S3 E34 Coq au Vin

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:10

Bonjour, and welcome to Perfectly Seasoned, the podcast about all things culinary. I'm your personal chef, Greg Strom.

SPEAKER_03 0:18

I'm Home Cook Deanne Frederickson.

SPEAKER_02 0:21

Matt Frederickson, guest, and I'm husband, Tim Luke. Guest.

SPEAKER_01 0:26

Guest.

SPEAKER_02 0:26

Oh, and husband. Today we're off to France for a traditional cocoin. Stay tuned. Hello, Deanne, Matt, and Tim. Hi, Craig. Husband. Well, actually, today Sally isn't here because she's going to be tasting how many chilies? 32. 32 chilies at a chili cook-off. And from what Matt said, I understand they're all fireman chili. They are. Not a fan. Five alarm.

SPEAKER_04 1:10

A fireman or fireman chili?

SPEAKER_02 1:13

I guess both. But I'm a fan of fireman channel. I'm a fan of fireman.

SPEAKER_04 1:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:17

Yeah. Well, I've I've never had fireman chili that wasn't five alarm. Well, okay. Anyway.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

And there's only two of them.

SPEAKER_02 1:25

So hopefully our chili today isn't going to be five alarm.

unknown 1:28

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:29

So, not today, excuse me. I take that back. It's not this week. We're doing Coco Van this week. We're in France.

SPEAKER_03 1:34

Which is also not Five Alarm.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

No, no. And our our good friend Kristen from Wheeling is going to be, she's going to be our guest cook again. She wanted to do this recipe very badly. But before we do, it's time for anything on a stick. So today, I have come up with a roquefort fig and pear skewer. So let's all just bite in and try it. Sounds like Napoleon. Nobody's tried these except me, so we'll see what the result is.

SPEAKER_04 2:08

Listeners, the presentation is gorgeous. It's almost artistic.

SPEAKER_02 2:13

Well, you'll be able to see the presentation on the website, on my website, thesilvershef.net. It's very simple to make, actually. It looks really a lot more exotic than it is. It's rolled for cheese rolled around a grape. It can be a red grape or a green grape. And then you just chill them, you roll them in a crushed pistachios, or you can use pecans or walnuts or whatever your favorite nut is. And then you can when you get ready to put it on the skewer, you take a dried fig, cut it in half. That's the first thing that goes on. Then you put on the roquefort ball, which is a has a grape in the center. It's like a little cheese ball. It is. And then you put the piece of pear on the uh on the end and you have it. That's it. I mean, it's how much simple is that?

SPEAKER_03 3:04

So I have to say the roquefort and pear I've always known as good. That's a popular combination for me. But the grape in the middle. It's incredible.

SPEAKER_02 3:12

Well, people like this because they don't if they've never had one, they have no idea there's a grape in his face.

SPEAKER_04 3:18

So and the bulbs.

SPEAKER_02 3:20

Yeah, because everybody thinks, oh my gosh, that's an awful large piece of cheese. Well, it's not. It's just coated the grape on the outside. And here I was getting excited about the piece of cheese. Sorry, Matt. Okay. So let's let's put that one to rest this week because I think it's a keeper.

SPEAKER_03 3:35

It is five stars all the way.

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So I'll I'll have to send this to Sally.

SPEAKER_01 3:40

So we're gonna have to do this for the holidays.

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Yeah, this will cool her down after her 32 fire in chili.

SPEAKER_01 3:47

Right.

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So we have Kristen on the line from Wheeling. Welcome back, Kristen.

SPEAKER_00 3:53

Thanks. Glad to be back. Hi, Kristen.

SPEAKER_02 3:56

Hey. Yeah, we have a How are you?

SPEAKER_00 3:58

Oh, it's Deanne.

SPEAKER_02 3:59

This Deanne, yeah. We have a Oh, Deanne.

SPEAKER_03 4:01

Hey!

SPEAKER_04 4:02

How are you doing?

SPEAKER_02 4:02

And also her husband, Matt, is here, and so is my husband too. Hello, it's the episode of Husbands and Remote Guests. Yes. Yes. So I understand this was the first time you've ever made Coco Van.

SPEAKER_00 4:18

It is, and it will not be the last. Well, it was, I'm telling you, as a home run, if you want to put something on the table that everyone thinks that you slaved over for hours and hours and hours because of the flavor and presentation, this is that dish. Oh, it was, I'm telling you, Rave reviews the board. They said, make this for Thanksgiving.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_00 4:47

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 4:48

Oh, goodness. Well, with the price turkeys this year, it might be a good idea.

SPEAKER_00 4:53

It might be a good alternative.

SPEAKER_02 4:57

So what how how did you find it to prepare? Because it is a little, there is some scheduling to do when you make this dish.

SPEAKER_00 5:06

Well, there is. I mean, so you have the the prep up front, which isn't too bad, but then you you put it in the oven and I just let it go. You know, I eventually put the oven back down to like, you know, 170 just to to keep it warm, but it kept and it didn't get dry or anything, far from it. And when I took it out of the pot and, you know, thickened up the the sauce, it it the meat just fell off the bone. I mean, it was that's my favorite part.

SPEAKER_02 5:36

Is this also the first time you've ever made a bourmannier?

SPEAKER_00 5:40

It is. It is.

SPEAKER_02 5:41

Um well, bourbonnier, if you're not familiar with it, it's basically a thickening agent. It's a French, classic French thickening agent. It's it's equal portions of butter, room temperature butter, and the same amount of flour. And you mash it together and it that becomes your thickening. So it's instead of a roux. Oh, I think we just lost Kristen. Hang on a second. There we go. Instead of a roux, it you use this, and you can use it, you can make a whole stick of it and you can actually keep it in the freezer.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_02 6:16

Yeah, and you can take out and use it whenever you want.

SPEAKER_01 6:19

And that's what thickens the sauce.

SPEAKER_02 6:21

That's what thickens the sauce. Okay, here's Kristen. We draw.

SPEAKER_00 6:24

Don't know what happened. Yeah, drop the call.

SPEAKER_02 6:26

You might want to pay your phone bill. Just saying.

SPEAKER_01 6:30

It's Wheelie. It's West Virginia. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 6:34

So anyway, the Bermannier is is basically a replacement for a roux. Now, do you know anything about where w the history of this dish? How old it is? I'll just tell you it's older, it's much older than you. And that's saying something. And is it older than you?

SPEAKER_00 6:52

That's not that much. Right. Because Grace be allowed.

SPEAKER_02 6:56

Cook of Ven actually dates back to the Gaul period of the Gauls and Julius Caesar. The first time it ever appeared in a cookbook was in in a French cookbook, anyway, was in 1864. And it wasn't until 1961 when our when the patron saint of all culinary all things culinary. All things culinary. When they put together the art of the of French cooking, and Julia kind of made this one of her signature dishes. And that's this is that's basically the recipe that most people think of. And uh if you if you compare these recipe or these two recipes side by side, they're really not that dissimilar. The order of things might be a slightly different, but the general outcome is exactly the same. I've made this dish I don't know how many times. A lot. And because everybody it's kind of become one of my signature dishes because it is so simple to put together.

SPEAKER_01 7:57

But it's also one of those dishes that I've become a fan of chicken thighs because I'm not really a big fan of that, but when you cook it like this, there's some spices. And Kristen, you said this falls off the bone. Just all the meat just falls off the bone. It's so great. And you need the bone because I asked Greg, can you do this with uh with uh boneless chicken thighs? He said, absolutely not. Right. I am unanimous.

SPEAKER_04 8:24

You want that flavor. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 8:26

Well, here's the other thing. Now, I have tried it with you also using the the whole chicken and cut up with the breast. But the breasts, I don't care how long you cook them, they just they dry out. Yep. They dry out. This has to be made with the dark meat, the thigh and the drumstick. I I don't recommend trying the breast, it just dries out.

SPEAKER_01 8:49

Really? Well, we tried it once, and I remember you were not happy because I like the breast meat, but this is one dish that I really like as far as the chicken thighs go.

SPEAKER_04 9:00

Kristen, what did you serve it with?

SPEAKER_00 9:02

Well, Greg's recipe called for garlic mashed potatoes, and I did a time saver, and I just used good old Bob Evans, and no one could tell the difference.

SPEAKER_02 9:12

Oh my god, he's my friend. We yeah, we love Bob Evans. We love Bob Evans potatoes.

SPEAKER_04 9:18

Yeah, no judgment here.

SPEAKER_02 9:20

Oh, no judgment here.

SPEAKER_01 9:22

His sweet potatoes are really good thing. Yeah, but yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:28

Well, was there anything in there that you would change?

SPEAKER_00 9:32

Well, I did make two adjustments, one very minor. When I went shopping for a burgundy, our local wine purveyor would not allow me to buy. He said, French burgundies have gone through the roof. And he he said, just use a good French Pinot Noir. The only difference is the terroir. And it worked, and it was lovely to finish off the bottle as the chicken was finishing off. So that worked out very nicely. And the other thing I did was I substituted the tomato paste for tomato pasata because we need a little more sauciness. We need, you know, to help things go down a little easier. And I know a lot of people do. They need sauces and gravies. And so I used the tomato posada, and I was told that to multiply the quantity of the tomato paste by 10. So I essentially used the entire jar of the tomato posada, and it it was great. It didn't overwhelm it, but it did make, you know, more than adequate sauce. Yeah, it was it was great. And it didn't take that much more to thicken it either, which I was kind of surprised about. I thought I would have to, you know, add more to to thicken it, and I didn't.

SPEAKER_02 10:56

Oh, you are you talking about what the Bermannier?

SPEAKER_00 10:59

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 11:00

Because yeah, the the one thing, yeah, I'm glad you mentioned that because the one thing you have to remember when you're using the the Bermannier is don't put it all in at once. The recipe, it's a quantity that you can go up to that amount if it's necessary, but depending on how liquid your sauce is, it will depend on how much of that recipe of the Bermannier you actually end up using. Because you don't want to be able to slice the gravy. You want to be, you know, it just needs to be nice and glisteny and a little thick. So, and if you're not from if people aren't familiar with Posada, it's just basically Italian tomato sauce is all it is.

SPEAKER_00 11:39

Uh but it's still it's just not nearly as concentrated. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:42

Yeah. So Greg saw the blank looks the most reference.

SPEAKER_04 11:46

Yeah, but is that a new is that a new Toyota model? Toyota Posada? I don't know what we're doing.

SPEAKER_01 11:51

No, that's a bowl.

SPEAKER_02 11:54

Made in Italy. So yeah, but now uh the Posada, you can find it most anywhere now. It's basically unflavored tomato sauce, basically. I mean, it's pretty much like a canvas.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

Well, that's for all of us.

SPEAKER_02 12:11

And you can you can make it whatever you you can spice it however you want.

SPEAKER_04 12:14

Okay, that's interesting.

SPEAKER_02 12:16

So without the added basil and other tongue. Right, right, right. So so when are you going to make it again?

SPEAKER_00 12:22

Pretty soon, based on all the requests. And I will tell you that it I will tell you that it it also made a great quantity. It says it served six, and it went, let's see, I had four for dinner, and then we ate it the next night, the two of us, and I still had enough left to pack up for some friends the next night. So it it goes a long way.

SPEAKER_02 12:48

It does go quite a long way, and I think that's one of the other reasons that this is such a popular dish is because it's actually extremely cost effective. That being said, we're gonna see what Cynthia has to say on wine o'clock. Once again, Kristen, thanks and say hello to everybody in Wheeling Forest.

SPEAKER_00 13:08

I sure will. Thanks, everyone. Bye, Kristen. Bye, Kristen. Happy Thanksgiving.

SPEAKER_04 13:12

Bye.

SPEAKER_00 13:14

Same to you.

SPEAKER_02 13:16

Okay, so let's head right over to Cynthia for wine o'clock and see what she recommends with this humble dish. Hey there, Cynthia.

SPEAKER_05 13:28

Hello, or bonjour.

SPEAKER_02 13:30

Bonjour. So, what you got for us to serve with this classic French peasant dish?

SPEAKER_05 13:36

Well, the best red wine for Coca-Von would be what it's classically made with is a Pinot Noir from Burgundy. So this is a classic choice. I feel Julia Child approved, that complements the dish's earthy, savory flavors. So it's just perfect. Pinot Noir with this, you know. I I want to the flavors in this dish really come from the wine. So you want to use a good quality wine. When you're making this dish and you just want something affordable, economical, approachable, and drinkable. Yes, look for a regional wine because that's where most of the wine from Burgundy is coming from. It'll say Cremant, Zebergogna, a Bourgogne Rouge, you know, anything from those Burgundy appellations. Then you're gonna go to village wines. That's from a village or a commune in Burgundy. And there are, I think, around 40-ish, 44 villages. So that will be Chablis, that'll be Neu-Saint-Georges, that'll be Macam Village. Okay. Then only a smaller percentage are Premier Crew. Those are from exceptional vineyards in Burgundy. And there are many Premier Crew plots, like over 600 in Burgundy. So that's Vault Romanet Premier Crew. And then one percent, very small percentage, are Grand Crew. So those are from the top plots called Climates in Burgundy. And there are 33 grand crews in the Cote d'Or alone, and most of that production is going to be red. It's going to be Pinot Noir.

SPEAKER_02 15:18

So, what is higher in grading, I guess, is the premiere or the grand?

SPEAKER_05 15:27

Then premiere, then the village, then the regional.

SPEAKER_02 15:31

Ah, okay. And that I'm assuming then the price point follows that.

SPEAKER_05 15:37

You would assume correctly. But you know, I always say any wine from Burgundy is going to be good. When people say, Oh, I'm just getting into wine. What do I do? Go to Burgundy, start with a regional wine. So grapes grown from anywhere in Burgundy. You'll see Burgund Rouge, Bourgon Blanc, White, you know, and there could be, you could get a blend that you can put some aligote in there or some other grapes, but usually it's going to be Chardonnay. And you're never going to go wrong with burgundy. Right. You know, I've never ever had a bath for burgundy in my life.

SPEAKER_02 16:13

And so thank you so much, Cynthia. And we'll talk to you again.

SPEAKER_05 16:16

Missy.

SPEAKER_02 16:18

Missy Au revoir. If you have any questions about today's recipe, you can email me at infotesilvershef.net. And I'd like to thank my co-host, Deanne Frederickson. Matt Frederickson? Husband. Tabler. Husband. He keeps saying that.

SPEAKER_01 16:39

Oh, I just like that. I know.

SPEAKER_02 16:41

I'd like to thank you all for being a part of this. It's always fun when we have a peanut gallery in the studio. I think I'm going to need a bigger studio, though.

SPEAKER_03 16:52

I think you might. Right.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

You can listen to Perfectly Season on my website, thesilverchef.net, on my Facebook page, Apple Podcasts, iHeartRadio, Pandora, Spotify, Amazon, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Greg Strom. Thanks for joining us today. And remember, eat fresh, may the fork be with you, and may all your days be perfectly seasoned.