, or like having balance, is very difficult for people.

Speaker 1: 27:50

Yeah, I have a perfect example of just the extremes of. I mean I even struggle with this. I would, I will say, like this is still something that I'm still trying to figure out where balance is, especially with my kids, because it's really important to me as a family that I'm teaching them about nutrition. I'm teaching them about food as medicine, and I mean I mean that in like not just like the nutrition, but also like culturally and also just like I don't want there to be foods that are bad or cheating or like that you're afraid of or that are like off limits. But I also don't want to just give my children all these things that I know won't make them feel good. So I'm like trying to teach them about food, how it makes us feel when we're hungry, when we're full, eating things that are treats, that like really it's not nutrition, like it's a treat and it's fun, but it like it's not actually great for your body. But what I, what I will say, is that like, I still struggle between that balance, because I think, especially when my I know, when my, when my daughter was born, I was like I was extreme to the point of like, pretty intense anxiety of like what are we going to do when she goes to this game and they're giving her like I was paralyzed and panicked about her having these Gatorades, gatorades and the like food coloring and the sugar right after sports? I mean, these are like I mean one.

Speaker 1: 29:15

I still think it's strange and not great for our kids that we're like here you're playing sports and instead of the sports being the thing that we celebrate, it's like here's a snack and a treat that doesn't actually feel your body as an athlete in any way, shape or form.

Speaker 1: 29:33

But without going into that, I like have this struggle between teaching my kids about nutrition and then also not being hard on it, and I mean even myself. I have pretty high standards and values and expectations, but I'm also trying to work within reality of our culture and not always be so stressed, because it's always the straw that breaks the camel's back. And I'm in a season where I'm like there's got to be some straws, where I find some give and take, where I try to find like 80, 90%, I don't know. So does that like? I'm just curious, how do we find that balance, especially when, like everything is bad for you these days? I swear like if social media would just like leave me the hell alone. Stop telling me that things that I thought were healthy or unhealthy, because it's impossible.

Speaker 2: 30:25

So I was going to go there earlier too.

Speaker 2: 30:28

I don't know what I was going to say. I was going to say a lot of healing. Your relationship with food is challenging some food myths that people have taught you Ooh yeah, and so I think there's a lot of that that goes into it too of like, like it's not going to change your body to have carbohydrates, or, you know, if you eat when you're like, if you snack, you know so many times a day or whatever, I don't know it's not going to, like, make your metabolism go awry because you're eating too often or whatever, or you're not eating enough or?

Speaker 2: 31:05

you're not eating, like there's a rule, every direction, and so I think there's a good place of finding what works for your body and you as an individual is important and dispelling some food myths. And then part of that is, like you said, like everything could be not good for you or whatever now Depending on who you ask.

Speaker 2: 31:24

And so I think there's a lot of looking at the myths of that and like the levels, like granted, yes, like they have shown, and it's not, it's like there is, and it's like a class two carcinogen or whatever. You know, astrotame is not the best right, um, but the level, it was one done on rats, so it's not on human tests, you know. And then two, I think it was literally like you'd have to drink a 24 pack of diet soda a day for it to have any effect on you.

Speaker 1: 31:59

I'm really, really glad that you chose that, because I forgot to mention that. Like, that's one of my like, I'm very crunchy. Like I'm, I'm pretty high on the scale of like the things I will and will not do. And yet, like, when I tell you that, like my husband's, he'll laugh at this. He's constantly sending me things lately about diet soda and I just like friendly, joking middle finger, but also not of like, leave me alone with my diet Dr Pepper.

Speaker 1: 32:27

Okay, like one to two diet Dr Pepper Okay, like one to two diet Dr Peppers is probably a lot better than alcohol and I don't drink. So it's like, or I feel like this is okay for me of all of the things that I don't have. But at the same time, I would have said the same things years ago and there's been seasons in my life where I've taken things out and then added back in and seen how it's treated me. And I've taken diet soda out for months at a time and I'm like I feel fine when I drink it. So I don't know, is it terrible for me Maybe, but also it makes me really freaking happy when I have a diet.

Speaker 2: 33:04

That's where I'm like. If it's not causing you issues you're not. You're not drinking 24 and giving yourself excessive amounts of caffeine, which that would be an issue Um, but it's probably okay for you physically. It's not giving, it's not toxic, it's like you know people like to say, and it brings you a little like minimal joy. That's fine, but to be fair.

Speaker 1: 33:28

There are experts who will say that like you're literally drinking poison and like that is you know. But I just I'm at a place in my life where it's like something's got to give and to me it's like I am not going to be perfect and I'm not going to try to be perfect. I'm going to do the best I can, while also allowing myself permission to still live, and for me it's like that doesn't feel problematic. At this time in my life my health feels pretty good. So if at some point I start going, huh, things don't feel great, I'll experiment with it and see how it goes. But yeah, it's. It's tricky, though, because then there's this other part of me and it's like, well, what if this is doing long-term damage? And I'm ignoring it. But then I don't know. It's one of those tricky things.

Speaker 2: 34:14

Yes, I mean, I think it's a balance of like having good food, making dinners with your family. That used to be like one of the biggest predictors of family health was if you ate dinner together. Ooh, physically and mentally, and it wasn't like what you made, it was that you ate dinner together, that you ate dinner together.

Speaker 1: 34:37

One of my new favorite things is I got these candlesticks. Granted, my kids are older, so this might not work for younger kids, I don't know, but we've started having candlelight dinners.

Speaker 2: 34:52

We're not doing anything else differently, nothing.

Speaker 1: 34:54

The food hasn't changed. The children's behavior mostly doesn't change. Like there's the kitchen still dirty but like just lighting those candles and like really slowing down to be present. I love it. And it gets harder. It's getting harder to do with kids and sports, but I'm that's one of our goals as a family is to try to keep as much family dinners as we can, and I'm glad you brought that up because that's something that, like it seems so small and insignificant when you're doing it.

Speaker 1: 35:25

But remembering that like, sometimes those small, little shifts make such a big difference and I just I wonder how much of that women need when it comes to their bodies and food, that it can be these small, subtle shifts of making it feel better. It doesn't have to be externally motivated, which I think for so long, for so many of us that's what our bodies were is like this external motivation to look or to fit in clothes or to like, and not just for men, for like women, for like belonging and for ourselves. There's just so much pressure on the external and this conversation is just bringing me back to like. But what does it feel like? What does it feel like to be in your body? What does it feel like when you eat that or when you don't eat that, or when you eat too much or too little. Reconnecting to that has been so powerful and so simple. Like I can mentally, I can mentally spiral about the diet Coke thing, but like on a daily basis it's like oh, this is okay.

Speaker 2: 36:38

This is fine, I would say. I think some people they don't feel like it's simple, because maybe they do feel like they have to obsess about it for it to feel safe. What I used to feel that way for sure, and so that's. I think what I do is I try to guide people in a way that they feel like first with the nutrition, to like start a starting point. That is guided. But it's not, it's not obsessive, it's not as rigid, not as rigid it's I. I often do like the food group thing of like not even a certain amount. I don't measure anything.

Speaker 2: 37:15

I don't tell people to measure anything and then, and then I try to get them to connect with how they feel after eating it. You know, like, or while they're eating it like, when do I need to stop and be, feel okay? And and then also with like movement of choosing things you like to do, right, and that is a super important and finding those things I'm trying to think of. I don't really love the whole like I don't. I don't like HIIT workouts. Tried them years ago, I don't know.

Speaker 1: 37:51

Also, my body hates them. Yeah, I was like I don't like it I feel good for an hour or two, but I will crash hard later that day.

Speaker 2: 37:59

So it's kind of like listening to your body and like what your body likes. I like, like the whole dance history. I still like dancey type body connection movements, um, yoga, bar stuff. But then I do like, um, I, and like people like, well, running's not like the whole switch of, like running is not good for you, walking is. And then there's also the eating disorder world that, like, people think running is disordered and it can be for sure, I will say that. But I truly enjoy running outside with a friend and like that quicker movement of uh, the energy feeling is different to me than walking. So I mean, there's days when I want to walk and I respect that, like I know I'm like I don't feel like running, but then there's days that I really enjoy that movement and that's kind of where I try to help people find that connection for themselves. Yeah, and then, and I like weightlifting, I do, but I do feel like that is one I have to, um again, do in a way that I like, yeah, so it's, you know, it's like connecting to your body and knowing what feels good to your body and then also respecting it and not pushing it too far and causing injuries, you know, uh. And then the food part is you know the? That was I. When people don't feel like it's simple, I think you, if you start with a place of giving them some guidance and then connecting with their body and letting go of the myths and the food shame that people hold on to, is where a lot of people have to start and then we kind of get to the underlying messages of why you feel like you need to control your food or your body appearance image in some way and things like that. But I will say it feels much more free.

Speaker 2: 40:01

I truly do not plan my dinners outside of uh, what sounds good and convenience, honestly like because I have two small children and, yeah, I have activities and so I look on the night, so we have more activities. I'm like, okay, that's a crock pot night, what flavor do I want? And then like this is a night that I can make something, but I still I I like cooking, but with small children around it's not like you can spend an hour cooking or an hour and a half without interruption. So it's usually like a 30 minute one to two pan thing. So it's still like I think of convenience and flavor and I do think a little bit of like the food groups, but even then I'm not like super obsessive about it. Yeah, um, because generally when you're making a whole meal it has all of those things, um, but I will just say like it's a lot, like I have not counted something in years.

Speaker 2: 41:06

Um, I this is kind of part of my story is like I remember being in nutrition school and we did like just a they just did a food log for a nutrition assessment so you could see like all your micronutrients you got, which was helpful, and I was eating fine. And then I got like and I had done the whole like college weight change thing and I was like, well, maybe I can like go back to where I used to be. And then I was doing it. And that's when I realized it did not work for my mental health or how my body worked. Um, because I remember like counting the calories in some days, um, I would hit like my limit, which is, like you know, subjective, and I'd be like I'm still hungry, like this is ridiculous, you know. And then there was a few days where I didn't hit my number or whatever and I wasn't hungry. So I think there's a lot to like and I remember being like this is dumb. I'm hungry, so I'm going to eat more. And I was like this is stupid Cause. I was also like a 20 or 21 year old who was healthy and fine and getting the nutrients they needed. I remember that was like the last time I counted calories ever.

Speaker 2: 42:14

And then I did slip into a trend a few years ago because I was like, well, my family has diabetes history. You know, maybe I should try the like low carb thing or whatever. And I hadn't ever done it because I also like don't believe in it. I was like maybe I should try it. Um, and I tried it and I lost weight, but I was. I was thinking about food more than I ever wanted to.

Speaker 2: 42:40

And then, um, it's, it was not a maintainable thing and I think that's also important for people to remember. If, like you know when, even when you slip into this things, it's usually if you're doing it in a certain way, it's not maintainable and it's not helpful to your mental health and so like. After that experience I was I was like no more, none of that anymore. Um, I will just say there are ways to connect with your body and know what feels good physically and mentally, and honor your, your body image and your relationship with food without being on any kind of diet. Or you know certain routine? Yeah Well, in building, building, and you know certain routine.

Speaker 1: 43:26

Yeah, well, I'm building, building and you know I can talk now about where I'm at with food. But the years before that I mean like deep, intensive, therapeutic coaching and learning and it's taken me years of intentionally like slowing down with, like intuitive eating and like some of the things you're sharing. It's taken me time to do that. But also there's no longer this like on again, off again, all or nothing. There's not this like intense polarity, because I've been to both polarities of hyper controlling or no control at all, which, like as a parent, I can see health in that, like I can when I look at my kids, I can see health fairly easily of like, oh, I can't just give you whatever you want when you want it, because that actually isn't good for you, like that doesn't serve you. But I also don't want to be so hyper or over controlling or fearful that you're afraid of food or eating, and so it's like I want to give you what you want and what you need, but I want to teach you that your needs come first. But but I love that you were sharing of like women who are struggling with, like especially like the control part of eating, who are maybe where, like you, spend a lot of time and energy thinking about it and planning it and controlling it. I've been in that place and I was terrified that if I stopped controlling it I would lose all control Because I hadn't done like that deeper work that you do with women to like understand what was actually happening. But when you get to that root base of it and you start to like heal that relationship, there becomes trust again. Like you start trusting food, you start trusting your body, you start trusting your hunger and your fullness and that's life changing. That like that changes your mental health, your emotional health, your relationships. Like events, like events or get togethers. It's like it's such a beautiful thing to not have that be such a thing in my life anymore. Like it's I spent years exhausted of like, like leave me the hell alone.

Speaker 1: 45:38

I want to do something else with my mental and emotional energy other than just constantly hyper fixating on what I'm eating, what I'm not eating, how much too little. Like it's so much. And I think it consumes a lot more time and energy than a lot of women maybe even realize. Like how much their lives revolve around this one facet of themselves. And it's an important thing, important. We want to take care of our bodies, and it can become obsessive. We want to take care of our bodies, and it can become obsessive, but I think women are scared to like fully, let go if you, if you'd say it that way. But I love that you teach them like, just like, oh well, it's easy now for me and it's like cool, cool, good for you. I'm so glad you love your body. I don't know how to do that yet. Versus, we're going to start with this and we're going to move little by little.

Speaker 2: 46:41

Because I was like. I do really appreciate intuitive eating because it's a lot about listening and responding to your body. However, they often, you know, try to start with like treat food with all, like equal regard, right and like allow yourself to eat if you are patient and can like tolerate eating more than you trust your body to do.

Speaker 1: 47:20

That's a lot to ask of someone who has a shit ton of fear and drama, and even like disordered eating, like that's like saying here you don't trust this toddler at all, give them the reins of your life. It's like, wait, no, that doesn't feel safe, like there needs to be some sort of boundary for me. And it's not like you. Help them with that, yeah.

Speaker 2: 47:33

So that's kind of like yeah, I'm like it, but it can feel like, especially if they do end up gaining weight because they're allowing themselves to do that stuff and again I, they will what usually happens if, when people do it in that way, those foods start to feel less elusive and less like they need to have it all the time because they're allowing themselves to have it. So I understand the reasoning behind that approach, but I do feel, like you said, if someone has no trust in their body and is very fearful and things like that, I mean like okay, well, what are those things that you're scared of but you want to have and you know your body enjoys? How can we add those into your food where you feel satisfied? And then also, um, like connecting to that, that like food is not going to always be perfect and that doesn't mean anything about you like you can just kind of continue through it, um, and like just reflecting on what happens. So it is. It's a very complicated process, honestly, um, but it's not so complicated once you allow yourself to try it, and that's what I kind of work with people a lot on.

Speaker 2: 48:53

I was like I mean that's, I'm kind of thinking, okay, how do I'm like? I um have just gathered more and more evidence in just my experience of knowing that like, yes, I can make real dinners and I feel more satisfied and my body hasn't drastically changed. You know, my body changes more from stress than actually eating and exercise. And I know that now about myself because I, there, I have been looking at timelines. I'm like, why didn't my body change at that point?

Speaker 2: 49:22

I was like, oh, that was a stressful situation, that's what was going on. And so now I'm just, I don't even really like think about um, food and exercise beyond, just you know, moving how I want and eating things that I enjoy. I will say too, it is hard, sometimes hard for people who feel like they maybe are particular or picky eaters, but, um, you can still find your intuitive self with that, just like learning how to listen to your body better. Um, anyway, but I would say I've just like seen more and more that, um, if you're listening to your body and fueling it and, I don't know, processing your other emotions and underlying things, that your body is not going to change drastically if you're just because you have stopped trying to manage it all the time.

Speaker 1: 50:18

See that, like what you just said, even I mean even a little piece of me was like what do you mean?

Speaker 1: 50:23

I don't have to manage my body, like that's still something that I'm like, that's, I guess, still something I'm working on, just based off of like the somatic response I just had to you, saying that I was like I, I trust my body a lot, but I think there's still times where I realize I don't, like there's still parts of me. I think you know it's. I've learned that even it doesn't have to be this all or nothing when it comes to self-love and trust either. Like I really love my body, I feel really confident in my body, and I have days where like I don't and I just don't make it mean anything and I'm just like, well, you know what? Okay, here's a good example shaving. I had a friend who was like embarrassed that she hadn't like shaved her legs and we were going to go do something and I was like the worst case scenario is someone will notice that you don't, you didn't shave your legs and then, nothing bad will happen.

Speaker 1: 51:20

But I like to remind myself of that of like. The worst case scenario is you notice that you have a belly in this outfit or someone else notices that you have a belly, which you do, and that will be okay. But I still have those days, even as someone who feels very good in her body and feels very confident, and I love my body. But there's still days where I look at it and go, huh, that's kind of funny, or huh, I don't love the way that looks or the way that feels, but it's. It's interesting to have a different relationship to that too, to like not feel ashamed of these hard parts of like. Well, of course I have that Like. I have a whole history and I grew up in a culture where like that wasn't seen. But I wouldn't if, if another woman I loved was feeling that I'd be like okay, cool, let's go to dinner. Like awesome, you're fine, but it's not what I care about.

Speaker 1: 52:09

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 52:10

Yeah, yeah, I feel like that's important to know too. If like, um, yeah, like not every day, I will say like, well, even whenever I like tried the low carb thing, oh, like I don't know, I think it was like four years ago and I was like this, it didn't fit, like I could be, like I don't know, I think it was like four years ago and I was like this. It didn't fit, like I could be, like I have lived intuitively for like 15 years. Why would I go back? And I'm like, well, I mean human trial, trying to see things, and have a stressful situation, and that's I was.

Speaker 2: 52:43

I was probably trying to manage some life stuff because I was stressed and then like moving on and be like, okay, yeah, no, none of that, you know again. And so, um, and not the saying, I won't ever like have that moment of being like, oh, maybe I need to be healthier for something. When I am a very like both rounded person, you know, um, and so I'll tell you it's like not going to always be every day. You're going to feel great about things, um, but then I do like to even say, you know, like they say this with babies um, fed is best, and so I do want people to remember that, like, even if your meal is not like ideal, or maybe you feel like you overate, or even sometimes you know my people who struggle with binging like you needed to eat and that happened, and we can talk about what was going on, that you, you know, had a binge, but the next day you still need to eat you know, and so I.

Speaker 2: 53:58

I want people to like know that that is part of it too. Yeah, just like making sure you are nurturing your body, whether that be eating, and I think that's what's helpful in a guided pattern. But I also think it's important for people to or I will statements that I wasn't allowed to change my mind when I was emotional, if that makes sense.

Speaker 1: 54:42

So I had to kind of create self boundaries of like you know what, even if I binge, I'm going to eat the next day. I'm going to eat the next meal. Even if I skip a meal, that doesn't mean I have to keep skipping, I can go find food. Like I had to create these like parenting rules for myself, essentially, where I said, like this this one little pinky toe of me has to make the decision when I'm on the bad days, when I'm having days where, like, my mind or my emotions are telling me to make decisions that like, this part of me is like nope, that's the disordered eating part. I had to create some some rules of me is like Nope, that's the disordered eating part.

Speaker 1: 55:23

I had to create some some rules and boundaries around like no, you know we're having a bad body day, but like guess what we're gonna eat? Because if your teenage daughter was having a bad body day, you would feed her. You would not tell her to not eat because she felt fat that day. Like, if my, if my daughter came to me was like I don't feel fat today, I would never look at her and be like you shouldn't eat. That's, it's ridiculous.

Speaker 1: 55:40

Like I, it feels disgusting coming out of my mouth. Yeah, but yeah, I've, I've had those responses in my female adult body of oh yeah, you should for sure not eat, or you should eat less than you need to. Like that is ridiculous. But I have to find that part of me that holds that boundary, that kind of holds that rule for me, when it feels hard. Because even when I don't like my body, I've decided I need to respect it and I need to love it. And sometimes love is like I don't want to, but I'm going to like, I'm going to take care of myself in the way that I want and need.

Speaker 2: 56:13

That's when I would say, like the respecting your body, like that's kind of like the spectrum you know of your body well and your relationship with food, but like practicing the respect of your body, that you do know that it needs nourishment, and it might mean that, like we, you don't want to make a full breakfast because you're not hungry and you're having. You woke up and didn't like the outfit you wore, whatever, or yeah, um, one. I would say let's eat breakfast to make sure your brain is on, you know. And that might mean, like doing an easy, like breakfast burrito you can just microwave so you don't even have to have the thinking action of making something and doing, and um, or it could be having yogurt and some cereal and fruit, you know, whatever it could be, um. So I just I think it is like you, even when, on those days when you don't feel like awesome, keep doing what you have been doing and know that it's not permanent.

Speaker 1: 57:26

That's so good, like it's not permanent.

Speaker 2: 57:30

Yeah, you will then kind of continue to see, like you know, sometimes we have a full like not a good day, but you might notice that like throughout the day. You know, sometimes we have a full like not a good day, but you might notice that like throughout the day you don't notice it anymore. Or you might even have a moment where you feel good in your body. You might have moments where you're like like you're not noticing it and you're feeling really connected with your friends or you like are feeling proud of yourself because you did something hard with you know, a work, project or something, or you see something that healed inside of you with your family and you're like, oh, I am not yelling at my kid because they're you know, whatever and you can see those parts about yourself healing. And that's when I think it's important to remember that body image is on a spectrum. It's not uh, it's fluid and it's also not accurate all the time.

Speaker 2: 58:28

Um, for sure, not permanent like, but it's not accurate all the time, and so I want you to like remember I have other things that are important in my life and I need to feed myself because it's not permanent.

Speaker 1: 58:41

It's just one little piece of you. It's just one little part. It's like so what? So, what I have to.

Speaker 1: 58:46

Like I've had seasons or days where I have to look at myself and be like and Okay, so you're having a bad body day, put on some like leggings and a sweatshirt and tennis shoes and move on with your life. Like this isn't giving myself permission to like I had to like switch my brain from like the overthinking, constantly thinking about it, to like think about something else, put my brain to work somewhere different and kind of I almost heard this permission to have like leave yourself alone a little bit. Like, even if it's a rough day, like you don't always have to like deep dive in the moment, like I think sometimes that's helpful and sometimes it's like okay, cool, so you're having a shit day, like welcome to life. Like you're gonna have those.

Speaker 1: 59:28

We don't have to spiral out in it and I think that's a big permission piece, especially with this, of like you don't have to make that a formation of your identity. It just gets to be a bad day or a bad moment. If you just allow yourself to have a bad moment half the time, you just forget, not all the time. But like the more I give myself permission of like, this is just a bad moment. This is just a rough moment, like it's going to get better. It's not permanent.

Speaker 2: 59:57

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 59:58

It usually goes better than when I'm like trying to like make it better or trying to like force it or trying to figure it out.

Speaker 2: 1:00:05

Yeah, I would. This is a little bit of a tangent and a whole nother podcast, but I would say that, like I like people talk about diet culture and wanting women to like making people women want to be smaller and think about that all the time, it's a branch of the patriarchy trying to keep women occupied with other thoughts that aren't as important than what they can actually do in their life.

Speaker 1: 1:00:32

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:00:33

Changes they want to see, like. I'm not super like into any of that, but I do think about. If I was thinking about my body and food all the time, would I be able to have the space to connect with even friends and like, encourage them and empower them? Or would I be stuck in my head comparing myself to my friend? That would not be good, right. Or with clients being able to truly look at what's inside their hearts and, like, help them. You know, see their ability to have good relationships and, you know, a life that has more joy and, you know, releasing some of those old past things.

Speaker 2: 1:01:12

If I was worried about what I ate for breakfast that day, you know, um and like and even the growth of like. I want to look at how mental health is affected by nutrition, like in the brain. If I was obsessed about that, like other things, my brain would not have time to look at how we can heal other mental health things with nutrients. So it's just like that part of this is part of us. I do want people to accept and appreciate and respect their body. However, if you're having a day that you don't love everything about it, one, it could be that you know we're women hormones. Are you luteal first? Have you tried to?

Speaker 1: 1:01:55

be luteal, because if you're luteal hormones, are you luteal. First have you right, because if you're luteal you're not allowed to make decisions about yourself.

Speaker 2: 1:02:00

Or you know, yes, or it could just be like you had really bad sleep the night before and so you're tired and not thinking clearly. When you're getting dressed like and sometimes it's okay to be like, oh, this is what's going on, change and move forward. Sometimes it might be like this is happening, I'm just going to get dressed anyway. Sometimes it could be what exactly I'm still wearing and challenge the body image, or it could be to be in a comfort place, and that's okay either way, and then maybe talk to your you know coach or counselor about it later, you know, if you want to, but I do think it's important to not give it so much power and then changing how you're feeding yourself or how you're interacting with other people around you after that.

Speaker 1: 1:02:46

I mean it's, it's wild to to look at my life now and to realize that, like a big part of who I am today, and even like I look at my business, is because I stopped spending mental energy. I stopped hyper fixating and overthinking everything that was wrong with me that I didn't like, which, like some of those things are real. Some of them aren't untrue, like just to be like I, like they're not always untrue, but it's like why would I spend all of my time thinking about that when I could go on these like rabbit trails of, like somatics or embodiment or like all of these cool things that I want to learn and think about and talk about? It's like this is such an interesting topic to me but I think, and it and it consumes so much of women's time and emotion and energy. I think even less than we still understand, because the culture, the culture, is changing but there's still so much underneath the culture that, like you know again, we could go all on culture of just commodity and how women for a very long time they they weren't treasured for who they were. They weren't you know, you were a product, you were something that needed to look and do things, not feel things and think and create things and that sucks. And how do we spend our mental and emotional energy becoming and building lives and building health and mental health and physical health that really serves us and what we want to do in the world and who we want to be.

Speaker 1: 1:04:24

I love that. I feel like that's like the perfect place to end. What else would you say to that? Is there any like last piece you would want to share on that? Anything unfinished Last piece you would want to share on that? Anything?

Speaker 2: 1:04:40

unfinished. I guess it's like what you said. It's just I want people to find their mental and physical health. Yeah, that helps them live the life they really want and thrive in it, not just survive.

Speaker 1: 1:04:54

Yeah, find that safety. Yeah, I love that. Thank you so much for being a guest on the podcast today. We will have all of your links. In fact, before our podcast, we were talking about like nutrients and I was like, ooh, I want your nutrients download, like I want to know what nutrients cause. Especially lately, I've been like how do I help my ADHD? My coping mechanisms aren't coping hard enough. What can I do nutrition wise? So I'm super excited about that. Where is, like, the best place for people to find you?

Speaker 2: 1:05:27

Like Instagram is pretty good. I'm Nutramind P-L-L-C on Instagram and then also my website is just NutriMindorg. That has more information on like who I am, uh, some of what I practice. Um, I do see people individually. I have a couple of spots open for Colorado, let's say that. And then I am starting a group program in February for healing your relationship with food and body and that is open to the anybody who wants to join virtually because it is a more. It's not a technical therapy program, it's a coaching program. So that means we will go through like how to guide through nutrition, the stuff that comes up like mental health blocks maybe you know and emotion and recognizing your emotions, but we won't go into the super deep processing. In that case I would probably say see me individually or I could also like refer you to a counselor in your area. If you want to go like, start with the program and then go deeper with somebody, we could do that, yeah Well, and sometimes a program is so much less intense.

Speaker 1: 1:06:45

I think it can be really helpful for people who are like whoa, I have a ton of baggage. I don't necessarily want to like pull a card out of the house of cards and like see where it all tumbles, yet I just want to start with something that can give me like a really good baseline of health. I love group and coaching programs for, like creating some health and stability around things, sometimes even before doing the deep work or alongside it or after it. Like I think it's such a powerful thing, so I love that you're doing that. Thank you so much.

Speaker 2: 1:07:15

I was like I think some people will would be feel complete with you know. And then some people, if they wanted more you know support, they could reach out and we could figure it out. So, yeah, yeah, it's cool.

Speaker 1: 1:07:31

Thank you for having me. Yes, I loved this conversation and I'm just. I would love if you listen to this and this resonated with you or you have questions? Come up. We would love to have you share, tag us, send us a DM Like I. I love connecting with women in the audience of what's resonating with you. What else comes up Like what more topics can we go on? So thank you so much for being here and I'll see you guys on the next episode.

Speaker 1: 1:08:02

Thanks for joining me on today's episode of the motherhood mentor podcast. Make sure you have subscribed below so that you see all of the upcoming podcasts that are coming soon. I hope you take today's episode and you take one aha moment, one small, tangible piece of work that you can bring into your life to get your hands a little dirty, to get your skin in the game. Don't forget to take up audacious space in your life. If this podcast moved you, if it inspired you, if it encouraged you, please do me a favor and leave a review. Send an episode to a friend. This helps the show gain more traction. It helps us to support more moms, more women, and that's what we're doing here. So I hope you have an awesome day. Take really good care of yourself and I'll see you next time.