Lesley's Story: Is it Anxiety, Thyroid Issues or Lyme?

In this episode, Lesley shares her intense experience with an onset crisis linked to chronic infections and explores the intersection of traditional medicine, psychiatry, and addressing chronic infections. Lesley recounts her health journey, which initially involved manageable symptoms like night sweats and minor anxiety. However, following the birth of her granddaughter in 2022, she experienced a severe health collapse characterized by extreme anxiety, panic attacks, and sleeplessness. Despite efforts to manage her symptoms through medication and lifestyle changes, her condition worsened, leading to a psychiatric hospitalization. Lesley's story highlights the complexity of brain health and the significant impact chronic infections can have on mental well-being.

In this episode you will learn about:

• Chronic infections' impact on mental health
• Mental health struggles and hormonal imbalances
• Menopause, anxiety, and health issues
• Mental health struggles and medication side effects

Instagram: @heyheyelizabethmae
Website: www.heyheymae.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Hey, you're gonna be okay. I'm your host, Elizabeth May, and my functional health practice helps people heal when they've exhausted traditional options. When no one can figure your health challenges out, my team helps you resolve symptoms and restores your health. You're listening to my podcast where we'll hear stories of healing chronic illness from a root cause approach. So we're gonna talk today about how chronic pathogens can interact with our minds. Some of us are familiar with pans and pandas, pediatric acute, neuropsychiatric disorders, and pandas the same, just prompted by Streptococcus. And we're gonna talk through an adult case of that today. I have Leslie with me, and we're just gonna go through her experience of an onset crisis that was related to chronic infections and kind of peel back the layers and walk through her experience in traditional medicine and traditional psychiatry and moving into addressing her chronic infections and just talk about where she is now. So the important thing I want us to all understand is that we can have these acute neuropsychiatric disorders. Whether we're children, pans and pandas start with a P for pediatric, but this can also apply to an adult brain. Um, and it can be infection-driven. Pandas is pediatric acute neuropsychiatric disorder associated with streptococcal bacteria. So that is more driven by the chronic infection streptococcus. I find that those cases are complex. It's not usually just one infection, and that truly we think of brain health as something that's psychology or psychiatry dependent, but your brain runs your whole body, it directs everything, and the brain is still a part of our physical health. And so certainly we can have brain symptoms that stem from physical issues like chronic pathogens. So Leslie and I are gonna kind of get into her experience. And I do want to disclose before we get started that Leslie and I have known each other for years. We've just been like church adjacent friends. Um, her girls and I have a relationship too. Her girls have watched my children, but Leslie and I worked together in 2021. So a bit ago around thyroid and fatigue, energy concerns. You came to me then with digestive complaints. You were kind of in that perimenopausal phase, and we were just kind of doing a normal, like, let's work on my health. I'm in a good season for that. And that's what we did then. But as we got into things, you know, we did a lot of cleanup and then a few years later circulated back. Um, and the other things I do want to share is that Rachel, your oldest daughter, is my practice manager at this point. She has been for two and a half years, and she came to this work by doing an intake just like you did, where we we were working on some thyroid things, working on some general health, and she found such profound change. Your whole family really is kind of moved towards this root cause healing and was open to that before we started working together. And your other daughter works on our socials, and I've worked with your youngest after a mold exposure in college. So we're definitely all intertwined, and I just kind of want to be clear about that. But that does not negate or change the validity of your story and experience. And I think in a way, it's been such a grace that we have a crossover experience because at the time that you really were getting more sick, I wasn't really predominantly involved in your care. So let's kind of like rewind to maybe just some health history for you. You had Hashis, younger in life, some thyroid stuff, kind of set the stage for us on like what did your health picture look like before the crash happened?

SPEAKER_02 3:41

Everything was kind of moving along. I had, you know, of course, with age, things were changing. Uh the yes, the perimenopausal um component was there. And there were some, you know, uh night sweats, sleepless nights sometimes, but rare. Um, minor anxiety, but I mean it was minor. Um uh, but yes, some digestive issues, weight gain, um, sometimes lack of energy or some fatigue issues. But really and truthfully, I had a very full life, um uh very busy life, uh, worked part-time for our husband's business, um, took care, you know, of everything in the home, you know, did a lot with my girls, very, very active in my church. Um, of course, then um went to um 2022. Um, we found out that year that our middle daughter was pregnant with our first grandchild. And of course, there's just tons of um excitement with that. Uh, and of course, prior to that, we had done two weddings, you know, lots of busyness with that and showers. And I mean, I was always just in the midst of, I mean, just always pushing hard. And but I always recovered fine from it and and kept going, kept going. You would sometimes occasionally when we would meet, you would say, you know, we need to kind of work on diet and this and that, but I just kind of continued to kind of, I would do a little change, but nothing drastic. You know, you would still try to encourage me. But um, and like I said, when 22 came and the and uh our granddaughter was on her way, um, there was like a big shower that year, lots of help with uh getting um their home ready for the baby, just the normal go, go, go. I would host events here, and I never did anything small, I always had to do it the biggest way possible. Um kind of again, not always putting my health as a priority. Um, but I still was doing fine. Um, and then um I did go through menopause um really in 22, uh really fully in 22, um, and um all the big changes with that. And then of course September came when Remy was due, and there were many, many um, like so July was a lot of activity getting things ready uh for the baby shower, like a huge shower, lots and lots of prep for that, um, lots of pressure, and a lot of it was self-induced. Um, and then like I said, September came and when she came, I remember there being many, many days, even prior to doing lots of cleaning, helping at their home. And then when she was born, we were up like 36 straight hours um with the birth. Um, and we endured it fine. We thought we did. We remember coming home thinking I've never slept so hard and so good because we've been up uh with her uh birth, and then of course was right back over there to the hospital, and then over when she came home to their home, stayed overnight with them a couple of nights so they could rest, getting up with her during the night. We took turns. Um, something I never thought that would be hard for her at the point. I guess at that point I was what 56. Um, you know, I didn't think, well, that's not a big deal, you know, I can handle it. Uh that was September 28th and 29th, around that time. Everything seemed to be going fine. Um, but then somewhere, and then we celebrated Summer's birthday. Uh, my daughter who had the baby on October 4th, we had a big dinner at their house. We grilled out um and all, and uh fixed a gluten-free dessert, you know, all the things we were supposed to be doing. But uh somewhere between the 5th and the 12th, we don't know, we trying to nail down the exact day. Uh I woke up in the middle of the night um in just the worst panic that I had ever felt in my life. I had experienced a couple of panic attacks in prior years, uh, in 2000, um, I want to say 2009, after the death of a really close friend that we had been uh really helping them through that uh crisis. Uh experienced my first one and in July of that year. And then I had a few here and there, but they were very manageable. Um, with that attack, uh, you know, I did my doctor did prescribe back in 2009 some Xanax because she said I was having flight or fight. Um and they very much managed it. I would take maybe a half of one and it'd be gone, and I would have a prescription of 30 pills, and I I would hardly ever use even a third of it. I mean, I would never, hardly ever have to take it. Um and this went on for years. I hardly ever had one, but if I did, uh take a half of one, drink a little bit of a protein drink, and it was over. This particular night when this panic happened in October of 22, I took a pill, but it didn't phase it. Matter of fact, it made it probably a little worse. And um basically from that time on, I mean, profuse sweating, extreme fear. Um, I can't even I could go on um breathing was difficult. I mean, everything was just my body had become like an ultra, uh, an ultra-overdrive in a matter of minutes. And I remember praying and trying to just really calm down uh and breathe, but my body was just in such a state at this point. I it's hard to it and it's like what you and I said, my health is almost like in a matter of a minute it completely collapsed. Um and it just it never really eased. I mean, every day I felt like I could, I was gonna jump out of my skin to the point where I could not hardly stand how I felt. Um it was just and it was so difficult for my family to see, and they wanted to help me, but they didn't know how. I didn't know how to help me. Um I um tried changing, like I said, we cut out sugar and let's try to you know go to bed earlier, let's try um some melatonin, let's try because I at that point I I quit sleeping. I I did not sleep for weeks. I mean, maybe an hour or two here and there, but I went many, many days with almost no sleep, um, no appetite whatsoever, could not eat at all, hardly. I had to eat just to survive. But that was every bite I would my arm would shake, trying to put the food into my mouth because it was such a difficult um uh place to be. I just couldn't stand the thought and smell of food. Um I could not drive. I was unable, I worked part-time for our family business, and I basically had to almost completely quit doing anything that I was doing for that, um, unable to really deceive folks. I mean, I'm a social butterfly. I love being around people, my kids. They would come and try to be in my age, but I could not almost stand to even be around them. It's not that they were doing anything wrong, it's just I was so nervous and so anxious that I could not even begin to stand to be around folks. There were people that would come just to be here with me because I was so um, you know, they didn't want me to be alone, but I um just did not want to be around people. Um I was unable to really go to church at that beginning. Um my husband teaches a Sunday school class and has been for 30, almost 34 years, I think. I I had never hardly ever missed. I I didn't go for I think it was almost a year. I mean, I quit going because I just couldn't even get out of bed to get ready to go. Um it was just the strangest season, a strangest thing that's ever happened to me. Um, the scariest thing that's ever happened to me, the most unexpected. Um, but and I I thought, what did I do wrong? Or I should have done this, or blam that. And finally you and I talked a couple of times in that time frame in October. And you know, you were and at this point, you were still trying to explore what you thought might be going on, and you were learning things as you as you went, but I um I was just grasping at any kind of help I could get. So that is, I mean, there's so much more we'll we'll say, I'm sure, as we go along here, but that was just the beginning of of what's now, I guess, 19 yeah of of trying to regain my health, which we are doing, where you and I are in the process of doing right now.

SPEAKER_00 12:14

Yeah. So at that point, when you came to me in October, I can look back now in hindsight and see when we originally worked together, testing kind of showed an overactive immune system. There was some strep and staff in the gut, there was a little bit of digestive dysfunction, you had that thyroid history where you are half your thyroid was removed many, many years ago. There was some elevated insulin, some inflammation markers, but it was really in October of that year where things peaked. And I can also look back and we're just coming off of an episode about triggering events, and we can see there was menopause, so a big hormonal shift. There was a life stressor, even though it was a good stressor of welcoming the first grandchild and celebrating and doing all those things, those still are stressors. And then there also had been some UTIs, you know, when you first came back to care, we had all those complaints and symptoms that you just shared, but you'd also kind of mentioned like, I've been dealing with some UTI discomfort since September, but it tests negative, but I don't feel great. Something's just not right. And you were having some ringing and whooshing in your ears, and that was a new situation. And at the time, you know, we tried to bring in some just some like get this body stable, kind of foundational things. You cut sugar all the way, which was something you'd never been willing to do, and you were like done with it. Um, and that helped to alleviate some of like the gallbladder pain. You worked on your habits, you did things like that. We ran some labs, but those symptoms all continued and you we eventually ran a hormone panel too, which showed us that your cortisol was inverted. So tons of cortisol in the afternoon, evening, and then even by the time we got to the morning, it was still there and you were clearing tons. So your body was making more than even we were seeing, and that was just kind of your body truly was in this physiologically induced fight or flight state, but you hung there for months. So moving into, you know, we met in October, we met a couple of times, you're working through things, more symptoms are happening in November. You had an emergent mental health issue that was part of kind of that long stretch of not sleeping. Can you kind of share with me some of that season through the winter of 2020 into 23?

SPEAKER_02 14:24

Yeah, uh yeah, 22, 23. Yeah. Um it was so bad as far as like the just the constant um, I guess the flight or fight um uh mold that my body was in. I would just dread going to bed because I knew that it would be, you know, anywhere from you know, 10 uh eight to 10 hours of just constantly laying there in a constant state of of almost panic and and pain. And um my I felt like there was just like an ocean in my head. And um I um I just felt so it was dark, and you just felt like is this, you know, the time that the time just ticked by like like you know, slow, slow, slow. And I would I remember looking at my phone, you know, 500 times during like, will this night ever end? And this was every night. And then if I did ever fall asleep, if I was fortunate enough to fall asleep, a lot of times I'd wake up and I'd be like, just I'm again, my heart would be racing, I'd be scared to death. Um, I would just, you know, I would ask John just to hold my hand because I was so scared. And and of course I was affecting his rest, and I felt that guilt of you know hurting his health. And um uh just it it was just such a a stream of constant, uncomfortable moments. I mean, and and I thought, how can this continue? But every night I thought I've just got to, I've just got to keep going. I mean, there were times I did not want to keep going. I'm gonna be honest. There were there were moments even into in the into early 23 that I did not want to continue. And those are thoughts I never ever even they never came into my mind. But there were that, and I'll be just as honest as I know how to be. Um, it got so bad in 23 that my family would not leave me alone. I had actually a couple of friends, very trusted friends, not very many, that when my family couldn't be here, I would allow just a couple of women to come sit here. And it's a very humbling experience to see someone that's sick and very, very unstable mentally. Uh, and it's very humiliating almost because you think, I've always been such a normal person, but something had completely taken over my mind, and I kept thinking, what did I do wrong? And then you start, you know, having guilt, like could I have avoided this, whatever? Cycle. Huh? Cycle, yeah. And then you have such more sympathy for folks that you used to think, well, they're you know, they have mental problems or whatever. And you think you're talking about really changing your perspective about brain health and mental health challenges, it really changes your thoughts about that. Like it can happen to anyone. And um, and like I said, I had had one of the most if you I mean, those of know me, you know me all these years. I had a wonderful life. I mean, I still do. I mean, I'm one of the most blessed people on the planet. A wonderful, faithful, loving husband that works hard and takes care of his family, follows the Lord faithfully. Uh three amazing daughters, as you know, just love me, you know, me and their dad, and very hardworking, accomplished. You know, we have a nice home, we have everything a human could want.

SPEAKER_00 17:42

Yeah, in many ways, this was like a whole foreign. I think I remember you talking through even thoughts in your head, and you were just like, I've never ever, one time in my life had any of this experience or even had it anywhere near me. Like I just didn't even know that any of this existed. I didn't know that I could feel like this level of anxiety or this level of darkness. And it is bizarre having known you since I was like in my early 20s, maybe longer than that. Like you've always been very social and very peppy. And so when we saw the stark change to like an antisocial and like a very, very small, everything was fearful and scary, and like, and it was fear of like more symptoms, but it was fear of all kinds of things. Like it was very, very bizarre and very onset. And in this phase, you were rightly so. We were meeting here and there, looking at labs here and there, but it needed more support. And so some of the things you tried during that time, I know you visited a PCP, so you saw like a family doctor, and and that started a kind of a new phase of looking into medications to help support this. So let's just, what are some of those things that you tried in that season and and where did that bring you of trying to reach out for lots of different resources to help you get symptom relief?

SPEAKER_02 18:59

Well, I mean, you know, um one of my doctors, she, you know, she was very concerned and very sympathetic and tried to help with the avenues that she's been trained to use. And, you know, she encouraged me just to continue to try to take uh the Xanax. She uh uh I had had that on hand. Like I said, I had a bottle. The bottle that was in my cabinet, I think had been prescribed to me, like I mean, yeah, honestly, probably like three or four years prior. And it's I I think I'd taken two out of it. Um, I mean, that's how little I ever, I just hardly ever needed it. So I never had any concern about dependence or anything like that because I hardly ever took it. And it saw I said I could take a half or a fourth of the prescribed dose and it would take care of it. And I would never, and then I wouldn't have a problem again for a year, six months, maybe a year and a half. And uh, and sometimes I didn't even for sure need it, but I would think maybe I'll just take a quarter because I was really antsy or whatever. But that was so rare, I mean, rare, and then so I did continue to take that prescribed dose I already had, and and I took it like once or twice a day because I was I was actually kind of scared of it, so I would be careful about taking it, but then the anxiety just continued to just get worse and worse. And at Thanksgiving um of 22, um, I had gone to my mom or gone to my uh to John's family, and I did fairly well because I had actually taken a Xanax right before I went, and I was able to handle that really well. Didn't love it and didn't feel great, but I was pretty calm and enjoyed a little bit of food and stuff. Then I went to my mother's, which was a normal thing to leave there and go to my mom's. And I remember when I got there, things began to really collapse. And I was just at a point where I thought I just a hyper, almost a hyperventilation, and I didn't want to run everybody's Thanksgiving. And I remember thinking I'm not gonna take any more medication because obviously it didn't last. So I just told my family, I stayed there an hour and I tried to choke down a little food, literally almost made me physically sick to eat, but I didn't, I was trying to enjoy and go through the motion. And after an hour, I just told my family, I have to. I remember going back to the bedroom while they were getting food on the table. I remember thinking, God, just please get me through this. Please, please, please let me get through this. But I just I literally could stay an hour and I I just said, guys, I've got to go home. And I remember driving myself home. Um, and it's like I don't even know how I got from the south into global to um to my house, but I did, and God got me there. And um, you know, I came home and I just tried to survive. And I remember calling a practitioner friend um that night from our church to get his advice about some things, and he advised us, but I ended up actually going to the hospital in the middle of the night because I was my and I felt like I was literally going to explode. Was so anxious. It was just the worst feeling you can imagine. So John took me. Um, he was so fearful as well. And I drove to, we drove to us um, I think suburban hospital. And from there, I ended up at a local set psychiatric hospital in Louisville because they said they could get help for me immediately. And I was just at the point of desperation. I really was.

SPEAKER_03 22:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:26

And I went and um I didn't get help right away. Of course, they wouldn't let me have any of my medications that I was taking or whatever. Uh, and that's fine. But I actually remember because I wasn't able to take any of that stuff, that I actually was not as unglued, you know, uh that week, that night. But I still was not supposed to be there. It was not the proper place for my situation. And we had to, I had to, I wanted to get out immediately. So I was there 30 hours, and it was a terrible 30 hours. They weren't bad to me, but it's just not where I needed to be. Uh, and I have a whole new sympathy for those who have to be in those types of situations. But fortunately, I was only there for a short time. I came home. Uh, my family tried very hard to make things as comfortable and as easy for me as possible, but again, it was just a survival every day. And then there was a couple of days in December where I woke up and I did, and I had woken up from that time in October until the eighth day of December. I remember it being Molly was coming home and we were going to decorate our Christmas tree. We waited for her to come home from school. And I remember being anxious every single morning that from that time, that day in October. Every single morning. I mean, severely anxious every morning, having to force myself to put one foot in front of the other and get out of the bed. And that day, December, I didn't, I wasn't anxious that morning. Oh gosh, maybe it's over. Maybe it's over. And I remember that whole day I wasn't anxious. It was the strangest thing. And I I just felt kind of normal. And we put up our Christmas tree, we took pictures. I got to have a picture right behind me over here on the shelf of me holding Remy that day by the Christmas tree. And it was just a fairly normal day. And uh, remember my husband saying Saddle Might to her, and he was very tearful because he thought, oh, we finally have a normal family day. And but then the next day it was right back, you know. And I had one other day that was fairly good in December, and then but every other day was just uh just get through the day type of thing. I remember going to Christmas at my mom's and I I made it through, but every even opening every gift was like trying to dig a 20-foot trench. I mean, it was just everything took so much effort. Um, and then um by then though, I had actually seen a psychologist um or I guess a psychiatrist. Um and of course, they're let's just be honest, most of the time they are just trying to manage symptoms. It's symptom-based care of a brain, and a brain and the brain, and of the brain and the brain only. And that's what they know, and that's what they've been trained to do. And they and they they have done many, they've helped people. Let's not say they haven't done any good because they have. But in their situation, they want to prescribe medication.

SPEAKER_03 25:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 25:19

Well, I hadn't slept, and this actually happened right after I got home from the psychiatric hospital. I saw this doctor, and he's a great doctor. Uh, but he prescribed two psychiatric medications, a very, very high dose of a benzo, which was Xanax, a three milligram long-acting dose, uh, I think three times a day. And then he also put me on Serquil, which is a very strong psychiatric medication meant to treat schizophrenia and other types of psychological disorders, but also can help you sleep. That was why he prescribed it, because I had not slept for months. And I did sleep the first several days. I did, and it was such a relief. Um, but I kept asking that doctor, are you sure that this will not cause me a problem down the road? Are you sure this will not cause a long-term dependence? He goes, No, no, you're fine. He goes, I'm not giving you enough of it to cause a problem. He said, You'll be fine. But he kept giving it to me because I was just so desperate for some relief. I mean, desperate. But I asked him, I know on four or five occasions when I would have a Zoom appointment with him, are you sure that this won't be it? Oh, it'll be fine, you'll be fine. Well, unfortunately, this happened in the end of November, early December. I started taking it by right in early January. I started having what's called interdose withdrawal. Where even but in between doses, I started having withdrawal symptoms. Like I wasn't taking it, even though I'd just taken it several hours before. And Rachel looks at come, she's with me when she goes, Mama, we've got to get you off this medication. You know, she's like, she's looking at the reality, and it's starting to real, we're starting to realize that I am in the biggest hornetness that someone could have ever gotten into. I I I I used the phrase, I walked into the worst spider web anybody could have. I I basically became dependent on this drug and had no idea what I would that I was going that I was doing that.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

Uh I mean it's a sound-like situation, right? Because it's not just your brain and it wasn't just those symptoms that were psychiatric symptoms. They were symptoms of a bigger problem of that brain inflammation, of infections that will get into Lyme and Streptococcus and Bartonella, those things were there. And so a medication is not going to resolve those pieces that are still driving the body. So when you brought those medications in, did they offer you any sort of lasting relief or shift?

SPEAKER_02 27:55

Oh no, I mean, zero. Matter of fact, I mean, in in prior times before my health completely went away, I mean, just completely uh, you know, deteriorated, they did help because I was not in the acute state like I became in October 22. Um, but the medications would help in a very small, small amount. I didn't it would it would solve the problem. But now things were in such a different place in my physical and mental state that the medication not only did not help, they actually just completely exacerbated my problem. And I thought, I'm so sick and I'm so desperate for someone to help me. But the medications and things that they were given to help me were actually, I mean, yes, the seraphil did give me some relief in sleep, but if that didn't even last very long, and then you have yourself actually, and I don't think I really became extremely dependent on seraphwil, but there was still going to be a time that I had to taper off of it uh because you can't just stop taking that because it's a very strong psychotropic medication. And I'm thinking I cannot that I'm in this situation. I look at I looked at myself in January and I thought, how did I get here? I went from September 28th, you think about that day when I'm watching the birth of my daughter so graciously allowed Rachel and me to be in there with her and Aaron to see Remy be born, and it's like something I've never experienced before. And such you're on top of the mountain. I remember all my friends are texting me. Tell me about her, what's she like? And I was just gloriously um clamoring and all the joy of being a new grandmother and sending pictures and videos. My life was like at the top of the mountain, and within, you know, September 28th, probably January 24th, when I began the start of my taper of off of the Xanax, I thought, how in the world did I get here?

SPEAKER_03 29:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:52

I mean, what is that, five months, you know, or something, five and a half? I mean, my life had completely fallen apart. And and so it was just the most, it was just the twist of ironies that you can't even imagine happening to you. But again, there's so much, so much now that has been revealed to me through what you've shown me, through what the Lord has shown me, through the fruit, my friendships. And there's so much that I've learned that God has used us for, that I had no idea the path that and I said this to a friend on Facebook last night. This is a path that I would have never, and I probably I had planned to say this absolutely this is a path I would have never chosen, but it's a road that I would never not choose now, if that makes sense, because what I God has used us for, I just want to make sure I make this clear. I was in hell, like no human. I mean, I'm I know people have suffered much worse than this in their life, but this is just a level of pain and suffering that I never ever thought I would ever go through. And um, and and I had not even begun to really go through it at that point. I I still didn't even realize what was ahead of me the next several months. So, yeah, so basically um I I began and Rachel. Well, we would we decided at that point we were going to do everything in a natural, which we already were doing things somewhat with you, change gluten, no sugar, things like that. You helped had helped us with several supplements over the years, but you were becoming the light was coming on for you. You were God was showing you how the real path of healing was supposed to occur in people's lives in a lot of ways through this learning about chronic infection and Lyme. And it's like He had revealed all this to you at the following year in 23, and it's like everything was like a puzzle that was become coming together between we already believed in this root cause, but yet you were learning a new path. Because I thought to myself, God is beginning to open the biggest can of words for Elizabeth and her practice because of what she's learning through through this um this path of healing, and it was just in the right timing for you to be able to help me. Yeah, and so it was like, but I still had so much to go through even before that came in in the end of September, uh, end of uh 23. So yeah, so that was January 24th. We had seen a um uh a psychologist or psychiatrist, I guess it was a uh functional psychiatrist out of New York. I think she was it, I think she was in New York. I'm trying to remember. We saw her over soon. Uh-huh. She was but she basically told me what kind of road I had ahead of me. She did. She told me what was ahead. It was going to be a very hard road. But I remember saying to me, and you said it to me later about the about the chronic infection treatment, there's no other way out but through. And for so for me to get out of the that's the hornet's nest I was in, there was no way of getting through it, out of it, but through it. I had this walk through the whole the fire. So we started that process in January, and I tried really hard to come down off the the first of the Xanax, and we and we actually implemented a program through something called the Ashton method, which helps you to come off of Xanax because it's probably the hardest. There's several types of benzo uh they're called the benzo diazepines. There are several types of those drugs, they're all very, very addictive, but then uh but Xanax is probably the most difficult to come off of of all of those class of drugs. So I was on that. So then what we decided to do to use some of the astro method to incorporate Valium into that to kind of help ease me coming off that, and I think it did overall help, but it's still, I was in such a high dose by that time, Elizabeth, and I was in such a already such a terrible state, because at the time we didn't know all these other infections were raging, but I was just in such a deteriorated state that by April I'd already been to the emergency room two more times or just feeling like I was having a heart attack, feeling like that I was going to explode.

SPEAKER_00 34:08

Yeah, your body had been in fight or flight since October until that's such a long time. And through winter, and you'd gone to many different doctors, you'd worked on thyroid med stuff, you were at this point where you'd visit a functional psychiatrist, so psychiatry from kind of a root cause approach, and you guys had worked on weaning and your family supported and researched and helped so much during that time period. But I also remember watching and thinking, I don't know that this weaning thing is something that she can do in the environment that she's in, and you were starting to feel like this is isn't progressing enough, like it's just not, it's not happening. So then what was the next step that came about in May of that year?

SPEAKER_02 34:54

Yeah, well, so in April, I'm at the ER, end of April early, yeah, in the very end of April, and Rachel basically started doing some, she'd already been doing some research, and and with your some of your advice and just your all's knowledge, you know, you're you're the trained professional, but you know, she works under you, and you all were working and nobody nobody was more concerned about getting me well than my own child. But she had you in her corner saying, We've got to figure this out. So she started researching holistic places to help with um coming off this medication because we were not going somewhere where they were going to give me, and I believe you me, I was researching places that would accept insurance and allow me to go in and receive treatment. But what would they have done? They would have put me back on other types of psychiatric medications, and they would have tried to put me off this medication in a matter of weeks, days, maybe a couple weeks, which is actually extremely dangerous. And Rachel basically said, Mom, you are not going to those places. I know they're will save you a lot of money, but we're going this direction. She goes, I feel like this is the path we've got to go. And there were no other options really, but this place in Sedona, Arizona, uh, alternative to Med Center, ATMC. And um it's a two-month program. You can go less, but they suggested a two-month program. And I'm I'm just gonna be really honest, it was a it was a tough pill to swallow because for me to walk in their door, I had to hand them a check for$60,000. That was more than my first house. And it was out of pocket, it was out of pocket. Great. So you know, yeah, and so you know, to have sixty thousand dollars coming out of your pocket, the moment's like, I don't care what it costs, we will spend whatever amount it takes to get you well. And you know, there's a lot of guilt too of having a dip and target.

SPEAKER_00 36:44

Well, Leslie, that was the array, because you didn't even know that you would get well. You have to make a$60,000 commitment with no get no true guarantee that two months would bring you through a process or discovery for you what was there, you know, you were committing to deep detox and working through their methods, and here's my money. And what happened after that?

SPEAKER_02 37:04

Yeah, so the accent the girls you know, it was like the the two days before I left. I had already I had my it's like my health kind of leveled up. It was like to an answer to really God's prayer. God had just granted me two days. I feel like this is telling me that I was supposed to do it because my health kind of leveled out, and I wasn't terribly anxious. I had to fly, you know, halfway across the country. I had to pack a bag for two months. And of course, my family was, I mean, you talking about in the trenches with me, packing my bag, buying me new socks, buying me new this, let's go to get some sweatpants, let's make sure you're comfortable. They said, Bring, you just need this, this, you don't need makeup, you don't need anything. So I packed my bag. John booked us some uh flights, um, and we flew on May 9th, 2023, to Sedona, Arizona, and um so um it was the hardest day of my entire life to leave um my family, my home, my grandchild that I had hardly got to hold. And I went there and um, but they were very kind. It was not exactly what I would have, you know. Uh oh, it was clean, it was uh helpful, it was they were very caring folks, and there are people that I'll one day revisit. I think John says I need to revisit them one day when I'm well so they can see the path that they help me. It may not all be super spiritual or super the way I would have, but yet they were very loving and kind and they walked me through a process. I know the night that John, uh John had to walk me out the door, or he had to walk out the door, I was under a secure, I mean it was a secure gate. I couldn't leave unless somebody flashed their badge. I mean, can't you just can't even imagine what that felt like to sit there and be under lock and key. Yeah and uh uh and they and of course they learned fast that they I was no threat to anything, you know, but they had to follow every rule, and uh my husband had to turn around and walk out the door, and I knew I would not see him for two solid months. But um, they put me in a program where they they use heavy uh sauna um processes where you would you would use sauna every day. It was miserable because you're going through withdrawal where you basically feel like you're going to literally jump out of your skin. You're you're shaking internally, your internal self is shaking tremendously. My ears rang like I felt like I had a thousand birds in each ear that my ears rung so loud, um, and that had gotten so much worse. And um, like I said, I still had no appetite, still wasn't sleeping great, sleeping better, but not great. Um, and having to go sit in a sauna one to two hours every morning. But they had other types of they re-exercise, they they did foot baths, they did uh castor oil packs, they did all kinds of things to help cleanse your body, they had massage, all that was included, and it was a great treatment. I was miserable the entire time because I was going through heavy benzo withdrawal, and my body was I was literally just I was literally just trying to put one foot in front of the other, but I kept putting myself saying I knew what the Lord had suffered one day in his life for me, and I thought I can go through this because of what he did for me, and I'm gonna do it, I'm going to do it, and I'm gonna do it for John, I'm gonna do it for my family, I'm gonna do it for my grandbaby. Um, I'm gonna do it for my mom, you know, who supported us in this process. I'm gonna do it. So every day I just said, one more day toward my healing, one more day toward my healing. That's what I said every day, and I would journal nonstop. I filled up a whole journal while I was there, every page I filled up, every page. There were prayers in it, there were, you know, uh words of affirmation. I spoke to myself. I had a song that Rachel um gave me from Charity Gale called We Need a Miracle, and I listened to that song every single night before I went to bed, if my earbuds. And my other roommates would be in there, they'd be watching their movies or shows, whatever, and I would be singing that song to myself. And I thought, God, one day is gonna give me a miracle. And so I did that for two solid months, and um uh and like I said, they there was constant appointments, how you know there was therapy, there was all this walking through the journey. Yeah, very yes, very and they they told me one day you're going to see the end of the tunnel, it's you're going to get there. But many times I would walk in there and say, How can I do this another month? How can I not knowing that I still had many more months? Because I remember walking in the day and met I met a gal named Lotus, who is the head of um the detox shop, and she helped with supplementation. Another uh her and uh uh she consulted with another doctor, uh Dr. D, that would um talk us through these different processes to get our bodies clean, you know, uh rid of this uh medication. When I first met her, she was actually on vacation the first week I was there, but when I walked in, uh this this ball full of energy greeted me, and she said, This is just two months of your life, you regain your whole life. She goes, It's gonna be worth it, you know. And because she knew I was really close to my family and whatever, and that's it was a very hard process. But it was, and like I said, I saw some people there, and they just seemed to have such an easier time. They were going to the pool that was right outside my room that I never stuck my toe in. Um, they were laying out in the sun. Uh, there's many other stories of why we won't, uh I didn't get in that pool. You and I know the secret behind that. We'll talk about that. Uh, but off camera, but there were many, there were many times that people were having parties and doing art and doing this.

SPEAKER_03 42:54

And not your experience.

SPEAKER_02 42:56

And I I did you know try to participate in some of it, but I remember sitting there thinking, just get me back to my room. And I would go back to my room and I would sit in a chair, and I would, I would just sit there and pray, sometimes, like I said, for two, three, four hours at a time, just asking the Lord to get me through, get me through. And um, I would look, I had my I had a picture in my, there was a just a painting they had hung on the wall, and around the frame, I had all my family and around my pictures, and I had frames of of all my girls, and and and I had Remy, of course, there, and and and pictures of John, and and just just get me through, Lord, get me through. And that's and people would say, You have so much to fight for. And I said, Oh, do I ever? And I said, I will fight to the bitter end. And that's what I did. I came home um off, completely weaned off of Xanax and the bagum. Unfortunately, could not get off the seraphore yet. There's just too much demand on my body at that point. Came home, and I remember on the way home. When I left the day John picked me up, I actually felt really good that day. Took a lot of pictures with the people that I was in there with, the staff, and of course with John, and just felt really good. But the day, the next day when we had to fly home, I remember being so, so sick. I mean, just still, I was still in the throes of withdrawal. And my body was just, I mean, it was just fighting me. And I remember thinking, how am I gonna even fly home? I was so, so sick. And I remember putting my head against the window on the plane thinking, I'm not sure I can do this. But I thought, no, you've already come through a really hard season. You can do this. So got home July 9th. Uh, my kids obviously had my yard immaculate, my flowers planted. They were trying, and I didn't want to let them know how very bad I felt. I might we actually went to Chewy's my whole family and Louisville, my mom, my sisters, everybody wanted to see me, and everybody's in such a celebratory mood and happy. And I remember thinking, you just got to put on that sweet face and you gotta just suck it up and act like everything's good. And I remember thinking, I I I it took everything I had to even eat. I was still so sick. And um, but I made it through and I wanted to be able to enjoy them. So I got home and uh just knew that I was in a safe place and that it was gonna be, it was going to be uphill from there, but it was not gonna be I and I didn't even know, of course, like I said, you and I had not even really the light had not come on completely for both of us at that point, and I didn't even really realize what was still ahead of me, but I knew it was uphill. So that was July, and then um things with um with Rachel and and you talking just really you all continued to think we got to figure this out because we knew there was more to my health collapse, and because the benzo was just the part that happened after it. So we had to figure out what was the route, what was the the the the trigger and what caused it to collapse?

SPEAKER_00 46:03

And you noted even in your time in Arizona that your experience going through the program was a bit different than some other people. Your body seemed to handle things differently. Flying back home seemed to trigger a hard day, and now we know more about the pathogens that were at play. And and once you got home, you went and saw a local functional doctor that I said kind of like planted the first seed, just to kind of check on some kids' markers, like have another doctor on this side of the country able to help kind of advise. And he brought up, you know, mold illness or Lyme based on labs. And we kind of, you know, Rachel comes to work and I'm kind of tertiary to your family, and we would talk through, well, could there be mold in her environment? And I've been to your home and I have lots of experience with folks and mold illness and all the questions to ask. And I was just like, I don't know, I'd be really shocked if there was mold there. And that just kind of continued. And while you were gone, I had experienced my own acute run-in with a tick and um had gotten sick pretty quickly and was learning a lot and had gone back to school. And um, over those couple of months of listening to Rachel share your story and your experiences you were going through detox and when you came home, um, the light bulb just kind of turned on for me that there probably was more there to what you had going on. And I and I I dabbled in maybe sharing it when three-year-old files and saw again that there had been that high staff and that high strep, and that there had been an overactive immune system a couple of years before when we worked together and just trying to kind of keep thinking and listening. And in that time I decided, because I'm not big on pushing my way of thinking on someone else, but you all are close and I'm with Rachel most days of the week and shared with her just a podcast that shared someone's story who had gone through Lyman Co. infections. Um, and how how how did you come to kind of hear um, or how did you experience even like being having that information shared with you, I guess?

SPEAKER_02 48:07

Because I think Rachel Well, yeah, well, it was I think it was like late September. It may have been, it was either right before Remy's birthday party or right after. And you're not in together. Of course, like I said, you and Rachel worked together three at least three days a week, sometimes more. And you know, like I said, she was Rachel was shaking every bush that could be shook to try to figure out how to help her mother heal. And um, and like I said, who else could she have in her corner, but you know, someone who's doing the same thing for her own health and for you know the health of people that she would, you know, uh work with in her practice. And so you and her were just like doot doot do. And so y'all actually, Rachel, I think she called me or texted me. It was on a beautiful September day, and she said, Mama, she goes, We're we have Liz and I have just sent you this podcast about someone who has gone through um um in immune therapy for Lyme and for other co-infections. And we think this is what's wrong with you. And she goes, You are going, she, and she was already so convinced this was it. You all were like, This is it. She goes, Mama, you're gonna be okay. You are gonna be okay. And so I was like, okay, I'm excited. So I remember listening to it, um, to this gal's podcast, this woman, very articulate young woman, um, who had been through such a journey. And and I and and just, you know, she had had Lyme and she'd had other uh, I think she had EBV, she had uh straps, she had other things, she had the earringing, she had the anxiety, she had almost everything that I had. And I'm thinking, oh my gosh, somebody else has gone through this. Obviously, she I don't think she had the benzo issue in play there, she didn't have to go away, you know, whatever, but she still was very, very sick. Yeah, and um I remember her talking about the the journey that she'd gone through with immune therapy through another practitioner and how successful it had been and how she was well, and that she felt like she had not felt in years. She goes, I never even she goes, I'm not even sure I felt this good before I got sick. And I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm gonna think, oh my gosh, I'm gonna, and so summer, I sent it to Summer because we know my Summer has had her own health journey for many, many years. And what did we blame it on? Hashimoto's thyroid, you know, the autoimmune issues with her thyroid. This is why she had constant fatigue, this is why she had constant neck pain. This is why she had constant, you know, just brain fog, just never felt good. And I said, I sent it to Summer, and Summer said, Mom, it was like it was like the biggest light bulb that had ever come on in our life, probably ever, as far as just as far as our physical and mental health. And she's like, This is it. This is it. I'm like, I know it's it. And at this point, after you know, we had already spent, I mean, you know, the amount we spent for Arizona was really still a drop in the bucket compared to what we spent on other practitioners and other medications and supplementation, and I mean thousands and thousands of dollars. And my husband's like, we knew this was kind of another expense, even though it was really one of the more inexpensive routes. He told me compared to what I'd spent in Arizona, it was a drop in the bucket. Yeah, I mean, literally a drop. And my husband's like, I don't care. He said, We're spending it. He's like, We're doing it. And so we you said, Leslie, the next step we have to do, if you're convinced that this is the route you want to go to do the low dose immune therapy, we need to get off cerebral next. That we can't send you into this uh immune therapy on a psychotropic medication. So we've got to get you off of that. So that's what was my next step. I'm like, oh gosh, I'm still so much, you know, still feeling so awful. But I had to get that one out of my system next. So that was in October of 23. You and I made the decision we were going this route in September. Yeah. By the end of October, or what was it the end of October? I think I started the taper, and I think uh the end of I think by the end of by November. I think by November I was I think I did it in lecture.

SPEAKER_00 52:18

Yeah, by the end of October you were off because you started immune therapy in November.

SPEAKER_02 52:22

And that was Yeah, November 1st. We started November 1st, remember? Yeah, I remember now, yes. So but I did it really fast. And and and I remember the one the one of the practitioners I mentioned in uh Arizona, she goes, Oh, it's gonna be much harder to come off circle than you but you imagine. And I was kind of dreading it. And it's not an easy, so for some folks, it is really difficult, but I guess people can hop on and off too.

SPEAKER_00 52:45

There's a lot to, you know, benzos, depending on brain chemistry and genetics and pieces that are at play, they interact with different bodies differently. And I think that's something too, because you know, we can have people listening saying, well, Xanax is really helpful to me. It does, I can hop on and off, no big deal. But everybody's brain and body, and then the pathogens and the way your immune system interacts with medication too can be different. And so for you at that point, hearing the hoop, we had pretty much, you know, we walked through symptoms again, and you filled out an extensive survey for me, and we nailed it down pretty clearly that Lyme was there, Bartonella was there, Epstein Barr was there, we did a little testing to kind of see about some co-infection stuff that we can't always see clearly, um, or they look like, you know, some of those Lyme coinfections can look like Lyme. And so we want to make sure that they're not there. But in that time period, once you kind of had identified with the infections model in those particular infections, you were leading on a mission. Like, but also there was finally some sort of hope because the other processes I think were still, we have to do this right now because this is where we are. We have to get rid of these meds because this is we got to get off of them. But there wasn't really a hope, or um, I would say like a deeper identification with like the root cause. And at that point, you had that wind at your back and you did. You got off the sterequil within like a month. And then the big thing for me was stereo quil interacts with the brain in such a way over time that it it reduces brain health. And and on my side of the street, part of that acute neuropsychic psychiatric piece would be um acute brain inflammation and effect that's going on. So we wanted that out of the picture. We did a little testing in that time just to kind of see to where neurotransmitter balance was for you. Some of your symptoms at the time were you were hypersensitive to swallowing. Some of those digestive things were kind of coming back. You would say, I feel like jello. Um, I just don't feel like myself. My anxiety is here. Um, some of the things you had eye floaters, were little, you would see little things in your eyeballs, classic Lyme symptom. There was a lot of weakness and fatigue that would ebb and flow. Sleep was better, but it was still weird, I think at that point. Um yeah, and Saraquil was in there for sleep. And so even getting off of that, that was a big part of like that month trying to like negotiate. Will she sleep? Will she not? Um, and so we finished that taper, you finished that taper at the end of October and you were ready to move forward. We'd done some drainage and we were starting to see even some more of those symptoms pop out as we were working through the drainage phase of Lyman Co's. In that first phase, we worked on um and broke things up. We wanted to be careful and wise with your body because you had been in fight or flight now for basically a year. Um, and just thinking about how we tried to fortify the body as much as we could. And you certainly had some of that support when you were in Arizona. But once we began immune therapy, where where was your mindset and what was it like to start that? What were symptoms like? Is the process simple, difficult, you know, compared?

SPEAKER_02 55:56

Tell me, tell me you had me listen to a few podcasts uh from other folks that had worked with you in this pro in this healing journey. And um they always said, This is a this can be a really bumpy road. It's it's going to, she's this one person said, This really works if you're willing to to to do the do the work. It it will work for your health, but it's not probably for some, it can be very, very difficult. I remember thinking at this point after what I've been through, what's another uh few months? And I thought about what this gal in Arizona said, this is two more, this is two months of your life. And I thought, okay, you said this is gonna be it can be seven and a half to nine and a half months of treatment. What is that compared to your whole life? And I looked at the richness of my life around me as far as the blessings that I had been given. I'm thinking, I will do whatever else it takes. Yeah, I mean, I'm a I'm a very type A strong-willed person anyhow. Um so I was not going to let um this stop me because we I was 110% convinced this was it. You didn't even have to hardly say a lot to me to really tell me this is the approach you want to take. And you had already been on your journey, and it was not a fun journey. I saw how bumpy it was for you, and I thought, okay, she's she's getting through it. Still wasn't real fun some days, but you were making it. You were still raising your two boys, running your household, running a very successful practice, helping tons and tons of people heal. I thought if she can do this with all that demand on her, and I don't have nearly that demand on me, I can do this. I can do this. So November 1st, and and I'll just be honest, the first month was rough. I mean, it was rough. Yeah, um, there were days I'm thinking, oh, do I really want to keep doing it? And it was hard. But I thought, you know, um, like I said, the earring sometimes was worse, the anxiety was really, really bad still, the brain fog. There, then depression kind of sug in. And I had never really experienced depression quite that way before. I had some of that even during the withdrawal time from the Binzo, but this was like really a dark, there were a couple days so dark, I thought, this is really kind of scary. But you I we were in continual care where I I could message you and you always would get back to me in a reasonable time frame, and you would say, This is normal. This is normal. You would say, it could be this, it could be that. So reassuring. Um, and there were times I would message you knowing that you would not be awake. Uh, you could have been, but you know, it wasn't a time that you would answer me, but I wouldn't message you in three or four o'clock and I'd say, I've never known this type of sick. But my body, my immune system was beginning to recognise these ugly pathogens to raise their head. This immune therapy was causing it to raise its head, and it was fighting. You know, but the immune system, and you've talked about this, I'm sure, in your prior podcast, it's an amazing thing that God created. He designed, and you told me this for for probably five years before this incident. Our bodies are designed to heal, our bodies are designed to heal. And I thought, okay, this is my immune system, letting it know it's going to win the battle. But it was, but it was a battle. So I just kept talking to you, you kept talking to me, kept talking to me, keep going, keep going, keep going. And every time I would have the calendar you gave me with my different vials that I would take on different days, and I remember marking through each day one more day, one more day. And I remember at the end of the first phase, which is called the SSRs, usually are the hardest for some. Now, some it's not hard for others, you know. Um, summer like her first month wasn't as hard for her when she did the therapy. Her second month was harder. So whereas my first month was hard and my second month was easier. We just kind of had the opposite experience. But we both are convinced and are still convinced that this is the route we were supposed to go. So got through the the first phase SSRs and then started on what's called the one in and 10Ms. And basically, um, I am now uh just every every week you kept telling me it's gonna get better, it's gonna get better, and it did. Yeah, and I remember I started having one, two, three, four mornings in a row, five mornings in a row, there was no anxiety.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:29

And I'm like, Yeah, we used to call them windows. We would call that do you remember that when you were in Arizona? You would call them windows because they were very short, fleeting times when you wouldn't have symptoms. And I remember you telling me, I feel like I don't just have windows anymore. I have whole days, it's like I have doors to like big amounts of time where I feel great, and that really was like the end of December. That was kind of a three.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:54

And I wish I could find it on here. You had said it was one of your most exciting things I uh I had said. You said that's the best thing you'd heard all year, or whatever. I said, I said I felt like I had never been sick. Remember that?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:06

Yes, you said yeah, Saturday. I think that might have been February and March.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:09

I think that may have been February. Yeah. And I said, I felt like I'd never been sick because I had I had felt such a difference, and and like my body was feeling truly like it was healing, okay. But then there would still be some moments of like it would not feel as well and whatever, but still the progress was happening, and I could see my energy increasing. And like I said, the biggest thing for me, the two biggest symptoms I had that were so difficult were the and I would say the lack of sleep, but that had already pretty much resolved itself. But at this point, it was the constant anxiety and even the brain fog that went with it, and just my brain not being able to think, and earring. And I will say, with all honesty, at this point, the anxiety has almost completely resolved itself. And I'm still have one whole round, but I'm still just beginning the last round with some of the I'm I'm finished with the actual immune therapy for the Lyme and the uh the Bartonella. Yeah, I'm finished with that, even though there's some drops and things I'm doing, but that's just minimal treatment that's you know that you finish to make sure you get it all out. But the uh the what's called the 10M's for the EBV and the herpes and the strep, which my strep was remember, off the charts. Yeah, yep. So that's why that's why you said that's why you said that's why you had the complete mental collapse was the pans, the strep that caused us the pans. That's what was wrong. Because my mine was like off the charts, hi. Remember?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:43

Yep, and mine too really did affect you in neuropsychiatric ways. Like you also experienced the body pain and the aches, and and to say aches feels so like basic. Like it's so much more profound than that, and the inner trembling and the shaking that can be attributed to Bartonella, um, EMF sensitivity. So thinking back to the day that you flew home from Arizona, entering back into like a very high EMF situation, and your body was so tender, like and the Bartonella was still there. There, we can look back and see lots and lots of places. We can also look back on the months of therapy and see where those pathogens were all showing themselves. The symptoms you had, even when you had air hunger for so long, that is a Babesia co-infection of Lyme symptom. And that changed over those first couple of months of addressing Babesia Burrell.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:34

I had air hunger almost. I mean, and if if no one is ever anybody listening to this has never experienced air hunger, that is probably one of the most scary ones I did experience. Basically, you're taking in full oxygen. I had the oxometer that I would use every day, and it would show my oxygen being anywhere from 95 to 99 percent. But yet my brain was telling me that I was not getting enough air, and you feel like suffocating. And I would this would happen to me for 12 hours a day for weeks at a time. It was just again, such a hard serious. But then once I started realizing, it I think even air hunger was almost some of a fear-based symptom because I know it was you said it was Fibecia, but but I'm telling you, once I started realizing that I was finding a path of healing, that I think part of that helped release some of that. That my brain was like starting to work the way it was supposed to, and it let go. And I didn't I stopped having air hunger. And I and I really have almost had, I don't think I've had any for since last year, late last year, after we started the SSRs. I don't think I had any. And you're talking about a relief. And then like I said, the last two symptoms that seem to really hang on are the anxiety and and like and that and the brain fog and focus, and that has gotten so much better. I mean, I'm serious. I you had given me some anxious drops, and I took those on and off for for months, but I have a bottle right now that you gave me just to use as needed instead of like I was had it as a regimen. Now I just take it as needed. That bottle's still half full because I hardly ever have to take it. I mean, I just am not anxious. And even when I think I need to be anxious, as I told you earlier, I just kind of like it's okay. I breathe. I used to just immediately. Whenever I had a lot going on, I would tense up, I would stop breathing, I would just now I'm like, I'm not letting my body take control. I let go, I breathe, I um I just relax and and and realize that I my body is okay and nothing's nothing's wrong, and I don't have to stress out. And if there's something going on, you know, if I need to complete several tasks, I'm like, you know, I can't complete all those, so let's decide what's most important and let the rest go. I never could do that before. Yeah, but I know at this point my health is much more important, and that stuff does not matter. Um, and so you know, the air hunger, and like I said, that's away the anxiety. I still do have the earring some, and it can be very irritating, but I'll be honest with you. Now that the anxiety is gone, that piece seems to be almost completely gone. Um, and I contribute that to me dealing with the strap and all that, all that's gotten under control. And even though it's still got some ways to go, it's it's pretty much gone. The earring does still, it's like, ah, it is kind of a buzzing. And then today I can hear it some, but you know, I'm so thankful for the other to be gone, but I can deal, you know, and I know you keep telling me, just keep pushing on. It's gonna drop off, it's gonna drop off again, it's gonna drop off because it's so much better than it was, yeah. Um, even though it's not gone.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:45

Um, but we've been able to look, you know, at labs too and see some other things that have normalized on paper, you know. Before you kind of had some iron dysregulation, your ferritin was super low, and now it's normalized. Your TSH has been all over the world and back around again. You've been able to decrease medicine through this journey for your thyroid, and there's a lot more steadiness there. There's a lot of change, and I would say too, that part of the immunotherapy journey, and honestly, part of what Lyme does is it really multisystemic. That's how it works, that's how it functions in the body. It affects all systems and it moves around. Those are big keys for when I'm listening to identify Lyme. Sometimes I have a problem with this body system, then I have this, or I have pain here, and then it moves. Those are keys, but part of the healing journey with immune therapy in Lyme is you get to address all sorts of things because it is a full body approach. We're looking at nutrients, we're looking at food, we're looking at habits, we're looking at mental health, we're looking at the way you talk to yourself. Like all of these things, we really need all hands on deck to heal a body. And I think for you, that is a place of freedom when you talk about you would do it again. Sounds insane, honestly, after listening to the last hour of all the things you've gone through. But truly, I think the part of the part of this journey that has been dear for you is that it pushed you to heal in so many more ways than just healing your physical body.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:14

Yeah. You know, I look at like daily tasks that um that I used to have to do, you know, just a normal make your bed, dishwasher, plan your meals, um, grocery shopping. I mean, I used to not, I couldn't go to the grocery store. I mean, I couldn't go to the grocery store. I remember going back to the grocery store, of course I couldn't find anything because they switched to the grocery store. I remember going to the grocery store and John's like, I'm surprised that you weren't stressed out. I'm like, I actually really enjoyed it. Um I don't begrudge the daily task anymore because I'm so thankful that I'm well, getting well. I'm so much farther along and almost well that I can do those daily tasks. And I actually am thankful for a home to take care of. And not that I wasn't before, but it's just in a different, I see um the flowers that I planted this year, and that I was able to actually shop for them. And um, I went to the flower shop here in town that my husband's good friends with one of the owners, and um and uh talked to him on a weekly basis. And I told that gentleman when I got there, I said, I'm gonna be here a while. I said, I'm slow, but I remember just taking my time and enjoying the beauty of the beautiful day, and I was there a long time. They couldn't believe how long I was there, but I bought the most beautiful plants and I came home and I had a little help from Aaron, my son-in-law, because he loves to plant, but I did the majority of it by myself, and they are so beautiful this year, and um it has been such a joy. We're usually it would just stress me out. Uh, I'm like, I did my own this year. I didn't have to come home to them done for me, which I'm so grateful they could do it for me last year, and I got to enjoy the beauty of that, but I still did it for myself. Um, I was um hosted Easter, which I didn't get to do last year, and I'd done that for almost 30 years prior in my home. And this year we were able to host again, and it went off without a hitch. Well, I shouldn't say without a hitch. We did have uh one situation. My sister-in-law got injured, but that all she's healing. She's back, uh she's healing beautifully and almost out of her boot. And um, and then of course, I hosted Mother's Day and it went off beautifully, gorgeous day, and able to do the preparation that for my home without it stressing me out. Uh, I couldn't even attend those events before, much less prepare an event at my own home. Um going to church, it's just become like the support I got from my church family through this is something that can't even be put into words. Like I the facility in Arizona, they told me that I received more cards of well-being than any other resident they can ever remember. And they they said every day I got four, and they were mostly from my church family praying for me, telling me that, and text messages from them and meals and rides and you know, whatever, bringing me to lunch. And I'm thinking, and one of the gals that sat with me um during some of my darkest days where I actually did contemplate self-harm. I I I hate to admit that, but I was so sick and I was in such a bad place mentally. Yeah, I couldn't, I can't even describe to you. There were times I actually contemplated hurting myself, and I hate to I hate to even have to say that, but I think it's it's important to be honest. Yeah, uh, I never did anything to come close to doing it, but those thoughts came into my mind, and I actually expressed it a couple of times with my husband, and he just he's like, Okay, you're not being left alone. So one of my church friends came and sat with me and saw me pace and saw me beg for mercy. I mean, she saw some ugly stuff, and I said, I'm sorry you had to see that. She goes, Well, I say I would do it again. She goes, I'm here no matter what, and we're still very close. And I can't put a price tag on that. I cannot, it's something that is just beyond. And now I can't wait to be there every week, two and three times a week. I cannot wait because it's like the greatest support system ever. And um so it's all those new life appreciations, the sunshine that you kept telling me would help heal my body. I can't wait to be in it. I'm in it hours a week. Um it's just a lot of things. It's just um, like I said, I'm I'm watching Remy overnight now on Mondays because I keep her all day on Tuesdays, so she sleeps so well here. And I said, instead of y'all having to get up extra early to bring her, just bring her here on Monday. She does beautifully here. Uh uh relatively huge.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:44

You couldn't even be around her for a bit because she was the baby that made noise and it was bothersome, you know, like there it was just too much.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:50

Or I or I regretted that I I had such guilt because of my sickness and I could enjoy her. So then it was actually a trigger because it made me sad that I couldn't enjoy her, so it's just a vicious cycle. So now she stays with me, and then uh summer is now going to start some new employment where I'll be able to probably keep her an extra half a day or a day. And I'm she and I took her last night just on a whim. I took her to see my mother in the south end of global. John and I just drove down. We only got to stay two and a half hours, but I thought, you know what, we got to eat dinner with her, and we spent my sister and her husband were there, and we enjoyed several hours, and I'll say several, two and a half, three hours, and it was wonderful. She put on the biggest, you know, little dancing show and laughing, and I'm thinking, I'm enjoying it. It's like I would not appreciate all that to the degree that I do now if I had not gone through this journey. And now you've given me the opportunity to share the story, and and I'm just praying that the Lord will use this to, I mean, I hope people will be listening to this podcast over not because it's about me or about you, but it's about helping someone find their healing journey. Because without that podcast, that I said, this gal, um, I think her name is Natalie. I I listened to that thing five times or so the first day. And since then, I've probably listened to it another 10 and all the other podcasts. And now we'll be doing the same thing with yours. Now we'll be showing it to people and say, listen to this. And it will be people, the light bulbs are gonna be coming on all across this county, this state, and other places saying, This is what's wrong with me. And if anybody is, you know, you asked me to to write down some things that were different. I mean, I think I basically already said it. Another thing, John likes to travel, and when he would try to plan trips before, I'd always think, Oh, I need to do this, or maybe we shouldn't leave because of this, or you know, we've got this going on. Now I said plan the trip. Let's go. I mean, I want to go and do it all, you know. Um, so um I want to be at every family function, I want to plan activities. Um, you know, it's just it's just one of those things. I mean, I've wrote down tons of stuff, I probably haven't said, but all I know is that we we figured out the problem and you have researched and figured out the way to fix it. And what happened with that gal that I listened to on the podcast, what's happened to me, it's real and it works. And it's a small investment of money, it's a small investment of time, and some of some of the day that you're there to hold our hand through every hour. And um, you're not in the journey by yourself. That's the one thing I'll tell anybody thinking about. You're not on the road by yourself. You walk through something, you have other many other things in your life, you can't be with us every second. You you know, you have to divide your time, but you know, if you know, when we need you, you see when you you try to reach out as soon as you can and say, hang in there. And um yeah, and now it's a now and and and the I guess one of the last things I'll say is that now, because of the journey I've gone through, my like I said, we've already said it kind of, but summer's now found her healing journey and she is well on her way to being well, and she's only 27. She's gonna be able to be well so much longer, she won't go through this acute attack like I did because she's healed her body early. Rachel's gonna be able to go through this journey, and probably eventually Molly will go through it. My guess is that we've all I've probably passed it to all my girls in utero, yeah, and then there's a good chance John has it too. Um, I know he didn't like that, but he's already he's already talked about going through this therapy himself.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:29

Um we talked, yeah, we talked through your history. We do find that you were really in a late-stage Lyme place. And so Lyme has been there for when we look through your health history and EBV, even with the loss of your thyroid in the 90s, like those infections for you most strongly, Lyme had been there and would pop up from time to time, but it was it was that stressful, but a good stressful season and post-menopause that really shifted your body back into a place where it couldn't manage that and kind of brought you into that really dark season. And knowing you before there was Leslie before, there was a super dark season, and now there's like radiating Leslie after, where you are back to the person you were before, but you are just so much better. Like you did all of the work, you didn't shy away from that. And I think too, one of the questions I like to ask, and I think in this episode, it's kind of null and void, is how has you or your family loved you well while working through chronic illness? And I think the thing that's been cool for me knowing you before is that you let everyone love you well and you yielded to the ideas and you yielded to the process um and you let people care for you. And now that you're through it, I mean, the ability to love well or care for others well after you've experienced chronic illness, I think is just insanely different. I mean, I do it for work, but also it's wild. Your entire perspective changes, and I just love how much um you are willing to be cared for and you were willing to yield to the maybe this bizarre but super common, as we know, idea of Lyme and co-infections, because it really it is, you know, Lyme is carried by many vectors and bugs do reproduce and climate change does shift how many bugs are killed every winter, and there's there's just more proliferation of these infections. And I appreciate so much that you are open on your journey to this idea because it really um made good of my own not good, really sick experience, um, and is making good for a lot of other people who can start to see themselves in your story and stories like yours because we think of Lyme as this like bedbound, depleted situation, but it can also present in this neuropsychiatric manner acutely, predominantly. Once we get into it, you had other symptoms too, but this was the predominant thing for you. And I just really appreciate that you've been willing to be transparent and share all of the parts because a lot of the things you have gone through, no one should have to go through. And they're terrible and awful and vulnerable. And I just appreciate so much that you're willing because those things many people have gone through, and we don't talk about or share, and without hearing, we cannot see ourselves um in another story to be opened. So I just appreciate your time, your effort, and your willingness to share.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:26

Yeah. Well, and I appreciate you just um doing the work that you had to do because of your own illness. You were willing to, I mean, you were really willing to dig, dig, deep, deep, and even when you didn't feel good, so that you could find out what was wrong for you, maybe for your children in their future, um, and your other family. And then now you look at the many, many people you're gonna help. And um, I I want to shout this from the rooftops about um about this treatment because it's it just solves so many problems if you get to the root. And like I said, it it's not a quick fix, like a lot of you know, we want a quick peel, we want to go to the doctor, write that prescription, give me a pill, and that's kind of what the route I tried to go because that's what I've always known. But obviously, it was the exact opposite of what I needed to do, and and then I got myself like said into the biggest mess. But again, it that I'm not faulting those practitioners. I want to make sure they did what they were trained to do and what they thought was best, and in some cases, it really it's needed on a short-term basis.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:29

And some people don't have Lyme underneath of there, right? Not everyone has Lyme and co-invection, truly was the cocktail of things in the state and the place your body was in. Yes, yes, the ability of your immune system to be resilient or not at that time.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:43

Yeah, and I just it just was not what I needed, and we didn't know again, we didn't know about the pants uh diagnosis. So much of that stuff is not even looked at from adult, like you said at the beginning of the podcast. So now it's like our eyes are open. So now when I see folks struggling with this, you know, I want to tell I have to be careful not to be like the you know, drinking from a water hose. It's like you don't want to make somebody feel like they're doing that when you just go like crazy trying to tell them all this stuff because you're passionate. But it's like you just want everybody to know and hear about how effective this is. And I I expect nothing. I have two more months uh between now, I'll be finished July 18th, two days before my 58th birthday. I'll be completely finished with the actual dial. So it'll be some other things that you'll probably do to rebuild my body afterwards, some supplementation and so forth. But the actual treatment will be over with then. What a birthday present! And I expect it not to be anything but upheal from here because I'm already seeing such differences in my health in such a positive way. It's beyond it's like I said, I'm beginning to see that my health is actually gonna be far better when it's complete than when I even before I got sick in October 22. So it has to feel really good what you're doing. And um I'm so glad we're not just practitioner patient, but that we're friends and that you're you know my daughter's employer, and you know, you are helping her, and you're helping my other daughter, and it's just it's just such a good situation.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:12

I'm just so glad it is a very bizarre gift that we have all been given through a couple of wild crises.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:20

Yeah, we're gonna have we'll have some we'll have some fun deck nights again soon, and we're gonna um have some relaxation and through all this hard work. And um, yeah, I wish nothing but blessing on you and and thank you for going the long road with me and and uh and you're gonna get to enjoy my healing journey even longer. So it's gonna be great.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:40

Thank you, Leslie.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:42

God bless.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:44

I hope you're leaving encouraged, curious, and hopeful.com. I teach lots on Instagram and answer questions each Monday. My Instagram handle is at Hey Hey Elizabeth May. And my cookbook, Hey Hey Everyday, is available on heyheymey.com and Amazon. Happy healing.