Stop Defending Yourself. Start Understanding Her. l EP. 104 l

If your marriage feels like a Rubik's Cube you can't quite solve, this is the episode that changes that.

I break down why getting defensive was never really about the thing your wife brought up, the missed call, the forgotten shopping, the thing you said you'd do. It's about a protective part of you trying to make sure you're never wrong, because somewhere back in childhood being wrong meant being punished or losing love. Every time you protect that part, you're choosing it over your marriage. And there's only one winner.

I also unpack the layer most men miss completely: what she says in an emotional moment often isn't what she means overall. It's a protective part speaking, not her truth. When you can hear past the words to what she's actually feeling underneath, insecurity, needing reassurance, wanting to feel important, the entire conversation changes. I walk through what that actually sounds like in real time, and why leading that moment instead of reacting to it is one of the most powerful things you can do as a husband.

This one also gets into reparenting, why the way you handle your own emotions is quietly training your kids on how worthy they are of love, and the question I ask every client on the fence: if your daughter married a man exactly like you, would you be proud of that?

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Want to know exactly how you're showing up in the marriage, contributing to the state it's in and importantly what you can do about it? (without her having to even know)
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Transcript

Harrison Orr (00:01.28)
If you're defensive and your marriage feels like s a fucking Rubik's Cube that you just can't quite understand, this episode is gonna change that.

Harrison Orr (00:12.546)
You're listening to the Be Better Podcast. My name is Harrison Orr. And after being a reactive, nice guy that almost toys marriages apart, I've now managed to rebuild myself, my marriage, and leave from a place of deep masculine presence so that I live a marriage that I fucking love. And now I coach men on how to do the same. One of the most common experiences for men, and I don't think this is entirely our fault, is we don't understand a ourselves to a deep enough level to understand why we do the things we do.

But also we don't understand our our wives and our marriages to the extent that would make sense of why it's in the state that it's in. Like I don't know about you, but when I got married, a lot of the or even before that, a lot of the advice that I was given, you know, half jokingly but half like, you know, serious as well from even my dad or fr from the older generation was happy wife, happy life.

Men are from Mars, women are from Venus. You know, never try to understand women 'cause you'll never crack it. Right? And it was just this women are this emotional creature that don't try to understand them 'cause you'll never figure it out. There's no rationale behind why why they are the way they are. And there's just like this

Almost ignorance to to understanding that. And I don't think any of that comes from a ill intent. But when you're fr framed when the when the females in your life are framed th through that lens, it it makes it hard to even then consider that okay, there is some rhyme and reason to why she is the way that she is, why she shows up and does the things that she does. And when you can crack that.

It makes understanding your wife's behaviors and hell understanding your marriage so much easier. Hell, I dare say even predictable, which most men would not use predictable and their wife's emotions in the same sentence. And I don't mean that as a as a discredit or a insulting behavior in statement, I should say. But I say this to help you understand what I'm about to walk you through as to actually how to make sense of your wife. And

Harrison Orr (02:27.137)
This is coming off the back of a a call I had with one of my clients yesterday who came on saying he had this conversation with with his wife and he said he feels like he's unlocked the fucking cheat code. He has finally got to the understanding that what his wife says isn't what she means.

Yes, that sounds confusing. And I just want to preface this as like, you're not a weak man because you listen to this. You take ownership, you're here to be curious and to understand and to be better. But I just want to like, you know, push on the people that will discredit any of these things that I'm about to say. Because a weak man will hear that and then instantly cast the blame out to her. It's like, well, why doesn't she grow up? If sh why doesn't she just become an adult and tell me what she thinks? I'm not a fucking mind reader. Like all of those statements.

from someone who refuses to take any responsibility and ownership. Because wouldn't you A want to take some some ownership in even the desire to understand your partner? But then also recognise that, well, my friend, I can guarantee that there's some shit that you have said in your life that didn't also align with what you truly felt. Maybe you were a nice guy, maybe you're emotional.

Or hell, maybe the times that she did tell you what she really felt, you got reactive, you got defensive, responded in a way that told her, cool, don't be that honest. Don't tell him what you really think, because it doesn't end well, because he can't handle it. And then so she filters what she says and how honest she is because, well, of those experiences. But I know that's not you, because you listen to this podcast.

So coming back to what she says isn't what she means. There are a couple of layers to this. So layer one, which is not exclusive to females, to to feminine, I should say, is a lot of humans will say things from a protective part of them. Right? If it's coming from a highly emotional part, like a protective part, it's not really what someone actually thinks.

Harrison Orr (04:45.429)
Like if you ever experience something where it might be your wife, it might be your kids, it might be someone else, that they say one thing and then, you know, while they're quite emotional, quite, you know, in the in the thick of it, and then, you know, in a calmer conversation, they say something that's, you know, contr contr contradictory to that original statement. And you kind of live like, what? Like I thought this, but now you're saying this and now I'm confused.

Yeah, that original part was probably a protective part that was defending them or protecting them from some emotion, protecting them from feeling isolated, protecting them from being left, protecting them from some some other hurtful emotion. And this I always come back to this. This is why this work is so freaking powerful. Because when you understand your own parts, when you understand the the things that you do and the things you say,

When you're operating from one of these protective parts, the way that you get defensive, the way that you get reactive, the way that you people please, the way that you avoid hard conversations, that you withdraw. Like when you understand all of those parts of yourself, and you spend so much more time in grounded presence, in your your natural, authentic self energy, you can see those protective parts in other people. Like you can see that protective part coming out and projecting whatever it is.

From them, trying to protect them from something. And when if you're in your own protective part that takes it personally or gets reactive and defensive to it, then you will take it at face value. And then you'll just be this little boy and little girl going tit for tat and it goes nowhere. But as the leader, as the man, the masculine in the relationship, when you're grounded in that self energy and you can see that protective part coming out, you can address it for what it is. Like

Hey, I know you're saying this and I I don't feel like that's your intent right now. Or it's you know, I feel that you're saying this, you know, you I hear you saying this, but I feel like it feels like you need some some reassurance right now. And you can speak to the emotional need underneath that that she may not even know she actually needs. She may not even consciously be aware, or like, well, she probably wouldn't be. Most humans wouldn't be, unless they've done a lot of this inner work themselves. And when you get to speak into that.

Harrison Orr (07:10.207)
Slow things down and lead the d the conversation in that direction. And then she goes, Well, yeah. I guess I did just No, I I was feeling quite insecure. I wasn't feeling, you know, important to you in this moment. I was afraid of, you know, th this other thing happening. You know, you're right.

Harrison Orr (07:33.037)
What a different level of conversation that is. And this is where like this is the part of like of marriage and relationships that I fucking love. Because in this moment, when you understand yourself, when you understand your partner, when you understand humans and how they function to that degree, it's it's like you're a mind reader to something that they don't even know about. And then you get to lead the conversation back into constructive territory.

And you get to understand each other. And hell, you know the gift that you get to give your partner in moments like that? You get to give them the gift of understanding themselves to a degree that they probably didn't have beforehand. They get a real life experience of I was saying this thing and I don't know where it was coming from, but I was actually feeling this thing underneath, and you completely move the words away.

without taking it personally, without getting defensive like you used to, and then spoke straight into that little girl that needed this reassurance or needed a hug from dad. And holy fuck, my heart feels open to you right now. I feel seen for the first time. What a gift that is like

Imagine the kind of conversations you would have in your marriage if that if you were able to lead those maybe currently c pieces of conflict or arguments to a place like that. Imagine the overall state of your marriage and of your life if that was the level of conversation, that was the level of connection that you had. Because you've understood your own parts and your own behaviors the way that they show up, and then by extension you can see that with other people.

Because it's it's insanely identical the the understanding, the validation, the the the provision that those protective parts of us need to what our partner needs as well. Like it's almost verbatim the exact same conversation. And when you've had it so many times in yourself and worked through that, having it externally with with the with your partner or with anybody else is

Harrison Orr (09:50.029)
Feels like, cool, I've I've done this before. I know how this goes. And you get that's that's what leading a relationship is like. That's what leading your marriage is. When your partner says she wants you to lead her, other than you know, make some decisions and not just be a yes man and default to like letting her choose, that's what she means. Like those emotional moments, leading those emotional moments by not getting reactive to her moods, bying it being able to stay grounded in yourself and being able to.

See behind the veil of the words that are coming out of her mouth and see into her heart as to what she's actually feeling and then by extension what she's actually needing.

That is a powerful level of connection.

And you only get there by understanding yourself and your own parts. Because then you don't feel the need to get reactive to shit. Like, I used to be so self-conscious. I used to take comments on social media quite personally. Like someone would leave a nasty comment and I would get very reactive. I would get hurt. I would feel maybe a little bit anxious about it. Maybe I would want to go back and defend myself. And now

Like I kind of just laugh at it. I but there's also the point, you know, you can you can read in some people's comments in their language of you know how how defensive and attacking they are and how emotional they are in writing things. And now it's it's I n I see it as simply a reflection of themselves. Like i okay, they're throwing that at me, but I know it's not about me. It's about them.

Harrison Orr (11:35.149)
And then so instead of like, where is this, you know, of they're attacking me on this, or maybe I'm not as good as I think, or maybe I'm this, maybe I'm that, I'm like, wow. I wonder what has happened in that person's life for them to have that perspective. Like a lot of my content, not a lot, the content of mine that has gone most viral is often around the difference between like the roles of the masculine or a husband in a in a marriage. Words to that effect.

And owning your part and what your wife truly needs and things like that. And there's always a couple of older guys who have been burnt in a divorce, who have had shit taken, you know, half their stuff taken from them, a very messy divorce, who've taken no ownership of the situation, are bitter and grumpy, and will go on and spew all this hate about women are evil, women are this. And funnily enough, none of these guys are.

gay by the sound of it, they're just very bitter on women as a entire gender. But will then spew all this hate of like they're just fucking rats, they're all these the nasty things, they're all gold diggers and you know you never trust them. Marriage is a scam, like all these horrible things. And for someone who d deeply believes in in love and marriage and how much of an asset and like amplifier of of life that and an individual that it can be.

I I now I see those people, I'm like, man, you must have been hurt so fucking bad. Like I can't imagine the divorce that you went through. I can't imagine how bad you were hurt to have that strong of an opinion. Yeah, sure. This guy probably takes no ownership, lives in victimhood victimville, and everything else. So it's not like I'm in I'm validating his reality.

in his sorry, his perspective, but in seeing how he got there, I'm like, man, I can't imagine what that's like.

Harrison Orr (13:41.741)
So by extension, his comment and his his perspective have nothing to do with me. They're all about him. And when we see everybody that way, it allows us the opportunity of okay, if we you know, often it's it's not as easy to then go, well, you know, that's just your, you know, to your wife or to someone that's closer to you. Well, that's your perspective, that's n or projection, that's not for me. But it makes it so much easier to see those projections.

And those protective parts coming out in other people. And then from a a calm, compassionate and present energy. Like, okay, I can see that's that's their protective part, that that's their projection. If it's stirring an emotional response in me, you know, maybe where is it true? W like what haven't I fully healed or faced or owned for me to have that emotional reaction?

And then I can say thank you. Thank you for the reflection. Thank you for the lesson. Cause now I've got something that I had I thought I had addressed, but I haven't. And now cool, it's it's back on me to do some work.

And I want to leave that there, but I think I th I am so passionate about that this piece that it's a fucking game changer. The second piece about defensiveness. Defensiveness in a marriage, and actually across the board, not just marriage, but we're all here for usually our marriage. It's not about your actions. It's not about that moment. It's not really about that you forgot to pick the thing up on the way home.

It's not that you forgot to order the shopping. It's not that the that you forgot to order, sorry, call the tradesman. It's not that you got this thing wrong. It's not that your wife misunderstood you. Getting defensive is when we take something personally and we take it as an attack on our identity and who we are.

Harrison Orr (15:51.043)
Which is why so many of these convers which is what it's not like that's not our wife's out in intention. And that's why these conversations end up in fights and arguments that they were never meant to be. Because she wanted to share her her feelings, her perspective. Maybe that's to do with you. Maybe that was like a hey, you said you'd do this thing, you said your words aren't aligned with your action right now, whatever it is. And you haven't done it. So she's maybe right to call that out. So that defensiveness is coming from an incongruence on your standpoint.

But if it's her perspective, her emotions, and you get defensive about those, what it's actually telling her, like you're trying to just correct the facts, clear up the misunderstanding. Like if she just saw my side of the story, then it wouldn't be a big issue. But all that's telling her, I'll reframe, all she's hearing from that is your emotions are inconvenient. I need them to go away. Here's the logic, here's the facts. So cool, we got the facts right, cool, you're

You don't have to feel that anymore. Let's move on. Can we just go back to feeling good again? That's not how most humans work. That's not how females work anyway. And when we understand that, it makes it so much easier to actually realize, and this is going to sting some people that get defensive. When you get defensive,

What you're what that part of you is trying to do is actually protect the marriage. Right? Because you're trying to or I'll be more specific. That part of you is trying to protect you from being left. Because often that part that's getting defensive is worried that if you are seen as wrong or at fault, then you will be punished. You will lose love, you will lose connection, you will be left. Because something happened in your childhood where

You were wrong or you were at fault and you got punished for it. So that part learned, cool, make sure that you're never wrong or you're never at fault again. So you defend, you explain, you justify, you go into all these stories to make sure that you can blame somebody else, you can make sure it wasn't your fault, and that you'll be safe. Because as a child, if you experience those emotions, then you don't have the capacity to deal with them. But as an adult, you can be wrong. You can be at fault.

Harrison Orr (18:10.476)
Because you make mistakes. We all make mistakes. But it doesn't mean that the extreme of what happened in your childhood is going to happen in your marriage. Doesn't mean that your wife is going to withdraw her love from you. Doesn't mean that she's going to leave you. Doesn't mean that she's going to think less of you. But that's what that part of you that gets defensive is actually defending. But every time you protect that part of you, you were choosing that part over the marriage.

You're protecting that part of you at the expense of your marriage. So your marriage suffers. And that's the cruel irony of this is when this part that's there to protect you, to protect you from the emotions that would often happen from a divorce, it's actually causing the divorce. Mindfuck, I know.

But when you understand that, and then you can work through this the understanding this part and realizing that the goal is never to make these parts go away. The goal is to understand this part and what it's protecting you from and then reassure that part that that won't happen again. Not reassuring it that your wife won't leave you, that you'll be never that you'll never be left again, that you'll never be alone again. But if that were to happen, that this part of you wouldn't be left alone.

That like imagine these parts as like your your your little children, right? Ins in internally they're all your children. And it's worried that it it, as in the part, will be left alone. This is where you, the adult, get to step in and say, like, cool, even if this happens, I will not leave you alone. What happened when you were younger won't happen again because I am here, I am here to protect you, I'm here to keep you safe. This is why people refer to a lot of this inner work as reparenting.

Because you are the parent to your inner child, to your inner inner children, and you get to give them what they didn't get as children. When you were a child, the reason you have the protective parts, the reason you have the traits that you have are because you received or didn't receive something that you needed. You didn't receive the emotional availability. You didn't see receive the love. You didn't receive the connection. Or when you did, it was with strings attached.

Harrison Orr (20:27.426)
You were only praised when you did everything that they asked for you. You were only praised when you always said yes. You were punished when you were said no. Or things got taken away if you were an inconvenience, if you know you were at fault, if you were wrong. And what you get to do through this journey is give that part of you, that child inside of you, what it didn't get. Which to some degrees is a level of safety, reassurance.

And unconditional love. It's like you can make a mistake and I'll still love I'll still love you. You can say no and set a boundary and I'll still love you. You are worthy of love as you are, not based on what you do for anybody else. And until we can do that for our parts, until we can do that for ourselves, we won't be able to do that for anybody else. We won't be able to receive that from anybody else. That's why so many men have a hard time receiving love from their partner.

They they brush it off, they and then they they brush it off, they don't really receive it too well, and then by extension they don't really give it as as freely or as often because it feels uncomfortable for them. Right? They feel like what is like what do you what do you mean? You know, like if you if you knew me for who I really am, if you saw behind the veil, behind this mask, behind all this stuff, you wouldn't really love me.

If you saw me for all the mistakes, all the fuck ups, all the th ugliness that that I am behind all this performance, you wouldn't really love me.

Not because there's anything wrong with your partner's love for you, but because you don't love yourself. Because you can't see yourself that way.

Harrison Orr (22:16.472)
And you might think, especially as a man, like, well, that self-love is a croc of shit, that's some cliche, hippie bullshit. But

Even if you don't really care for loving yourself that much.

How do you feel about your kids not loving themselves?

How do you feel about your kids attaching their worth and their deservance of love to what they do for you and the family? That they're only worthy of receiving love and praise and connection when they're in a good mood, when they do exactly as they asked. And if they're punished for being angry, they're punished for having emotions that they don't know how to control yet, they're punished for saying no or setting a boundary.

Harrison Orr (23:08.622)
They will grow up as nice guys. They will grow up to not have the love for themselves that you might like them to. And so even if you don't fully recognize the benefits to having this unconditional self-love for yourself, recognize that you will inherently pass this on to your kids. Consciously or not. Because even if you're not aware of this, so even if you are aware of this.

It will come out in the language that you use. You will get frustrated when your kids say no. You will want to you will confuse their tantrums with their emotional regulation. You will only want to be around them and comfort them and give them attention and praise when they are good, when they earn the right for that. When they do well at things. Instead of still being there for them while they're making mistakes, when they're like figuring it out.

Because they're being fucking children. And then it also comes out in your marriage as well, as to how you show up and treat each other, how you express and receive love, how you understand one another, how you communicate with one another. Not just through words, but through energetics and body language, because your kids will pick up on that. Much more than what you tell them to do or what you say to them is important. They will pick up on your actions and that will be the standard.

By what you do, not what you say.

And then to use your kids as an example. If you're married right now

Harrison Orr (24:45.331)
for your marriage right now. If your kids grew up and were in the exact same marriage.

How would you feel?

If your daughter grew up to marry a man exactly like you, treated your wife exactly the way you treat her. A man treats your daughter exactly the way you treat your wife. And you're a good guy, so it's not like you hit her or you abuse her. But would that be the future that you want for her? Would you want her to do better in some capacity? Would you want her to be treated better?

For your son, the way that you lead, the way that you express emotions, the way that you hold the energy of a room, the way that you communicate conflict and differences, the way that you show up even when it's uncomfortable. Would you be proud if he grew up exactly like you? Or would you be like, Fuck, I really wish I'd change that? I see him just avoid those conversations. I see him just people please. How would that make you feel?

Like f for me, that's one of my biggest drivers. Other than the the personal experience of this, that's one of my biggest drivers. I have almost a almost a phobia of raising my son to be a nice guy. And I'm doing my best to navigate that with my wife to make sure that we don't punish him for things that don't need to be punished for. That we don't only give him praise and attention when he's in a good mood.

Harrison Orr (26:19.19)
And the way that we do things. And sure, there's gonna be things that I definitely can't control. Like I'm not trying to be a perfect parent by any stretch of the imagination. Because, first of all, I don't think that exists. And no matter what you do, kids will always latch onto something. Like you could be good 99% of the time, and it'll be that one time that things didn't go well, and that will be the time that that protective part was formed and then changes everything. So I don't think being a perfect parent is realistic.

But what we do most of the time matters. Every day is a new opportunity to show up better. We can recognize fuck I got more reactive than I wanted there. Shit, I he what they they weren't listening, so I felt myself losing control, losing can losing my cool. Okay, let's do better next time. You know, I really couldn't deal with him going through this phase of everything is no, no, no, no, before he's even heard what I said. Cool. I'm not gonna just punish him for saying no. Like you listen to me, you do it because I said so.

Harrison Orr (27:19.946)
It's what especially if you're especially as parents now, think about a lot of the phrases that come out of your mouth almost instinctively without you having to even think about them. Where do you think you got those from?

Yeah, your childhood from your parents. So maybe you say like, well, I want to do better than my parents. I don't want to be like my parents. Cool. Unless you're consciously doing something else, it's going to come.

That's why this work is so powerful. Because we get to reparent ourselves and then because we now understand what we needed in those moments as as children, we can give that to our children right now as they need it. So they don't have to grow up and then undo all the shit that they did and didn't get from us. Of course, they'll still have to do their own work, but hopefully it's a little a little shallower work than maybe what we have to go through right now.

But that's my piece. To tie this back, first of all, back to the defensive piece. Understanding where that defensiveness comes from, from that protective part. Second of all, understanding when you are getting defensive, you're not, you're prioritizing that story that you have yourself. You're prioritizing protecting your self image of I can't be right, I can't be wrong, because otherwise my wife will see me as less and she will leave me if I am. You're prioritizing that story over the marriage. And there can only be one winner.

Harrison Orr (28:47.436)
So choose.

Back to understanding your wa and then back to understanding your wife.

Your wife is not an emotional creature that's completely irrational.

She is emotional, yes. But all humans are. Just because you've suppressed yours a little better and a little longer doesn't make you any less of a human. But when you can stay in that grounded presence and understand that okay, there's an emotional need underneath underneath this, you can speak into that and address that. Conversations get better. Arguments and escalations get fewer and fewer. And then the connection you get between each other becomes significantly higher because you're leading the conversation.

You're leading her to an experience and an understanding of herself that she may not have even had. You're leading yourself and the marriage to a place of better connection, stronger connection, and then also setting the frame up for future. Because then when you set this frame up of, okay, I understand that in these emotional moments, some of the words she says might be what she's feeling in that moment, but may not be what she's feeling in general. And there's a huge difference, right? A lot of women will express what they feel just like children.

Harrison Orr (29:58.681)
Will express what they feel in the motion, but it's not what they feel overall. Like you have a child, and one minute they might say, like, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you. Cause they're so upset with you, because you took something or you said no, like whatever the thing is. And then five minutes that they're later they're like, I love you so much, Daddy. Like if you took that, if you took the hate as as their truth, as their absolute truth, you would have whiplash. You'd be devastated.

But you kinda know like, okay, it's just an expression of your mood right now, of what you're feeling right now.

And then that's it. It's where we get reactive to those moments that they create issues that were never meant to be issues.

Harrison Orr (30:44.224)
Always the power is in within you, with you. Because if you're hearing this and you're saying, well, my wife's emotional, she screams, she's disrespectful, all that kind stuff, amazing. Dude, you can't control someone else. Bring it back to you. How are you gonna stay more grounded in those mo in those moments? How are you gonna see through those words and speak into what's actually real and relevant in that moment right then? And then are you able to then stay so grounded through that entire place that everything that you're doing, the way that you're showing up, is an invitation for

her to join you at her level, your level of regulated nervous system, your level of communication and understanding, desire to understand. And then invite her to see, you know, feel into this part of her that is projecting everything right then. And then at the very end, after you've gone through that entire process, can you still stay grounded and then set a boundary? A boundary of, hey, I know you're emotional. I know that this thing is upsetting you. I know X Y Z. But we're on the same team and

We'd we're not gonna be disrespectful to each other. No, I love you, but I won't tolerate being spoken to like that. And that's not a threat. That's not going tit for tat. It's calling someone up, not the not calling them out. It's like, hey, I know you're emotional, but I know we're also better than that. We are better than that.

Get back to being us, being on the same team.

Harrison Orr (32:14.677)
That's it.

Harrison Orr (32:19.022)
So I hope you saw yourself in a lot of those pieces right now. If you're defensive, I hope that unlocked a new level of understanding there on actually what's required in there and gave you a new frame to maybe see your wife and the conversations that you have with her and maybe unlock a new level of curiosity to understand her. Maybe you're realizing like shit, a lot of her protective parts are coming out right now. Maybe, maybe I don't even know the real authentic wife that I have in front of me.

Because of the conditioning and the resentment and the the less than ideal patterns that have been recurring in our marriage the last few years, we're both operating from these protective parts. We actually don't really know each other. We just know the protective parts of us that come out and get resentful and bitter and frustrated and withdraw and defensive and reactive. And the real versions of us have been so buried that we don't even know each other anymore. Well, isn't that exciting? Because you can unburden yourself from these protective parts and then you get to have

A whole new relationship. You get to understand your favorite person all over again and actually bring them back to being your favorite person instead of this source of stress and resentment because all you've interacted with is each other's protective parts. What a fucking blessing that is.

Harrison Orr (33:33.304)
So don't be sorry. Be better. And if this hit home as well, I have one ask for you. If this hit home,

And you're on this journey, and you and your partner are on this journey because you believe in each other, you believe in your marriage, and you want to save it together, share it with them. Some of my content recently, both with new guys that I've spoken to and with clients recently, they've had the opportunity to I dare say bond over some of my content, some of these these conversations and some of the stuff on social media. And it's

It's brought such a level of connection because the man is is proud that he's on this journey and he's doing this work. The woman finally feels seen in the sense that she's like, that's what I've been trying to say to you. That's what I mean. I I'm so fucking happy that you've found this, that you're on this journey, that you're that you're doing this work. And seeing that is such a relief on both sides.

to feel seen, to feel appreciated, to feel like someone is doing something about the patterns. They're not just hoping they disappear. And to feel finally heard that they are doing something about this and that the marriage actually fucking matters. Matters in actions, not just in words. So if that's the case, share some of share this episode with your partner.

Harrison Orr (34:56.654)
to know what you're starting to understand and what you're starting to change. Cause it brings you guys back to to bonding and being on the same team again.

And I hope it sparks a fun conversation for you.

Don't be sorry. Be better. Bye.