How to Navigate Career Changes, Motherhood & Self-Discovery with Caitlan Siegenthaler

I’m joined by Caitlan Siegenthaler, an IFS therapist and former marketing pro who traded pitch decks for purpose and found a new path to alignment. We dive into moving from burnout to grad school while working full-time, and why chasing an ESPN dream didn’t quite fit Caitlan’s calling.

We talk about:
- 💼 Navigating a corporate burnout-to-grad-school pivot while juggling a full-time job
- 📺 The moment we realize some big dreams aren’t ours to chase
- 🧠 Anxiety, identity shifts, and what nobody tells you about career pivots
- 👶🏽 Setting boundaries as a new mom and choosing softness over hustle
- 🔮 Weaving Human Design and spirituality into therapy sessions
- ✨ Caitlan’s 2025 mantra: “If I’m failing, it means I’m trying.”

Plus: Caitlan’s offering a listener discount on her Human Design readings — a great way to gain clarity on your next chapter.

This episode is for anyone in their “I want more” era, ready to make a real move toward alignment, balance, and intentional growth.

Connect with Caitlan:

📲 Instagram

🌐 Website

🎙️ Spotify | Apple

Transcript

Jazz: 0:00

Hello, everybody. Welcome back to All Our Parts. Hello. I am here with my first in-person live recorded guest. host of Return Pod. She's an IFS therapist and just a super fun person to be around, Caitlin. Thank you so much for being on the show. Thank you so much for having me. I am excited. So today I, so when we were talking yesterday, thinking about this parts aspect, and I loved learning about the fact that like being a therapist was your second like career choice.

Caitlan: 0:37

Yes, it was.

Jazz: 0:39

So how did you get started? Tell us about the journey

Caitlan: 0:43

the journey so I went to school after high school I was like ready to get out of high school and I was like get me out of here and then I went to college and I was like you know what I'm gonna be an ESPN sports anchor I'm gonna be on the sidelines I'm gonna be telling you I love sports I'm like a huge sports fan I played sports growing up and that was my dream and I love that there weren't a lot of women in it at the time so I was like I'm gonna bust into this thing so I actually went to journalism school okay and broadcast journalism and studied that and then I was like I'm scared and pivoted and then went into more like PR long story short graduated with a PR degree what am I gonna do with that a PR degree got a job in like corporate marketing and was doing that and I was sitting I remember this so vividly I was sitting at my desk and a part of me was just like you've got to be kidding me I don't feel fulfilled I felt so anxious all the time I was in fight or flight I was like doing the craziest stuff and I was also in my early 20s so I have a lot of compassion for that version of me but I would wake up so anxious I had this boss at the time who really shouldn't have been a manager and I would wake up like so anxious rush into the office to try to beat her in and It was so out of alignment. I was burnt out and so I was sitting at my desk one day in my little cubicle and I was just like, this ain't it. This is not it. I am miserable. I'm burnt out. I don't feel passionate about what I'm doing and I need to do something different. And so I just started listening to this little whisper that was like, be a therapist. And I'm like, what? That doesn't make any sense. And it was like, be a therapist. And I'm like, all right, how do I go about doing this? And it was really just one foot in front of the other. Sorry, I have to laugh at that because literally I have my foot in a boot cast right now. But it was one step at a time. And I got great advice from a friend when I was thinking about going back to grad school because it was just a total pivot. And and a big risk and she was like Caitlin just take one class and so if anyone out there is thinking about doing something totally scary I would encourage you what's the like one what's your one class what's the one teeny tiny little step

Jazz: 3:41

yeah I love that you share the fact that you made a choice like at a young really young part of your life and then you recognize that you pivoted. I've been exploring this idea that A sign of maturity in our society is that we know what we're doing, we know the path that we're on, and we're supposed to ride that wave to the very end. When truly, the idea of change and evolving is that we, our life doesn't look the same.

Caitlan: 4:13

No! And also, I think the biggest farce that we're told growing up is that, or like, something that I believed, I don't know if I was told it, is that like adults have their stuff together. Oh. That's a lie. Nobody knows what they are doing. And I really saw that in the corporate world. And I was like, Oh, LOL, you're my boss. And like, you have no clue and they're paying you a hundred K to not have a clue. And I was like, Oh, no one knows what they're doing. So we might as well enjoy it.

Jazz: 4:49

When I talk about change, I'm like, we don't expect like ourselves to fit in the same shoe size that we were when we were younger we don't expect we never expect us tangibly to fit in the same container our dreams our goals our values also get to have that same freedom and flexibility a

Caitlan: 5:12

million percent and that's what's most important Caitlin at 18 yeah I wanted to be an ESPN sports anchor and that wasn't fully in alignment but there was something about it that was I loved it podcasting I love doing this I love using my voice in this way and it's okay drawing on that I think that every piece of the puzzle along the way like still even if it doesn't seem like it fits it will fit in what I learned in the business world has helped me tremendously in my private practice and running a therapy practice and has helped me differentiate myself and I still use those skills even though it was like a very hard pivot and then same thing now I'm pivoting as well and I'm working more with entrepreneurs and I'm doing a lot more podcasting but all of my therapy skills still come into play nothing is ever just a complete wash

Jazz: 6:12

in my opinion when we allow them to be transferable they just allow us to expand to the person that we are going to be

Caitlan: 6:20

totally but you have to allow yourself to get to that you have to allow yourself to have the freedom and flexibility and to take the risk and to do something that maybe your family or other parts inside of you or other people say wow that's crazy it might feel like that to them but if it's right for you then who cares yeah

Jazz: 6:44

did you get tell us about the process in which so you transition from corporate and you start grad school did any like fear come up because master's program you're starting from so square one and you've already had work experience so what was that learning curve well

Caitlan: 7:01

first of all I was cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs and I did my master's program while I was still working so I still had my corporate job so Monday through Friday I was marketing Caitlin and then Friday evening through Sunday afternoon I was grad school Caitlin and what was it like was I afraid I think I was a but I also was just more like curious. I was like, is this gonna work out? I love learning about this and I love learning. And I don't know if I had the time to be afraid. And listen, I burnt myself to a little crisp. It was definitely not an alignment. I wouldn't do it that way again. I would not work a full-time salaried corporate job and also go to grad school at the same time. Don't do that. However, I think that it helped me, like, when you only have a certain amount of time, I didn't have time to think about or reflect on it, which was, like, horrible for my self-care and probably helped me in some ways push through and not be afraid as much or not let the parts of me that were holding fear, they just, I didn't have time to look at them, if I'm being totally honest.

Jazz: 8:25

Yeah. Yeah. that's so real sometimes when we are in a really transitional phase we gotta just do it we'll process it later and

Caitlan: 8:35

that was like my mo like coping mechanism for a long time too is i have for all the ifs people out there my soothing parts my firefighters are very much work oriented so like work is a soother for me which sounds even more cuckoo bananas but that's how my system set up people okay i don't make the rules i can even notice now when I'm in a time of transition I had a baby a year ago I have parts that want to lean into work because I get value out of that I feel seen in doing that and so I have to watch those parts even still so it wasn't that the fear wasn't there but it was that I used externally rewarded coping parts to okay people are like oh my gosh it's amazing that you're going to grad school and you still have your corporate job people loved it I loved it I felt like superwoman I was like listen and the reality is like that was so not in alignment I was burnt out and it was really hard I didn't really have a social life and I was in my mid 20s and I think about that and I'm like dang you

Speaker 01: 9:47

know

Caitlan: 9:47

that would have been cool and

Jazz: 9:50

I still did some things how has your relationship to your work now changed now that you are a full-time mom or has it not changed

Caitlan: 9:59

it has changed I think I think a lot more now about if I'm not setting this boundary with this client what is that costing me and ultimately how is that impacting my son if I am letting clients be like oh yeah sure no problem you can reschedule every single week that impacts my time with my son and that impacts me and I think having another person who's reliant on you has made me like crystal clear about boundaries in a way that it took it outside of me and so that's helped with my people pleasing parts that's helped with my parts that learned a lot about what being a quote unquote good therapist means and it's helped me honestly move into more alignment if I'm gonna be away from him i better be doing work that like sets my soul on fire because when i go back to him i want to be the best version of myself i can be and if i'm doing work that i'm just doing it to pass the time then what's the point you know what i'm saying

Jazz: 11:16

no that's so real for those who have fur babies out there who maybe treat their fur baby as their own child that's how i feel like when I go away from my dog

Caitlan: 11:28

yeah and that's real too whatever that other thing is whether it's a partnership a dog a human child a fur baby child whatever it is I think it just those relationships help us really clarify like what is truly important and I love my work don't get me wrong I want my son to see a mom who runs her own business and does those things and hasn't smothered him with your my entire world yeah but he's also still a huge of course priority for me and i think you can have both

Jazz: 12:13

absolutely it's leaning into that what is going to energize me when i get back home yeah i don't want to be half of a version of myself because i said yes to something that i actually wanted to say no to

Caitlan: 12:25

A million percent.

Jazz: 12:26

It forces you to go, okay, what's important? What am I going to allow to take me away from spending time with my loved one, my partner, pet, whatever the case may be? What am I going to allow to shift my energy for just a little bit and then come back a better, more aligned version of myself?

Caitlan: 12:47

Yeah. And when I'm with him, then that means that I'm like more joyful, more present, more myself and I don't have parts that feel resentful about caring for him because I've also filled up my own cup in terms of work and or like social activities and I think that'd be really important I don't want him to be 20 and for me to get caught in that saying I've done everything for you and I gave up my career for you that's

Jazz: 13:21

not really fair to put on him and that goes even to a larger topic that self-care is not selfish

Caitlan: 13:28

yeah that's like the living breathing example of that oh it's small it's slowly expanding like I've had to make compromise don't get me wrong I didn't I took a maternity leave even though we as solopreneurs don't get like technically paid for that I've only worked one day a week so I've shrunk my like practice and my work down to that and that for me was something I was willing to do that was my compromise but my compromise was that I still have something yeah even if it's five clients even if it's this one day I need to keep that so that I'm not saying when he's 20 I gave up everything and I did all of this for you yeah I have done a lot for him gladly from a place of love and care because I'm also loving and caring for myself

Jazz: 14:25

Yeah. We cannot give to other things, other people, unless we are giving to ourselves.

Caitlan: 14:34

Yeah. A million

Jazz: 14:35

percent. It is such a unique relationship when we think about our relationship to ourselves and what we need to soothe, to cope, all of the things. Those are imperative in how we show up for the people around us.

Caitlan: 14:54

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I'm constantly holding that in my mind. When we do every relationship, the one with ourselves, the one with our partners, friends, requires some amount of compromise at some times. But I think as long as it's not always you compromising, as long as there is some balance there, I think you can use that as the compass of the reciprocity and the way that the relationship feels to you.

Jazz: 15:24

Say more. about how it's impacted your idea of what it means to be a good therapist yeah

Caitlan: 15:34

you mean having my son and i think that it's impacted me and in really embodying the idea that i'm a human first like it's it is one thing to say that but it is a totally different thing to enact the that and yeah let me give you an example I at the end of February I'm taking my son to Disney World for the first time with my mom and my dad and they live in Florida so we're going down there and then I'm going to a bachelorette party for my cousin and I'm taking my son with me and my mom really wanted to do this day and the day that it happens to be is the day I see clients before I had my son I would have said no I have to work I have to see my clients I can't move things around and now that I've had my son I'm like I'm not missing out on this moment with him so I have to tell my clients either we reschedule or I can't see you that

Speaker 01: 16:43

week

Caitlan: 16:44

and parts of me would have felt like oh that means you're a shitty therapist because you're not going to see your clients and what if they need you like all of these stories And just yesterday, or a couple of days ago, I emailed my clients on that day. And I said, hey, I have a conflict. I want to do this thing with my son. And can you either reschedule or would you like to cancel on this Wednesday? And I have the best clients in the world. And every email I've gotten back so far is absolutely no problem. I can do da-da-da-da-da. It works out. It's totally fine.

Jazz: 17:25

Yeah.

Caitlan: 17:25

now I get that time with my son so I'm not resentful of my clients I'm still showing up and serving them in the capacity that I have and to me that is being a good therapist

Jazz: 17:40

damn because that is not what we're taught

Caitlan: 17:44

not at all not at all Jaz I think that needs to be a course in grad school don't be the blank slate I am a mother and I I have mother parts now and I don't need to tell my clients every single in and out and they don't need to hold space for me around that, but they can have compassion for the fact that I have a one year old. And as long as it's not, I don't cancel on them every week. I almost never, ever move my appointments and my sessions. This is a big deal. One time thing that happens to fall on that day and I'm offering them other alternatives and they understand that. And that's the like human to human connection. And I would do the same for them if I can. I have set up boundaries around that. If you're a therapist and you're listening to this, it's okay for you to live a big, bold, vibrant life as well.

Jazz: 18:44

And I think a lot of us who are in the social media space have a understanding that we are in such a unique job where we are humans supporting other humans yeah we're not a robot service like we can't just be on our phones or we have to give someone undivided 60 minutes full attention that is such a unique job so we have to be prioritizing also our our own lives our own personal lives so that we can show up and sometimes we've got to reschedule things

Caitlan: 19:22

I, yes, two things about that. One thing that I talk a lot about and I still go to supervision. I'm a decade into the field. I don't need to go. I pay for it because it's so important to me. That is my dedication to being a good therapist is I want to be in there checking myself before I wreck myself with my clients. I am committed to providing the best care. Something that I talk about with my supervisor is like, what's best Best for us as therapists is usually best for our clients. Let me give you an example. I have a policy where now clients can, I used to have a 48 hour, and I still have a 48 hour cancellation policy, but I feel like cancellation policies as therapists get like really tricky because it's like, what happens if your clients died or this or that? And they get really difficult to uphold. So I had this idea. I was like, listen, the 48 eight hour thing okay that's how everyone's doing it but what feels aligned for me so I do quarters so every quarter my client is committing to whatever their session cadence is once a week every other week whatever it is and they get every quarter one session that they could cancel like just no questions asked I don't care what happened you don't need to tell me you don't want to come cool Canceled for free. Outside of that, you have committed to coming every session that quarter. And I was scared to implement this because I was like, oh my gosh, maybe this isn't a process with my supervisor. And the impact it's having to my clients in terms of their own commitment to the work,

Jazz: 21:22

I

Caitlan: 21:22

can't. I can't say a whole lot more because I want to protect my clients, but let me just say, that was an alignment for me, but seeing the results, damn, that's also super an alignment for them because parts of them that were feeling like, therapy's hard, right? It is hard to motivate yourself to go sometimes. I tell them that all the time, like, it ain't rainbows and sunshine over here. It is, we leave feeling in all kinds of ways, but me holding that feeling for myself because I was like man these 48 hour cancellations when they're happening I get one day it just wasn't in alignment and so now I'm noticing it was good for me but it's also good for them

Jazz: 22:06

also shout out to really good supervision

Caitlan: 22:10

listen my supervisor Chrissy Tingle I don't think she's taking on any more supervision clients but if she is you should she's the best the best I will always I've been seeing her for four years and this is what I think it's so important like good supervision yeah I could go on a whole like tangent it's what's missing in the coaching world in my opinion shout

Jazz: 22:39

out to Dr. Kaufman Walker if you are out there if you are listening you are a queen you are iconic I'm grateful for you every Monday we chat life changing but good supervision is what allows us to show up and make really aligned and objective choices in our therapy spaces

Caitlan: 23:02

I completely agree I think it's the thing that has been the most game changing for me as a therapist truly like I will die on that hill and it pains me physically to hear about people getting shit supervision and it happens so much it motivated me to get my supervision license in the state of Colorado where I'm licensed because I was like no I want to offer people the same thing that I'm receiving really good supervision the way it should be taking into account the whole therapist as a freaking human being and the second thing is what my supervisor has taught me is like being relational and bringing parts of me to the session, not to, not to. have my clients take care of me but to just be like hello yeah I'm a I'm a human I was sick recently sometimes naming that I name my parts all the time in therapy I'm like oh my gosh my like therapist part is coming in right now and she really wants to tell you this I'm role modeling for my clients yeah that it's okay to have parts and that they're doing different things like that imagine if I was like oh yeah a blank slate I have no parts

Jazz: 24:35

yeah anyways my therapist part is very clinical so that perfect that it's like blended with Edna and so my supervisors homework for me was like whenever I show up in a supervision no clinical speak

Caitlan: 24:55

I was

Jazz: 24:57

like

Caitlan: 24:57

I love that though.

Jazz: 24:58

No, I love it because it's okay. I don't have to prove that I'm like doing the work that I know the criteria that X, Y, and Z, and I can still be like effective and seen as like a good therapist. So shout out to good supervision. That was a side note. We love it. We need it. It's there. Yeah. But you and I also have in common, we like to blend like spirituality, astrology, human design. Yes. How have you been able to in incorporate that into your work

Caitlan: 25:30

into my work with clients with therapy clients it was like a very gentle process I think it really began lol in supervision when just like little blips of oh we started talking about like mercury retrograde and supervision and that and then it's opened up parts of me that honestly exiled my like more spirituality I would I was like a really like witchy little kid.

Speaker 01: 26:00

I'd

Caitlan: 26:01

be like, I think I've lived a different life. And people would be like, what? Is your child, is she okay? And I got, I had to shut that part down really early on. And I was like crazy intuitive, crazy sensing. And I would be like, oh, I was not okay. And my mom would be like, what? And I learned to shut that down. And so for me, it started like in the process of not to use my podcast name, but like returning to myself. Plug it. I return pod. Just kidding. But reclaiming those parts and like looking at them and being like, Caitlin, it's okay that you feel a connection to tarot, that you feel a connection to human design, that it has been really supportive for you and it doesn't mean that you're gonna lose like your clinical skills so I had to wrestle with that first in supervision in my own work in my own practices so it wasn't just like I rolled over one day and I was like you know what fun if I which is okay if you do this by the way if I just started using human design and therapy I've been studying my own chart since 2017 and then it was a hobby like a side gig for me and then a side gig I wasn't like doing I wasn't gigging I wasn't making any money I was just like nerding out over it because I think it's so interesting and then I started talking about it in supervision and then I'd have clients like talk a little bit about astrology or talk a little bit about tarot or talk a little bit about this and I'd be like yeah and then I had a client and they asked me do I know about human design and I was like yeah and they were like would you like can I send you my chart I was like sure and then I suddenly realized like having their chart unlocked therapeutically so much because I was like I felt like I had been given a map to parts of them and that we couldn't see or touch because they were behind these big walls. And then all of a sudden it was like seeing their human design and their map. I was like, my gosh, this makes sense and that makes sense. And it led to different conversations and curiosities. And it's almost like a fast track pass at Disney World. That's what having, to me, having your human design chart in therapy feels like. Because you're getting information about yourself, about how you are uniquely designed, about like you're true. And then you can see where parts have gotten in the way.

Jazz: 29:09

Yeah. So much more clearly. Yeah. I love that you emphasize the co-collaborative approach and that the client is bringing it to you and you're like, yes, let's dive into it. Let's explore it and recognizing, yes, they come us for clinical objectivity this that and the other and there are so many people out there who also can thrive with that intuitive energetic more woo woo quote unquote diagnostics that we use

Caitlan: 29:43

yeah like my whole thing is get you a girl who can do both yeah you don't have to and this was I think fear parts of me not wanting to own this gift of mine for a super long time because i was like oh people are gonna think i'm like that little girl who was like something's wrong with the mommy and my mom being like how do you know that what i was so scared that people were gonna think i was like totally weird and like batshit and just like way out there and i do think just like any polarization in ifs if i only leaned into all the spirituality and no kind of anchoring and like the process of therapy, that wouldn't be helpful either. But I do think there's something about tapping into this other realm when clients are interested in it that helps us like be that more well-rounded, holistic person and have a space like for that. I don't think there is always just like a first, We find the part. Then we befriend the part. Then we whatever to the part, whatever the steps are. That's great. But there could be protectors that are never going to tell you about that part.

Jazz: 31:15

And then what? And then what? That's so real. I have found that the more I have allowed myself to trust and lean into my more intuitive and spiritual gifts, I also been able to trust my clinical judgment more a

Caitlan: 31:32

million percent a million percent because that's the magic I think both are true both things like and we can hold them both like you don't have to just be like a hundred percent intuitive you can use like common sense and strategy and clinical pieces and those are helpful but also there's something else are there something else happening and we need to talk about it for sure as

Jazz: 32:01

we are wrapping up and closing out I'm thinking about what is a piece of advice you would give especially to the early 20-somethings who are finding that they're in a career that they're feeling or stuck in that they're feeling like I don't know if this is for me but I don't know what's next

Caitlan: 32:22

I would say listen don't ignore it that's the first place to start is okay I don't know if this is for me great that's great information that was great information for me I eventually knew like this is definitely not for me you kidding 70 years no not 70 years but like so many 40 years or whatever however long a career is I can't do it you don't have to know what's next like just acknowledging that might not be it for you and staying open and curious and maybe even doing like something like getting a human design reading if you're interested in it or pulling a tarot card like something to tap more into who you are and returning to that I think is going to help you like find the next little right step and find the next little right step you don't need to eat the whole elephant right away or you're never going to get there like you're never going to take the step because it feels so big right if you're like oh my gosh I think I need to change careers it's like parts go, are you serious? That feels like this. But if you're like, oh, I don't really feel aligned in this job. Let me think about what might feel better. That suddenly goes from being this like huge thing to, okay, what might feel better? And then we make our list and then it go, okay, it might feel better to do something more rewarding. That's where I started. And then it might feel better to do this and this. And then you just follow that. And Oh, okay. Cool. Now what? Now what? And you just keep asking yourself the question and following and taking the next smallest step.

Jazz: 34:08

Yeah. I love that. I am trying a new thing this season where I ask each of my guests, what is your commitment to yourself in 2025? Oh, I

Caitlan: 34:22

love this. My commitment to myself is I want to fail. Oh. I want to fail. at a bunch of stuff because if I'm failing that means I'm trying so I want to just like fail and be like not taking it that seriously yes obviously I want success as well that's my signature as a projector in human design but I love the idea of flipping things on its head like we learn a lot in American society about success

Speaker 01: 34:55

and

Caitlan: 34:56

getting good grades and getting a good job and what if it's what did you fail at and so i just started this with a friend but i do the three f's for every week what am i gonna have fun at this week what am i gonna fail at this week and can i cuss yeah what am i gonna give less fucks about this week and that has been really helpful for me because i was like oh i'm gonna fail my current thing is i'm gonna fail at pitching myself on other people's podcasts because then that means i'm trying like I love being on podcasts I love doing my own podcast so if I'm if people say no that means I'm out there yeah

Jazz: 35:39

I love that's like a that's a fail reframe living it embodying it obsessed I hope you fail a lot this year thank

Caitlan: 35:49

you I'm sure I will I'm sure I will big failures but from every failure too I'll learn something

Speaker 01: 35:56

mhm

Caitlan: 35:57

And I'll be trying. And like one of those failures is going to turn into like a yes. Someone out there is going to say yes to me to being on their podcast. Can't wait. What are

Jazz: 36:10

you up to? Where can people find you?

Caitlan: 36:12

Yes. What am I up to? I have a special offer for your listeners. So if they would like to book a human design reading with me because that's what I'm doing now in 2025 or like the easiest way to work with me. at the moment for the one-off bit they can use the code parts at checkout and they'll get a discount so if they want a human design reading they can do that and i'll give you the link so you can put it in the show notes and other than that they can find me on my website she's getting a makeover i don't know if she's going to be done by the time this is released but i'm very excited and then you can listen to my podcast uh return podcast with caitlin siegenthaler and i podcast weekly and I love it and if you want to listen to me yammer on more then that's where you can find me oh and I have YouTube now yes yeah exciting and what am I up to I'm doing human design readings and I'm working with entrepreneurs like I love the healers and the feelers if that's you come and see me and let's get you like really aligned in your business and taking action and moving forward and not letting like the world I'm seeing this more and more as like people dimming their light or turning off their gifts like I was doing we gotta stop that

Jazz: 37:35

so

Caitlan: 37:36

that's what I'm doing

Jazz: 37:37

Caitlin this has been so fun it was so fun thank you so much for joining me all of your links everything will be linked in the show notes and I'll see you all next week bye bye