When a Supportive Community No Longer Works for You

Community is very important to our well-being as business owners. I don’t think any human enterprise can be done alone. I depend on my communities, both in-person and virtual for all kinds of reasons: advice, expertise, and just hanging out with people I enjoy and who “get” me.

And yet, there are times when a community which once served us no longer fits. This can feel so painful! It’s why I invited Jennifer Corbeau to share her wisdom on how she moved on from a community when she realized it was holding her back. And she left with grace and a sense of completion.

Jennifer Corbeau is a guide, teacher, and catalyst who leads women on transformative travel retreats. Learn more about Jennifer’s work on her website. SpiralPathJourneys

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My mission is to change the way small business owners market themselves and it’s very important to me that I reach as many people as possible.

Transcript

04.02.26 [MRW Podcast] Jennifer Corbeau - Edited 
 

Judy Murdoch: Hi and welcome to the Marketing Rootwork podcast. 

I'm your host. Judy Murdoch. And today I am talking with Jennifer Corbet. Jennifer, please introduce yourself and speak a little bit to the type of business you have.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Sure. Well, thank you. And I just wanna say, first of all, that I'm honored that you asked me to, to have this conversation with you, um, because it's it's gonna be a good one and I love what you do and, and all of your ideas and how you do your work. 

And so I'm just, uh, love being here. So thank you. It really makes me feel good. But yeah, I'm Jennifer Corbo and I am from New Mexico, and I, uh, I'm single right now. I have two grown kids and so I'm kind of in that place of life where I just doing my own thing. And so, um, I love to travel and I found that travel turned, um, into not just kind of going someplace to Sightsee, but I really got in touch with. 

More deeply with who I am when I've gone to the and, and traveled around. And, uh, I had a very, I've, I've done traveling really for a good amount of my life. I mean, I remember being very young and having my parents stick me on a plane to go by myself to see my, my family, my grandparents in Texas. And so I have always liked that and I've always liked kind of getting away and, and doing my own thing. 

And, um, and then when I was, uh, in a kind of a hard marriage and having, yeah, just having a lot of, um, a lot of just hard stuff within myself. And I've used, started to use travel as a bit of an escape. Like I just have to get somewhere to get away from. What is going on, uh, you know, in my home situation. 

And so I started using travel in that way of just, just getting some quiet, getting away. Uh, I had probably the, one of the biggest catalysts for my life, it was in, it really was a life changing moment, was I went to England for the first time in 2010 and it was a sacred site tour led by a woman who was a mentor and then she became a friend. 

And I went with her, uh, with a couple friends of mine with my then husband at the time. Um, I had no idea how. Absolutely life changing. This trip would be, and it, it was the normal kind of trip. You know, we went, we saw a show in London. We went to different sacred sites, but it was different because I went with people who, who traveled with intention. 

We went, we meditated in different places. We really, you know, soaked up the energy of the land. And so that part of it, I thought, this is the way I'm gonna travel from now on. I already kind of traveled that way just with being there to feel what it was like to be there. But now I thought, oh, I can be much more intentional to make it a such a, a special. 

Experience, but what it was about England was just something in my heart and soul resonated on such a deep level to that land. 

Judy Murdoch: That's really cool. Do you have, do you have ancestors from, from like the Isles. Okay. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Okay, then that makes sense. 

Jennifer Corbeau: It was just the energy of it, but it was, it was beautiful and I loved being there, but it was also how I felt there. 

I had never felt so alive and so beautiful and just so open. Um, which was a huge change from what was happening at home. It was, that was kind of the end of my marriage. I mean, we were still together for a couple more years, but, um, that was. It was a feeling that I had not felt in a long time or ever when I was there. 

Mm-hmm. And I think a lot of us have these connections to places where, yeah, we get there and we don't know why or how, but it's yes. Like something in us just opens. And that was England for me, and I thought, wow, I need to get back there as often as I can. Mm. So I created a business around that and, uh,  

Judy Murdoch: that's cool. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. And so I, I started leading my own retreats in the same kind of way mm-hmm. As that, that retreat that I went on. Mm-hmm. Uh. Started doing that in the British Isles in England, in the Ireland and mm-hmm. Um, that was, that's part of leads into my business of spiral path journeys is retreats. Mm-hmm. Uh, since at the end of my marriage. 

And then since then, and that's been, gosh, 14 years now, I've done a lot of solo travel. I've done very extensive solo travel from just a couple, maybe a night or two away to a whole year of travel away. And, uh, that has been, um, that has brought me home to myself in a way that I never thought that I could. 

Judy Murdoch: That is so cool.  

Jennifer Corbeau: So that's another aspect of my business is solo travel coaching, uh, because I just want women to solo travel. I just so know from very direct experience what it can do. It's not always easy. It's not always, you know, fun or relaxing, but it is always so incredibly powerful.  

Judy Murdoch: Hmm. I love that. 

Jennifer Corbeau: And so yeah, it's all, I have kind of these three branches of my, of my business, spiral Path journeys. And the third one just came around a couple years ago, I thought, for years. I just kind of thought, well, I do, I lead these retreats and they just kind of, I don't know how they just kind of lead, you know, they lead themselves. 

I don't know how it happens. Hmm. And then I just realized, oh, hold on. I gotta take a little credit. For that. Yeah. I do all of the organizing, the marketing, the, you know, all the bookkeeping of it. Um, and then I org, you know, organize what we're gonna do on the retreat as far as what the theme is gonna be, what kind of space I'm gonna hold. 

Then I hold that space and then I, you know, work on the integration part of it. And, um, I realized I should, uh, I really can, I have a lot to offer and so I teach women how to, uh, from the whole arc of retreats, from kind of the little spark of the idea through, through the whole thing.  

Judy Murdoch: Right. Yeah. That's how you and I met, because Yes. 

I signed up for your class.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yes. Right.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. Right. Yeah. So one of the things I just want to reflect something that really like, um, impacted me when you were speaking, which was, um, like travel, travel as transformation. You know, that's what comes up for me. And I hadn't really, I, I mean, I've, I am certainly familiar with the idea. 

I mean, you know, people travel, I think because, um, at least to some de degree, like they, they kind of hope that, like, by being in these different places that, you know, they'll, I don't know, like somehow be a slightly different person after their experience.  

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. Right.  

Judy Murdoch: Um, but the idea for me was travel in itself, it's like, a very popular human activity, you know? Yeah. Um, I mean, there are industries around travel. Mm-hmm. And I'm thinking about it more from the perspective of kind of like beginning to move more into retirement age, although it could be like any, you know, sort of, I guess transitional space. Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Like you were also talking about the end of a marriage, for example. Mm-hmm. And, um, yeah, like using, using like a, a travel experience as a way to, you know, to be more like, for it to be, you know, genuinely transformative for you. And for some reason I hadn't quite put that together with what you do, but like, as you were speaking, I thought to myself that's really like, it, it's a really nice niche. 

It's a very cool niche that you have.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. I mean, and, and again, it's all formed itself from very direct experience. 

Judy Murdoch: It was very organic for 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And people do travel for all kinds of reasons. They just might be just sick and tired of life and it's like, I gotta get away. 

Or it could be some, some kind of transition period. It could be a big birthday. Um, but it, it is, you're so right. It is often, especially those who are going with a bit of, I want to. Figure out something while I'm there. Mm-hmm. And that, yeah, we have a lot of questions. We don't know what we're gonna do next. 

We don't know what to do about some situations in our lives. And so it's very natural to say, okay, well if I just go, I just, and go away for a while. Yeah. Um, so it's very, it's very natural. So it's, it's not like I, I have something that's totally new to teach someone. I'm just gonna bring it into their awareness that this is what can happen. 

Judy Murdoch: Mm-hmm. 
 

Jennifer Corbeau: And here's ways that you can be ready for it and here's some things to kind of expect to even open up more. And what I want to express is that it's, you know, it's not that england for me, for instance, has something there that I can only get in England. 

Judy Murdoch: Mm-hmm. 
 

Jennifer Corbeau: It's just that England is like an amplifier. England is my personal kinda energy divine connection amplifier. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. I get it. 

Jennifer Corbeau: But that's, so that's nice. And when you know that, then it's much easier to bring back home what has happened on this adventure. And it also makes it so many times, especially people who go on retreats and such and they do this meaningful travel, the question I hear every retreat is, how do I bring this home with me? 

Judy Murdoch: Oh, interesting.  

Jennifer Corbeau: And, and that's, that's a big part of,  

Judy Murdoch: it's a big question.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, it is. And that's a, it's a big responsibility for the retreat leader to say, or for me to say to myself when I travel alone is this is just opening even more what's already there.  

Judy Murdoch: Right.  
 

Jennifer Corbeau: And so once you kind of tune into a more expansive place, you don't lose that. It might not be in the forefront all the time, but you will always bring back what you expanded into.  

Judy Murdoch: Right. Like what you're, what I'm hearing you say is that the energy of the place cannot help but affect us.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Right.  
 

Judy Murdoch: And cannot help but do something like change us in some way. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yes. 
 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. I like that. I like that a lot. Um, I like the idea of basically putting people in environments that kind of like work on them.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, yeah, exactly. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. I like that idea a lot. And the other thing I was thinking about was how, um, you know, travel is disruptive. But in a good way because we're taking ourselves out of our usual environment. 

We're taking ourselves out of our routines and habits and things like that. And it's really good. Like I am a visual artist and writer and traveling is like such a great way to kind of like kick me into a more creative space.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Right.  
 

Judy Murdoch: More creative, more inspired, um, I always end up writing or, or painting or doing things when I'm traveling. So I always bring my art supplies with me.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. I love that. I love how you say, um, travel is an interrupter. I think that's so perfectly said. And I think it's good to know that ahead of time because whenever we are interrupted, it sometimes doesn't feel good. It can be really, really uncomfortable. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah, for sure. 

Jennifer Corbeau: And so even me when I've traveled so much, I still have that little bit of hold on. I feel kind of unsettled. And so that's kind of part of the work that I do as well is prepare people. You're gonna have a little bit of time, most likely at the beginning, but maybe, you know, throughout your time where it's gonna feel a little bit unsettled. 

And if you're not expecting it, it can feel like, oh my gosh, I made a big mistake. I should not have done this. This was wrong. But if you know that's gonna happen, you work through it, you go through it, you can't avoid it. And then, oh my gosh, the magic on the other side, the creativity that comes out. 

Judy Murdoch: I know, like when I was in England, um, my husband has some family that's British and, uh, I just really like, just kind of soaking up the vibe there. It is similar to the US in some ways, but it's also very different. And I just kind of enjoyed that, just kind of taking in the vibe of what it's, what it was like to be in London or what it was like to be in the countryside. 

And I personally have a real appreciation for how people live and you know, the energy of the place and such. And I enjoyed my time in England very much when I was there. I'd love to go back.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Lovely. Yes, yes.  

Judy Murdoch: Yeah,  
 

Jennifer Corbeau: I encourage it. Anyone who says I want to go to England, yes, go. 

Judy Murdoch: Cool. Okay. So one of the things that inspired me to invite you to be a guest today was that you and I were talking and we're both business people. We both have our own businesses. And one of the things that you spoke to was that we were talking about, you know, like groups that were in things like that. And you shared with me that you had been a very active member of, was it like a business support group or kind of that kind of idea?  

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm. 
 

Judy Murdoch: And what I thought was really interesting was your comment that. You know, you suddenly realized that you were no longer, and, and you can probably say this better than I did, but like you were no longer, I think, like, like completely in, in connection with what was important to you.  

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.  

Judy Murdoch: And you made this decision to, I don't know if you love the group or you just, you know, like greatly, greatly reduced your participation. 

But yeah. Can you speak a little bit about that idea? Because 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. 
 

Judy Murdoch: You know, as business owners and solo printers, one of the, the tensions I think we always have to navigate is, on the one hand, you know, like we're doing it all ourselves. And on the other hand, I know for myself, like I am always desiring to have like supportive communities and people I can connect with because like, one thing I do know is that. 

Like, I have a lot of ideas, you know, and this type of thing. And then on the other hand, I'm really cautious about, but that's just me, right? It's just my ideas. And I always feel like it's important to invite other people in, right? So I'm not like off and running on like my own little set of, um, you know, like whatever my bias is, if you will. 

Like, I just think like, oh, it's such a great idea. Why wouldn't anybody else think it's a great idea? Um, and it's, it's, I I see it as kind of like an opportunity to kind of like, talk to other human beings. Let them in, you know, kind of like really hear, well, what do they care about? How do they see this? 

But I want to hear your experience. I just wanted to share that I think as business owners, we all have this experience of that tension between greatly desiring community, but then also like, how do we stay true to ourselves?  

Jennifer Corbeau: Right. Exactly. Yeah. Thank you. I kind of consider it as seasons. So I think that business community groups and coaching groups and mentors and programs for business owners are amazing. Um, and needed. I mean, I'm a coach and so yeah, of course I want to find the people who are ready to come with me. But what I noticed was that a few years ago, I'd started this business and I wanted to continue to grow, but I didn't know really how to build a very strong foundation of business. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. That's really common. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, exactly. So I joined some groups. I hired a business coach and this is over a couple years. I was in a lot of groups. I have spent a crap ton of money on programs. 

Judy Murdoch: Oh right. 
 

Jennifer Corbeau: And coaches and 

Judy Murdoch: Yes, yes. You're not the only one. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Everything. Which is totally common. Um, and what I realized was that I was coming into all of these with a pattern that I've had my whole life of, you must be right. I must be wrong. Tell me what to do. Or, um, if your way is a little bit different than my way, I must just be totally wrong. 

So yeah, I'm gonna jump in and I'm gonna try your way. And so just realizing that I was also putting on this face of I also wanna be a good student. I want my coach or my mentor to be proud of me. I'm gonna do it your way and I'm gonna do it. And, and I wasn't. So I was coming in and I was coming into some high ticket programs. 

In that place of, there must be just that one thing I'm doing wrong or that one system or that one thing that's gonna, that I'm gonna learn that it just, I must be not know anything. It's gonna be there. I'm going to get it, I'm gonna do it their way. And then ha, it's, you know, right. Yeah. And yeah,  

Judy Murdoch: I get that. 

Jennifer Corbeau: And yeah. And again, very common and over the years. Mm-hmm. Um, and this really just, this really kind of hit, um, uh, hit sort of the awareness aha moment back in, um, late last year of, oh my gosh, I have been totally disregarding my own knowing. And that my own wisdom and, um, that was trying to say, okay, it doesn't have to look like these people. 

It doesn't have to look like this program. It doesn't have to look like in these groups. It doesn't have to look like what everyone else is doing. And what I was doing was putting on this space of, okay, I get it. I'm with you. Your way is clearly the right way. Which a lot of it was great information. 

And don't get me wrong, I was in with a lot of great people. 

Judy Murdoch: I get that.  

Jennifer Corbeau: It was at the kind of betrayal of my own knowing of how to do things. And so I put some of my own ideas and things I thought were really special aside because somebody else said, well, it's not working clearly, so don't do it anymore. 

Judy Murdoch: Yes, yes.  

Jennifer Corbeau: And, and I grieved it because I thought that's something that I offer that's really special. And maybe, so I tried to conform into somebody else's way of doing things, and I totally lost connection to what I was doing. It didn't feel right and things weren't working. 

And I was also, you know, come, like you were asking, coming to these groups that started to feel very, um. I was frustrated, I was irritable coming to some of these big groups because it just felt kind of fake. And that was me telling me maybe this isn't. 

How you should be spending your time right now. 

Judy Murdoch: Right, right.  

Jennifer Corbeau: And because there were times, oh my gosh, Judy, where I found myself just smiling, just putting on this face of listening to everyone, but not listening and, um, feeling my own, kind of trying to perform something that didn't quite feel right. And so it was this message coming louder and louder of, you have to shut this out for a little while. And so at the end of last year, I thought, I'm gonna come into this. So I didn't, I don't have a business coach anymore. I stopped that program. And that was hard. That was hard for me to say, 

Judy Murdoch: oh, be, it was,  

Jennifer Corbeau: I'm not going to, I'm not gonna continue with this, this program. And I'm not going to renew this membership and I'm not gonna buy any more programs. I'm not gonna look for that magic switch. So coming into 2026, I stopped everything. 

Judy Murdoch: Wow. 
 

Jennifer Corbeau: I do some networking groups that are like the speed networking thing. 

Judy Murdoch: That's how I think you and I met actually. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, exactly. 'Cause those are cool. I like having that, getting that kind of one-on-one time. But I stopped any kind of mentorship, any kind of coaching for now, so that I could really rebuild that trust in my own knowing.  

Judy Murdoch: Can I make a couple comments here? 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. 
 

Judy Murdoch: Because you really sparked some thoughts for me. 

Okay. So I want to say that just like you, Jennifer, I too have been in mentorship, support type groups with other women. And I too have had those experiences where I find myself feeling bored or I feel impatient.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Um, and I feel that I need to be polite and quiet because that's what everybody else was doing. 

I actually got kicked out of a group. Because I kept talking. I did. I got kicked out of a group. And at the time, I felt really, really sad and hurt that, you know, I had been kicked out. But in retrospect, I mean, the group just wasn't a good fit.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: I mean, and there was, and there's like nothing wrong with the group, nothing wrong with me. It was just like a really bad fit. But I was trying to make myself fit the group. So I want to say that, I think one of the more interesting things is you and I are very similar in that I think both of us, you know, and I don't like the term people pleaser. I just think some of us just like to get along with people. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Right? Right. 
 

Judy Murdoch: It's just in our nature. Yes. I am not by nature somebody who enjoys intentionally antagonizing people or getting into conflict with people. I feel sort of like, unless conflict is necessary, it serves a purpose, I don't seek it out. And then at the same time, I'm very independent minded. Um, I, and I'm very like in tune with like that, that tension I begin to feel when I'm aware that, you know, like, yes, this is, this is just not feeling like a good fit for me at the moment. And, and it's, it's different from, you know, like I, I'm not talking about hearing ideas that I don't necessarily agree with. 

You know, I'm like pretty cool with that. It's more of just kind of feeling, like you said, there's something fakey in there and I know for whatever reason, this is not like resonating for me, but I'm here. And, um, I know one per, one of the best things someone ever told me about my tendency to be disruptive is they said, you know, you're probably speaking for at least three or four other people who are sitting there, but you know, who for whatever reason do not feel that they can speak up. 

I'm a person who, I really try to be polite, but like sometimes I just can't. And I blurt stuff out. And I have always felt that that was like a terrible, terrible personality trait. But you know, like I just feel, well that's just, I blurt stuff out. Um, you know, and, and I try to, I, I really try hard not to make it about, like, to make anyone wrong, it's just that, you know, like something comes up for me and I'm just kind of, I can't, something came up recently and it was something about like social media and everybody in the group was like talking about social media and how great it was or something like that. 

And I, I finally just said, because my area is marketing, I said, you know, you guys like, not to say social media is wrong. It's not, it has a place, but like, it's, you know, like if you are not developing trust-based relationships, just hanging out on social media, it's probably not gonna get you the types of relationships you want for your business. Because nobody is going to get to the point where they trust you enough to like, to pay your high prices, you know, or whatever that happens to be. I just couldn't help myself. And I tried very hard to be like, you know, like positive and, but I just, uh, I just couldn't sit and listen without interjecting. 'cause I just felt like there's a truth here. I'm feeling that needs to be expressed.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: And no one's expressing it, and I just have to say something.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. Yeah. And I think it's important to know it's okay if a group doesn't resonate with you or if a coach doesn't resonate with you. 

And you don't have to stay in something because, you know, maybe it's your friend or someone you know, or you wanna support someone. But I think we all, I mean, it just feels like it's the time for us all to really get honest with ourselves and to trust ourselves. Because one, another thing I realized with me with different groups is, um, I mean, I already kind of said it, but just this continuous pattern of thinking I was wrong. Because somebody said something that was different with how I did it. 

Judy Murdoch: Exactly.  
 

Jennifer Corbeau: Um, and that's, that's what we see. I mean, we see so much online and everything of different ways to do things, and it, it keeps us in this. Just this hamster wheel of, oh, that must be the next thing. That must be the next thing. 

Judy Murdoch: Yes. I hear this so much from other business families 

Jennifer Corbeau: and yeah, I'm like, okay, I feel good. This feels good. Thanks are doing well. And then sometimes it's, sometimes I see the same coach who said one thing, you know, a few weeks ago, and I thought, oh, okay, that feels good. I'm doing that. 

Gosh. And then, gosh, it says something kind of different later on.  

Judy Murdoch: I have a question for you here. And I want your input on this. I think that it would be much better in service of groups when we're leaders to create space.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: For conflict and for disagreement. 

Of course it depends on the group, right? But I think in the types of groups you and I are talking about, oh, can I ask you one more question before I go on? 

Jennifer Corbeau: Sure. Yeah. Yes. 

Judy Murdoch: Was, was the group leader cool about you, like moving on?  

Jennifer Corbeau: No. 
 

Judy Murdoch: Oh my gosh. Okay. Okay.  

Jennifer Corbeau: I mean, well, so I've moved on from several things and i've had some weird...  

Judy Murdoch: that's so unfortunate though, right?  

Jennifer Corbeau: I'm also a very empathic person, so as much as there was a Okay great kind of thing, it's like I can feel what's under that. So I shouldn't say every time, but yeah, I can tell there's a little bit of bad feelings about some, some. No, not at all. Some have been really wonderful. 

Judy Murdoch: So like what comes up for me at the moment is thinking about what you're sharing is probably true for a lot of people listening.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. And the other thing that comes up for me, and this is more direct for you because you do do groups now, but you know, really thinking about like if you like wanna have a group that is truly in service and transformative, if that's what, that's what you're hoping, um, to really be thinking about, like. 

What kind of leader am I being? Right. And there's, there was something I read, um, I'm trying to think if it was like the path, it, it, it was a book by Scott P but the idea was that a lot of groups are what you might call, like suitable belonging groups where people are there, they get along for the most part. 

You know, they share certain outcomes, but they're not truly groups we belong to.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Right. Once you're gone, you're gone.  

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. Kind of like, as long as you behave.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Right. As long as you're good. As long as you're good. Yeah. You can be a group member. So that's very interesting. 

Thank you. Thank you for, for bringing all of this up.  

Jennifer Corbeau: I mean, and it is interesting to be on both sides, to be in groups where I didn't resonate and also to lead groups. It is really hard, at least at the beginning when someone does say something that's disruptive or, you know, has a lot of feedback that I didn't maybe really wanna hear at the end or whatever. But what I realized with those moments is, um, those have made me a better leader. I didn't like it at the time.  

Judy Murdoch: Yes.  
 

Jennifer Corbeau: But it has made me a better leader. And having kind of the praise of, you know, you're so great. Uh, this was great. Yeah. You did a good job. That feels good. 

That's really nice. And I, you know, I can tell when it's genuine and that really, that's like the validation of, okay, keep going. You've got this, you're good. The comments that are a little bit more, ah, you could have done this better, don't feel good. But those, those are what have taught me. And the ideal is the people who talk about how they have transformed themselves because of the container. I've been in groups where it's a lot of it is just, um, just saying good things about the leader. 

Judy Murdoch: Mm-hmm. 
 

Jennifer Corbeau: Um. Which again, that's nice, but I don't even really know where I'm going with that, but it's, also, uh, a group that started to not resonate with me. Right. It's like, I wanna hear people's experiences with, okay, how did this affect them and how did they maybe shift or expand or do things differently because of this, this container and it's Right, right. 

So I want to hold the container that allows people to find themselves. And so I do less teaching and more holding of space because I think how we are right now of wanting to really focus on our own inner wisdom, our own inner authority, that's a lot harder when people are telling you what to do. 

It's a lot easier when people are holding a space for you to do it if you choose to.  

Judy Murdoch: That's a much more, in my opinion, like mature wise way to lead.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Um, which I really, really appreciate that, you know, you're doing. Another thing that came up for me as you were speaking was when you do receive feedback, even if it feels like they're not happy and it's about you, um, I think usually it's not really about you, it's always about the other person and just what's going on with them. It and, and yeah, and I'm not trying to like, and I'm, I'm not saying this, like, I don't feel like anybody's like wrong. It's just a human dynamic that is happening. And as you said, ideally those friction points are good learning places. If you're a leader and you can hand, like, take it as being what am I learning about myself and how can I do this differently?  

Jennifer Corbeau: And I had to honor that, that made me feel like crap. That yeah, some, so I had to really honor that. And that, that, oh my gosh, this, this threw me off my center and it made me question my whole being. 

It made me question my purpose. So it was, it was multifaceted in how it, it ultimately helped me. So for me it's been a process and it's getting easier because I'm now learning that Yeah, it's totally about them. 

And it also hurts. So it's like okay's a point of hurt. There's a point of, okay, I'm just gonna maybe vent about it a little bit or be mad. Yeah. Then I'm gonna bring some understanding, then I'm going to, um, let them know. So all, you know, all kinds of feedback I get, I will always respond if, if I know who you know, who sent it, um, just, you know, I heard you and thank you for what you said. 

And, and then it goes into, oh, okay, that was about them. How can that make me a better leader? So, you know, it's the whole thing. And I've had some dark moments because I did take it so personally, but that has, ultimately, that's making me, you know, even stronger because I've had some hard experiences. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah, no, it does make you a better leader. And, and of course you're gonna feel hurt because you're human and you have emotions and, you know, we care. Like, if you didn't care, that would be a bad sign, right? 

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. I get that. I really, really get that. That's really, this is really good stuff. 

Um, so one of the other things I just wanted to ask you about is, like, based on your experience, um, and mostly coming from the place of being a participant, for somebody who might be listening now and, and some of this is really resonating for them, and they're thinking like, oh, wow. Like, I really feel that way in this like, local leads group that I, I I do on a weekly basis. 

How do you, like, what are some suggestions you have for folks in terms of like, you know, like processing it in a, um, I don't know if I wanna say necessarily responsible way, but like more in a, you know, kind of an ownership, um, an ownership, like you're taking ownership of it and being responsible to yourself and to the needs of your business. 

Like what are some like productive, constructive ways to move with this?  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, I think it's a, I mean, I think that awareness of how you are showing up in these different groups is really a really important start. Are you feeling, um. Well, first of all, are you feeling before maybe the group even starts? Are you kind of like, ugh, you know, dreading a little? 

That's a huge sign. And to also separate that feeling doesn't mean the group is bad. All these kind of things. I wanna say, I will probably come back into a season when I am strong, when I have really, yeah. Built a, a strong foundation in my inner knowing and come back to some, some mentors and groups and, and it will be a whole different experience. 

It will enhance rather than kind of 

Judy Murdoch: makes perfect sense. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Make me feel small. So I think it's to honor the feeling of frustration, to honor the feeling. If you're there and you feel like you're not listening, or if you feel like you're kind of. Putting on some sort of show if you...  

Judy Murdoch: you're being performative. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. If you, if it's feeling like that, that's telling you that something is off and mm-hmm. Um, it's telling, I mean, it's telling you that's your inner voice going. There's something that needs to be heard here. It's not about the group.  

Judy Murdoch: Exactly.  
 

Jennifer Corbeau: Right. But it's about something, a message coming in and, um,  

Judy Murdoch: it's what you need. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. And it's also, it sure is character building to leave a group. I mean, it really is because we want to, we don't wanna make anyone feel bad. We don't want to lose connections. I mean, there's all kinds of feelings of, well, what if I leave this group and now they're gonna talk about me and nobody, I'm never gonna get clients or, you know, whatever as a human. 

It's 'cause our business is ourself, right? Everything is connected. So it is hard. But to, yeah. I love that. That's really good. You realize that, and then to take that step of, okay, I'm gonna leave or I'm gonna take some time off, or, oh my gosh. One of the hardest things is, um, I paid for a whole thing.  

Judy Murdoch: Right. 
 

Jennifer Corbeau: So I have to, because I've paid for this. Oh, yeah. Or the idea of contacting that leader or that coach and saying, I'm this isn't working for me. What can we do? Can I get a refund? What can we do? Or maybe stepping away and you've just lost that money. So, I mean, there's so many different levels to it. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah.  
 

Jennifer Corbeau: And  
 

Judy Murdoch: it's so human, Jennifer, that's 

Jennifer Corbeau: Oh, it so is.  

Judy Murdoch: It just flicks, right? 

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. 
 

Judy Murdoch: So many of our, our human desires to belong to not just belong, but to be, um, and admired and respected member of the group. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Of course. Yes. 

Judy Murdoch: It's powerful stuff. 

You know, the money is like the least of it.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. But then you gotta ask yourself, but what is that worth when I'm not listening to myself at all?  

Judy Murdoch: Yes, yes, yes.  

Jennifer Corbeau: And so, um, so maybe you, so maybe that person who's feeling that way says, okay, well maybe I'm gonna take off a couple months and I'm just gonna listen to what I think. And that doesn't mean you're going to try things and everything's gonna be successful right away, but you are sure gonna feel better with the direction you're in when it's coming from, oh, okay, this feels right to me. There's more purpose to that.  

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. Like your integrity with yourself.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, exactly. 

Judy Murdoch: That's, I mean, really important.  

Jennifer Corbeau: I, um, after, so I'm talking about last year, the two retreats I led in the UK last year were really hard. They were tough. And I had some things that happened that, um, that just threw me off. 

And where I questioned everything I was doing, which has made me a better retreat leader. But it was hard in the moment, and I had a moment of time when I was on travel of just feeling like, I don't know anything. I don't know what to do. And the only voice I heard was, do not abandon yourself. 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah.  
 

Jennifer Corbeau: And that's kind of where it started of, oh, I'm totally abandoning myself when I, when I'm not listening or when I'm thinking I'm wrong or I'm not speaking up about, you know, if I say, well, I kind of wanna do this, and then maybe the mentor or the coach says, oh, I don't think that's a good idea. 

Instead of going to, oh, okay, you're right. But no, this feels really good to me. So it can be just little tiny things that are actually big things of, you know what, I'm not gonna abandon myself anymore. And that's, that's why I've had to shut down these things for now because I thought, oh, I, I have something really amazing within me. 

This voice, we all have this guidance, every single one of us and my guidance is my guidance because it's mine for me. Mm-hmm. And so it's time to, to just really listen to what it is. And I tell you, I have felt since that, since, you know, even just right before the beginning of the year, I have felt more steady in my purpose in my business. I have felt so strong, even though I don't do everything that maybe, you know, someone else might do, but I have never felt this stable in my own business.  

Judy Murdoch: That's really great.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. I love that. And I, I really like that you talk about this idea of seasons. 

I think that's a very, that's a really good metaphor.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah.  
 

Judy Murdoch: Really, really nice metaphor. Thanks, jennifer. Gosh, this is a lot to think about, you know, a lot to ponder. But at the heart of it, like what I liked about the story that you shared was just that I think you speak to an experience that we all have. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: And you're offering what feels to me like a really constructive way forward. And you know, there's like no blame there or anything like that. You're just basically saying like, you know, I'm doing this for myself.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Exactly. 
 

Judy Murdoch: Yeah, and, and the other thing too is I think again, like speaking as a business owner and you're a business owner, and for those people listening who are business owners, um, I think one of the hardest things as a business owner is to really take full ownership. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm.  
 

Judy Murdoch: You know, like you're not playing at it, you know, this ist a hobby. Um, if it is a hobby, that's totally cool, but I think it's important to like acknowledge that it's a hobby, you know? Um, but like when you're a business owner, I really do feel sort of like our businesses to some degree are independent entities. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Mm-hmm. 
 

Judy Murdoch: Not exactly like having a child, but certainly in that area where this is something you created and we have a responsibility to it. And, um, I think that one of the most powerful things we do as business owners is to fully step into that identity of like, I am a business owner. I have a business, I am responsible for its care and growth. 

And therefore I do need to be in integrity with my values. And you know, what is right for me. Because again, you know, it's not just about me. It's that, you know, I have this business. And, and the other thing too is that we're doing this because we feel called to serve.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Right. Yes.  
 

Judy Murdoch: And we have to be, you know, we can only serve as well as, you know, we're taking care of ourselves and we're taking care of our business, so very, very practical, but you know, also just, um, I think incredibly important, um, just from the perspective of like human growth and development.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And we want it to be enjoyable and 

Judy Murdoch: Yes, yes, please. 

Jennifer Corbeau: If that means stepping away from some groups Yeah. Or some different things, then, um, yeah. 

I want it to be, I want to enjoy it. And that that's gonna come from Yeah. Me following what in my heart feels, feels right. And, uh, and yeah, that, that's, you know, being in service and enjoying it myself.  

Judy Murdoch: That's the hero's journey, right?  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. Yep. Exactly. Yes. Yeah.  

Judy Murdoch: So, Jennifer, for people listening who are interested in what it is you do. Would like to learn more about you. How do they find you?  

Jennifer Corbeau: Well, thank you. Yeah, I, my website is, uh, spiral Path journeys.ai. Uh, so that's where all my, just about me, all my programs, all my retreats, everything there. Uh, I am mostly, um, as far as social media, I am mostly on Facebook and then on Instagram and can find me by my name, um, d Jennifer Corbeau, C-O-R-B-E-A-U, on Facebook and Jennifer Corbeau on Instagram. 

And, uh, but yeah, if you just, uh, hop over to Spiral Path journeys.ai that has all the, all my information.  

Judy Murdoch: And you also do, I don't know if it's a, a newsletter or you, you see it as more like the occasional communication from you, but you also do a newsletter and it's very good. I always find it very useful.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Thank you. 
 

Judy Murdoch: You know, if nothing more, it's a nice way for me to kinda keep up with what you are doing and what's going on in your world. And, and I actually very much appreciate when people do that.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. As gosh, as a, as we do now, there's all kinds of places to, uh, get on my newsletter, on my website. 

I have some different free resources, uh, that some of them will ask for your, um, for your email, and that will get you on my list. Um, it's always okay to unsubscribe at any time, but, uh, yeah, I hope to, to add value to people on that newsletter. Um, you do at the same time, you know, as we have to do, I'm promoting of course, my offerings, and, um, I just feel so strongly about, um, what I offer and the spaces that I hold. 

I just, I can see and feel the value of them, and I, I wanna share as much as I can.  

Judy Murdoch: Yeah. That vibe totally comes through, Jennifer.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Thank  
 

Judy Murdoch: you. So, yeah, no, it, it comes through, this is, the way it comes through for me is just, this is something you're really excited about and passionate about, and you wanna share it. 

And if nothing more, I always learn a little something about the trip you're doing or, you know, like, it, it's, it's like a nice little sort of window into your activities and what you're up to.  

Jennifer Corbeau: Yeah. Thank you.  

Judy Murdoch: You are welcome. Thank you so much for being a guest. 

Jennifer Corbeau: Aw, this has been wonderful, Judy. Thank you so much. I've loved chatting with you.  

Judy Murdoch: I know. Thanks. Thanks, Jennifer.