SPEAKER_00 0:00

All right, Katie, thanks for chatting with me today. I'm super excited to hear about your feedback and experience in HBA. Obviously, I know a lot just from our conversations, but I wanted everyone else to hear about it too. Before I get into some of those questions, can you tell me what you do for work? What is your career?

SPEAKER_02 0:23

Yeah, absolutely. I am a licensed clinical social worker. So what that means is I basically do individual mental health therapy with folks. I'm clinically trained in that way. I've been doing that, including my training for nine years in May. So do a lot of evidence based practice. And

SPEAKER_00 0:44

yeah,

SPEAKER_02 0:45

really love it.

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Yeah, that's awesome. I have another client who went through HBA same time as you did. Same exact. Love that. And yeah. So, you know, and feel free to like give your answers to these questions, either from the perspective of therapy or from the perspective of just how it's impacted you personally, like just feel free to, you know, answer in whatever way makes the most sense. But the first question I had was obviously we had worked together one-on-one in the past when the focus for me was solely weight loss, macro workouts. You were one of the OG clients. And we saw, incredible progress there. And then I did on HBA and I was like, Hey, trust me, come do this. This is right up your alley. So, um, what was the thing that actually pushed you to say yes, when we had that conversation to do HBA?

SPEAKER_02 1:37

Yeah, for sure. So I think a lot of it was, I had worked with you previously for, gosh, I think I did a six months of like full like in-app nutrition maybe even a year I think

SPEAKER_00 1:51

it was like a year I

SPEAKER_02 1:52

think it was like a year that I did that and I had seen such good progress and a lot of it was like I know how to work out I just need somebody to tell me what to do but really we had done a lot more of the like emotional work I was going through a lot at that time um had just ended a relationship of almost a decade and it was like how do I like get my footing and so you had helped me so much in navigating that And then when this came along, it was kind of funny when you messaged me and I'd been like one of the lurkers for so long. You had posted about round one. And I was like, I went all the way through to go pay and then I was like, no, you know, it's okay. Like I had some, I've had some big changes at work, but that's exactly the time that you should do HBA, which I know now, but you sent me a message and you're like, girl, just do this. And so I am so glad that I did, but it really was just like thinking about the mental work that you had helped me with in the past. And like the fact that you'd gone and got even more trainings than that was very enticing to me. And I have seen and kept the results that we had from our first like year of individual stuff. So yeah, I mean, I just, it was you really was the main selling

SPEAKER_00 3:09

point. Once you got in the program, you're like, whoa, this is actually legit. How would you say, and you know, again, whether it's in your personal life or professional life or both, like now that you've gone through HBA, what would you say the biggest change is that you've seen based off of the material, the Zaps, the program, whatever?

SPEAKER_02 3:30

Yeah, so I can answer this in two ways. I would say one of the things I think about the most, when I'm working with my own clients is default mode network and task positive network. And so that's like, obviously, for folks who don't know what HBA is, and who should sign up for it. It's just like ways of tapping into the brain when you're in one, like doing certain things or doing other things. And I think about that a lot with clients and like, kind of have even use some of that with them and people have seen results which is super cool and then of course I'm like hey if you really need some help with emotional regulation you should see my friend Kate but for me personally I would see say the thing that I've seen um the most progress in is my own like self narratives um just earlier today so so one of the things I I texted you about during the program was this self narrative of like I'm not a runner and I've been through different phases in my life of what I like to do um I was lifting primarily like four or five days a week for like an hour each time the first like couple of years we worked together um and then I went out on my own and then I'd joined HBA and one of the things you had talked about was like just do what feels good for your body like move your body and so right now I'm really into reading and I wanted to start running and so I was running for like different intervals and one day I was just like you know what I've had this narrative that I'm not a runner and I just want to kind of challenge that and so I had been running you know off and on for 30 minutes at a time but it was never consistent and one day I was just like I'm just going to see if I can get to 20 minutes consistently. And I got to 20 minutes and it was like this moment. Again, you talk about this in HBA where you're like, the moment you want to quit is the moment you push through kind of thing. And I ended up running for like 30 minutes straight. And like, since then, think about this all the time. Like today I hit another milestone of consistently running for three and a half miles, which I, If you had told me six months ago I was doing that, I probably would have laughed at you because I'm like, I hate running. Running is not my thing. And like, which is fine. I mean, it's not for everybody, but for me, it was not that I couldn't physically. It was that I was telling myself I couldn't. And so that was like one physical piece that I've seen with HBA. And also like, yeah, I've just seen a lot around self-narratives in a lot of different areas. So those would be the two- Yeah, that inner dialogue for sure. So I would say those are the two biggest things that like come to mind a lot, nearly daily, honestly. And I use also for myself the piece about like procrastination. It's like I kind of just like, you know what, I'm just going to get up and I'm going to like fold one piece of laundry instead of letting the stuff sit in the dryer for three days, right? So

SPEAKER_00 6:31

anyway. Procrastination pieces, I mean, across the board, that is– Every single person that I work with struggles. I struggle with that still, right? So it's one of those things where I feel like HBA does a really good job of one, helping you understand why it's happening so much, like more than just, oh, well, I'm putting something off. Well, why though? There's a reason. And then giving you like, I always tell people there are more tools and strategies in HBA than you will ever use, but you'll find four to five that really stick out. And then those become, what you do and you, I tell people that you copy and paste into every single thing that you're struggling with. And 99% of the time it moves you forward. Right. So, um, as far as like how the program was delivered. So this is the other piece that I struggle to explain to people adequately because it is different. Um, obviously when you think about the traditional coaching and especially what, what we did before, yeah, it's, It's not that. So as far as the deliverability of the program and really like how you get to experience it, I know there's a lot of people that a lot of lurker, there's a, it, believe it or not, my launch right now, I have more, I'm calling them lurkers, but they know exactly who they are because they've talked about it. And they're like, I need to do it. And then they don't do it. So I've had, I have had so many lurkers in this round and I'm like, what is going, like, why are you holding yourself back? But I try and explain to them, like, HPA is not something that you can technically fail at because it's not like, so how, like in that, in that lens, like how would you explain how the deliverability of the program was, how you were able to actually experience it? Was it, was it helpful? Did it fit in? Cause you're, you're busy. You talked to clients. How did all of that match into your very busy lifestyle? And do you feel like it's something that's very simple to experience and complete?

UNKNOWN 8:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:28

So simple is so simple. So I because I really wasn't sure what it would look like. And from day one, you send directly to the phone, the brains app or like the, you know, little like informational piece lesson, if you will, for the day. And, you know, they're very bite sized. There are levels of depth to like in terms of like what you're covering. But for me, like I would use it every day. every single morning I would like look forward to. And honestly, like it was always sad on Saturday mornings when I was walking my dog because I didn't get one, which is like literally everyone.

SPEAKER_00 9:08

Yes. Everyone is like, when is it going to start? We want the zaps back. And I'm like, I know I miss them too.

SPEAKER_02 9:14

Yes. Yeah. But I think for me, like it was really easy to weave into my day. You're absolutely right. I see like six to seven clients a day, pretty much back to back with like a mid day break, but it was like, Easy to weave in. Sometimes I would like listen to it in the morning while I was walking my dog or getting ready. Then I would also listen to it when I walked the dog at lunch because it was so good. Like there were multiple times or I would like, you know, not be, it'd be a 10 minute one. And so I'd be walking the dog for 20 minutes. I just replay it because it was just so good and so easy to access. And like, I mean, it just really like you just push play. every day. That's literally it.

SPEAKER_00 9:59

There's so many people that have told me like, it's not a matter of how much it costs or that I don't think it's right for me. It's that I'm afraid to fail it. And I'm like, I don't know how it is

SPEAKER_02 10:08

so hard to fail.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

It's like you, you have to just, you'd have to not have your cell phone. That's kind of why you're not going to fail. It's so easy to do. And it's so potent in the right ways. Like, yes. I mean, yeah. So like it's, it's, the way that you explain it is obviously so much better than how I try and explain it. Oh, stop it. Because to me, when people ask her, like, well, what's it about? How do I do it? And I'm going through every single detail. And I'm like, how do I simplify this down in a way that really gets the message across that? Like, I promise you, this is the least overwhelming thing that you will do. Well, probably the most, probably the most impactful, right? Like

SPEAKER_02 10:49

easily, easily, like, the most impactful like I have a trauma training I'm doing right now and I'm like choosing the brain zaps over the trauma training because they're just that good and trauma training heavy yeah exactly but I feel like this this helped me with some of the trauma training right and like working with my own trauma clients it's like I loved having that to look forward to every day so much so that I joined the hive because I was like you you know you say it yourself and it's like if I experienced so much growth in just a month, what will a year of this look like? Right. I did school of sabotage. That was another, I was like, Ooh, yay. I get my brains out.

SPEAKER_00 11:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:31

You

SPEAKER_00 11:31

know, I think there's six more this year. Smaller ones.

SPEAKER_02 11:36

Yeah. But it, it really is just, just push play. Simple as it is. And if you want to take it further, sometimes you give stuff to take it further, further, write this down or think about this thing. And so it's, you know, you can engage as much or as little, but like, it is truly hard to fail.

SPEAKER_00 11:55

You would just have to straight up and not have your phone is like, I could explain it. Like you just, you lost your phone. Someone stole it for weeks. All right. Maybe, maybe, but other than that, like it is really simple. So the other part of the program, that's like a little bit different than pressing play. And this was, I really, it was great to hear a little bit more in depth of your feedback, both personally and professionally. The lifestyle future. Oh yes. Yeah. So like that, I, when I, I stood on this on HBA for a year, basically like every time I was nap trapped in the rocker postpartum with like nothing to do other than that chair for five hours of the baby on me, I sat here and I thought about what would I want to create? I have all this time. I've never had the time to create something. What do I actually want to put out there? And I kept thinking of the show who wants to be a millionaire and how they have that. Yeah. That's what I thought of. I was like, what if we had like, what if it had some type of like asking you shall receive type of option for like those moments where like, I don't really know what to do right now. And I kind of need support. And so that's how the lifeline feature was born. So both personally and professionally, like Your opinion on that, was it helpful? Just anything you can say in our regard.

SPEAKER_02 13:11

yeah so a couple of thoughts one from like a personal standpoint I will never forget like week one um I don't even know what lifeline it was but I like texted and asked like for the lifeline and it was like um you gave me what it was and I did it and I like probably look goofy as hell like walking down the street oh doing this but it was like you know shake your entire body like you know think Taylor Swift shake it off and and honestly like the visceral reaction that I had, like had the instant relief. I was just like blown away. And like, I teach emotional regulation, right. As something that I do as a therapist. And so it was great for me to like gain additional tools, not only for me, but just like having more tools in my toolbox so that if what I teach doesn't work, I've got those, but it helped me very, very much. So also like just personally, I think it was, you know, we get stuck in like, what we do. And so the novelty of it was also really exciting for my brain, I think, of like, oh, you've got more tools. And the ease with which it was like, hey, I need to do this thing, you know, or I'm not feeling great. And two, again, like huge changes at work, trying to navigate it. And it was like super stressful time. Yeah. And so to just have something I could very easily say, hey, I need help in regulating myself and something would come through. I think about that and I think about like listening to specific music a lot. I mean, I think I told you when we talked on Friday, like I kind of use Friday's. afternoons is my admin time and i listen to that music to like wind myself down and i can feel my mood shift i mean it's also friday but um i think in it really the music that's probably doing most of the music the music

SPEAKER_00 15:03

is is good

SPEAKER_02 15:04

chef's kiss i love that so there's that piece but from like a professional standpoint i thought about this um a lot because i I love the lifeline feature from a professional standpoint because basically you're like, hey, you got to start in an awareness land, right? And so knowing that you need help is the first step. Knowing you're dysregulated is the first step. And then offering in the moment, hey, congratulations, you recognized you were dysregulated. Let's reward that with something that's going to make you feel better. And so there was this like really cool positive reinforcement loop of like super proud of you for having awareness of the here's your tool that's going to help you feel better. And if not, guess what? Try another one. Right. Like that was also cool. It's like lifeline two was not great. Like let's go for three. Let's go for four. And like you said, like not everything's going to fit all the time, but it was really like, there was a plethora of tools to use lifelines. Yeah. Yeah. So I loved that.

SPEAKER_00 16:07

Like anyone would ever need.

SPEAKER_02 16:08

Yeah. Oh, for sure. For sure. Yeah. When really like as humans, we only need three or four really good things that help us. And like you provide more than that, way more than that. So you'll find your favorites. Right. So I loved that from a professional standpoint. And, you know, awareness is the key to change. Right. And so you really, I think, built the program in a way to help people recognize when they needed help. And two, with high achievers, we don't like to ask for help. So you're literally like, here's another reward also for asking for help. Yeah. So I mean, it's masterful. Honestly,

SPEAKER_00 16:48

I feel like we would we would totally if we had like all the time in the world, we would start out on why the lifeline feature is as cool as it is. It's more than just like. wow, okay, you get either a neuro, like a brain or a somatic, a body tool that you can do. And it won't fix what you're feeling, but it'll bring it down enough for you to be able to move through it and take the appropriate action. But from a like more nerdy level, like the lifeline feature was the whole reason why I invested in the software that I invested in for the program was I wanted curiosity to be sparked. in that moment of stress. Because I knew that if we could build curiosity and anticipation, it would create, which in a moment that you're having a hard time, it's like just enough to like dump some of the water out and give you a

SPEAKER_01 17:41

little

SPEAKER_00 17:43

space. So it's like the nerding out that I did over the Lifeline feature, that's the part where I'm like, I should just do a whole podcast episode on why the program is worth it for that feature. alone. Literally, literally. When you really stop to think about like the mechanism of the lifeline, it's really, really cool. So I really appreciate hearing the professional perspective of it because I think that's, that's really important for people to understand is like tools on demand. They come like they are, they are set up to be sent Automatically. The minute you text for it, it comes right back to you. And I always tell people that's even if it's Saturday morning at 3 a.m. Yes. So 100

SPEAKER_02 18:25

percent.

SPEAKER_00 18:26

Yeah. So very, very cool. Yeah. That's like one of my favorite, favorite. Yeah. Yeah. So I guess like really the last question I would have is we talked a little bit about the lurkers. You know, let's maybe maybe they don't want to be called lurkers, although. I mean, I was a

SPEAKER_02 18:47

lurker. I'll call myself a lurker.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

Yeah. I think it's more so, you know, if in all seriousness, when I, I, cause like I said, I've had the ones that I've had conversations with, there's probably a lot of people that want to do HBA that have not engaged with me. So I've not been able to identify that they're interested in or interested in it, but, um, you know, I keep track of it and I will be honest. There's there's over like 20 people that have engaged with me on it and have been like, I know I want to do this. And the common thing that I am seeing is fear. It's fear. It's fear to fail. It's fear to be seen, right? It's fear to disrupt the pattern and the lifestyle that they're in because they're the idea of disrupting it feels a little bit scary, scarier than the possibility of what's on the other side of that. So a lot of the ones that I know are on the fence that may listen to this, my understanding is it's fear that's holding them back. So in that regard, um, is there any advice and this can just be personally, it doesn't professionally, any advice or anything that you would want them to hear, um, that might help them like, you know, might help them hop in or hop into the next round after this one.

SPEAKER_02 20:02

100%. So, um, This is going to be a combination of personal and professional. So when I got trained in one of the acceptance and commitment therapy, it really changed a lot of my life. And a lot of it was all about challenging avoidance. And I talk with clients about this all the time. And basically, one of my favorite quotes that I can't remember who says it might just be a proverb of some sort. But it says, if you always do what you've always done you'll always get what you've always got and i think about that all the time and so comfort and avoidance like it's very easy to stay where you're at it's hard to make change it's hard to face yourself it's hard to say oh my gosh i really want to run these 30 minutes and if i had let that take over, then guess what? I would have, I would have self-sabotage and I would not have run the 30 minutes and I would have felt like crap. And, and are we always going to get it right every single time? Absolutely not. Right. You got to give yourself the space to, to fail as well, but like that doesn't have to define you. And if you, if you don't take the leap and you don't make the change, then nothing's going to change for sure. And, and, I personally would rather take the leap and have the possibility of failing, but know that if I succeed, or even if I succeed a minimal amount, you know, how do you even define failing and success? Like, even if you succeed a minimal amount, you're still going to be better than you were if you hadn't done it, you know? And I think about like, ultimately, at the end of the day, like, what kind of a life do I want for myself? Is it one that does self sabotage? Is it one that that tells myself I can't do all of this stuff? And for me, like on the other side of HBA? Absolutely not. That's not the life that I want for myself. And, you know, letting your fear of failure dictate that is it's not going to get you anywhere. And it's, it's easy. It's easy to let that fear run wild. And also like some amount of fear is good, but too much just keeps you stuck. So predictable. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 22:23

Yeah,

SPEAKER_02 22:24

exactly.

SPEAKER_00 22:25

Doing HBA is not some, it's unpredictable. It's like, it's that uncertainty that I think is, naturally scares, scares people away. And then again, it makes sense to me because the state in which the type of people that I want to work with and bring into HBA are people that are experiencing a lot of stress, a lot of overwhelm. So it's, it's almost like the idea that it's pulling them away from anything that keeps them in that normal, comfortable state. I'm used to this, although I don't love it. Bubble is, is the challenge. I appreciate you. I really, really appreciate you. I love this conversation and shamelessly. I'm so excited to down the road collab. I know, I know it's going to be so good. Um, thank you so, so much. Um, giving me this evening. Um, let me hit.