The Coddling Problem in Content: How Soft Landing Messaging Dilutes Authority and Delays Your Next Level with Kelsey Hogan

This episode is a loving drag + strategy session for anyone building a brand and still introducing their business like it’s a hobby. 😅

I’m joined by Kelsey Hogan, founder of Claim and Co Media Agency, and she’s not here to coddle you—she’s here to help you win. We get into why “messy action” is often glorified (and why Kelsey says it’s basically a scam), how to build a community that actually buys, and what it looks like to show up online with confidence without oversharing your whole life.

If you’ve been chasing virality, downplaying your expertise, or waiting to feel “ready”… consider this your sign to step into your audacity era.

In this episode, we talk about:

• Why your brand voice should be a “category of one” (and not a watered-down version of what feels safe)
• The difference between building a following vs. building a community
• Why “messy action” messaging can keep your business stuck (and what to do instead)
• The confidence leak hiding in the phrase “I just…”
• What founders get wrong about personal branding (spoiler: it’s not about sharing everything)
• The truth about virality: eyeballs are cute, but do you have the infrastructure to convert?
• Why broadcast channels are underrated and how to use them like a “mini podcast”
• Favorite platforms and what they’re best for: Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, and Threads
• Kelsey’s word to embody: AUDACITY (and yes, you’re invited)

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Are you sitting with thousands of hours of B-roll content and telling yourself, I'll start posting tomorrow? Are you in your head worried about your friends and family thinking you're a cringe for choosing to be visible? Are you chasing trends instead of building influence? Welcome to the Visibility Standard, where the visionaries of today are changing the roles of their industries and letting their voice be heard. I'm your host, Jasmine, and we are setting the standard. She is the owner-founder of Claimed Co. Media Agency. Kelsey Hogan, thank you so much for joining me today.

SPEAKER_00 0:47

Thank you so much for having me. I am so excited to be here.

SPEAKER_01 0:53

What drew me to your content is the way that you own your voice. And so often I feel like in social media spaces and anywhere, we coddle our audiences. It's a phrase that I heard recently that I'm toying with, but we coddle our audiences. We choose to have a softer landing, but you are direct. I mean, you are gracious in the way that you communicate as well, but you are really about supporting people and getting to the next level.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

Absolutely. And I appreciate you saying that. My voice, my particular brand voice, my personal brand is bold and it can be to the point and in your face sometimes, feeling, and that's that is truly my personality. So I like to tell people that doesn't have to be you. You can get your message through being more subtle, more conservative, louder, more colorful. It really is honing your own personal brand. That is what we are working on. And your voice is unique from any other person. And so when you can create that unique category of one type presence, that is when you start connecting with the community of people that are going to see value in what you do and purchase your product or service or whatever it is that you offer. So that's really how you grow that community is that authenticity.

SPEAKER_01 2:24

Yes. And just to give folks a little bit of background and lay the land for people to learn more about you, you are no stranger to social media marketing. You have been in the game for 10 plus years.

SPEAKER_00 2:37

Am I right? Yeah, it's it's actually almost 20 years. And I started in public relations. So my whole thing is I used to pitch stories and put spins on things happening with restaurants and hotels in order for the media to be interested and want to pick it up. And now I'm putting spins on what people are doing in their businesses in order for the community, the audience, and followers to resonate. So it is that storytelling element. So, yep, it was public relations before Instagram existed. I will say Facebook was around. It was sketchy at best, but it was around. And we were not using it for business back then, by the way. We were just using it to connect and make personal relationships and communicate. And really, I think today social media is so much getting back to that because when you look at Gen Z, everything they do is online, social, community, news, um, shopping, obviously. So we are back to that place where it's all in one. And that's really that community element where you're not just trying to grow a following, you need to be growing a community because these are the people that demand authenticity from a brand. And in order to be authentic, you can't just be thinking about dollar signs and sales. You really have to value the people that are part of your following.

SPEAKER_01 4:02

Yeah. There's more discernment in where the dollar goes. And so if I am investing in this brand and this product, don't bullshit me. Like as someone who is, I call myself like the leader of Gen Z because I am technically the oldest of Gen Z. Okay, love it. Yes. I I look at a product, I look at a brand, and I'm like, okay, but what are you like? Who are you about? And I feel like that is the direction that marketing is going. The storytelling aspect, the less about what the outcome is, and more so, like, what are you about?

SPEAKER_00 4:42

Mm-hmm. And how can I be a part of it, right? They, the consumers today, Gen Z, want to be a part of what you are creating. They don't want to be on an island as the buyer and you are the marketer or the brand or the big business. They want to feel that. And absolutely, some incredible, very large brands have done that for people. So it really is creating that sort of community and it's that cult-like brand where everyone wants to feel it and be a part of it, and they feel like they have a piece of the pie, so to speak.

SPEAKER_01 5:16

So you started off in PR. What drove you to start Claimed and Co.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

So actually, I'm a millennial. I'm actually an elder millennial. So I like to hold that title. I'm very proud of my elder millennialism. And I was working in PR for about a decade in Chicago, and I took a few years off when I started having kids. I have two kids now. They're in elementary school, so they're nine and six. And I was going through a time in my life where I was trying to get pregnant again and I was struggling with fertility. So I started really sharing my story about my fertility struggles, secondary infertility, and these feelings that I was going through, the processes, the procedures, all of that. And I really started building this personal brand before I even knew what that was around this sort of infertility influencer, I like to call it now. And from there, people really started kind of connecting to my social media, my Instagram. I was also blogging at the time as well. And I ended up having businesses and small owners and founders reach out for me to start running their social media. So that was like the serendipitous piece was that my personal brand, as just a mom who was sharing her story that really didn't have any sort of goal in mind as far as owning a business or creating a company, started doing freelance social media based upon the personal brand that I had built. And my first company was actually called Small Batch Social Co. And it was a dedicated social media agency, really about creating that small batch, uniquely tailored content for small businesses. Let's say nine months ago, we transitioned over to what we are now, which is Claimed and Co. And it is an expansion. We still have the agency. We are still doing social media management and content shoots and email marketing, but we are doing so much more. My goal is more of all of the things for more women. No matter what you are looking to do, whether you have a dream, have a business now, maybe want one day, I want you to join into this community. We have coaching, we have programming, we have free, valuable information on Instagram and in my broadcast channel every single day. So I wanted to expand and really bring more women into the fold. And that's kind of my development as that freelance social media manager to founder and CEO. And that's the journey that I help women take with their businesses as well, which is literally my passion. I love it so much. And I was growing, I wanted to create growth in the business and what I was offering as well. So it's been amazing since the launch of Claimed earlier this year.

SPEAKER_01 8:02

That's amazing. I'm curious, was it intentional to take the word small out of your business name?

SPEAKER_00 8:09

So it was. Yes. And I talk to people about this. We like to create these authority-building topics that we can kind of stand on our soapbox about and say, other people in my industry are glamorizing this, but I'm going to tell you why it's not a good idea. And my thing is, yes, I want you to start. I will say just show up, but show up with strategy, show up with intention. Because when I think messy action is glamorized, I think it's this idea that throw anything online and you're going to start making money and it's going to be great. Any mom, any woman out there can just start putting stuff up, making it in Canva, not developing a business plan and seeing massive success. And that just isn't true. So for me, messy action feels like a scam because it's this idea that anyone can do it, just show up where you are, show up looking like a hot mess every day, and you're gonna make tons of money off a digital product. It's not the way it works. I want people to show up, but I want them to have a plan in place. I want them to be strategic about how we show up. So it's aligned action over messy action. And it's not waiting for this perfect moment to start. And it's not holding off because you're not ready. It's taking steps to get ready. That is the messy piece let me get my things together on the back end. And then I'm going to be strategic and create a logo, develop a website, show up with presence and authority, and really look like a brand that I would see scrolling Instagram that I would want to buy from. So it's that strategy and that sort of positioning and professionalism and authority. That's the type of brand people are going to connect to and invest in. It's not the messy. We need to put our businesses and ourselves on this pedestal. You've created something so incredible. Why give it a messy, scrappy, sort of half-trying treatment? And then you're just spinning your wheels on the content hamster with nothing really in place with the foundation. So it's like a house. Without foundations, it's gonna fall right through to the basement. Maybe not today, but it will. And why wait? Just start with that polish and again, give it what it deserves and treat it like it is this amazing thing that you've created because it really is. Your audience feels messiness too. People don't want more chaos, they want clarity when they're coming, especially when it comes to buying. If they are confused, they are not going to buy.

SPEAKER_01 12:26

Yeah. Show up with some confidence. Why do you think women, especially like women business owners, founders, lean into that messy action messaging? Because I'm thinking of like male entrepreneurs, you don't typically see Todd saying, building with messy action, and I'm selling this like stationary uh business cards. But a lot of times with women, there's this downplaying that uh we see or this need to shrink and say, Hey, I've done this and hope you like it.

SPEAKER_00 12:59

Exactly. So I did a post about this recently and it was about the idea of the word just. Oh, I just have this business. When someone asks you, what do you do? Oh, I just have a stationary company and kind of looking around and you're not really, you know, giving eye contact. And we're, you know, we are, we're downplaying and we're kind of minimizing what we are doing because we've almost been conditioned to do that in a way, whether it's intentional or not. So it really is a muscle to step into that confidence. I'm actually doing a program right now talking to women about this because it is what I call the quiet epidemic of women that are just, we're shrinking ourselves. And even if we feel I'm a bold, powerful woman and I'm a feminist and I can do anything, we're not actually showing up that way. So absolutely 100% agree with you on that. It's that sort of conditioning as women that we kind of really don't just stand on our authority and say, hey, this is why I'm incredible. I am a CEO and founder. Even if it's that group of moms that might be whispering about you or your friends and family, right? The people that are, you know, gonna maybe think it's cringe worthy. Like we have to move past that. And I think, again, this is just women stepping into that space of authority and just taking over the world, to be totally honest. That is what I am all about.

SPEAKER_01 14:20

Now, you work a lot with people with their behind the scenes, with marketing and everything. Why is it important for you as the owner to be visible and to be present with your business?

SPEAKER_00 14:32

Um, so I mean, there's there's a few pieces to this. With me, I think with a personal brand and a lot of these businesses that we are starting with a personal brand, people want that human-to-human connection. People buy from humans. They don't buy from a Canva template or an AI video or even a B-roll video. They buy from the person that is speaking it and that is really true and passionate about what you're selling, what you're offering. So for me, showing up is a non-negotiable. And I tell this to anyone with a personal brand, showing up literally every day is a non-negotiable. That consistency is so important. And then there's that other piece of the behind the scenes and really that like employee-driven content that the communities are really loving a lot lately too. And it's giving people just kind of that like it's like breaking down the fourth wall, right? It's showing them like what happens behind the scenes, what is our team doing? And people really just want to be involved, they want to be invested and they want to feel a part of it. So when you kind of break that fourth wall and you welcome them into your office space, and even if it's doing a funny skit or sharing a carousel, they're like, okay, this is real. These people feel genuine, and that builds that connection to the business. And for me, it's very natural, but I understand it's not natural for people to just show up, show their behind the scenes. And there's a lot of that sort of limiting belief. Well, nobody's gonna want to see what I have. My life is boring. No one, it's not boring. It's boring to you, is exciting to your audience, right? Everything that you're doing on the day-to-day, those are those little tidbits that people want and actually find quite fascinating. But to you, it feels mundane because it's just part of your daily life. But when you're showing what's happening outside of just Instagram graphics, people become more invested and they're like craving more from you.

SPEAKER_01 16:32

Yeah, it's when influencers document their day-to-day. It's like, well, no one really cares what I'm doing. But it's like, no, show us what you're buying at the grocery store, show us what you're cooking, show us where you're hanging out, what social scenes are you a part of? Because not only are you aligning yourself with that business that you are supporting, but you're also giving an insight to how your audience may spend their time and they will be interested and want to learn more about you.

SPEAKER_00 16:59

Absolutely. It's creating those connections, those little mini micro connections that you can create with your audience. And like you said, you know, you're going places and then you're creating collaboration because you're tagging the coffee shop, you're tagging the people that work on your team, you're tagging someone that you're doing an event with, and that's sort of that community action happening on social media and it spills into the real world. And it really does matter. The inside the computer, outside of the computer, connecting it all and really making those little moments for people to sort of tap into and be a part of as well, right? Like you could do a TikTok live and have someone pop on. You could be doing a broadcast channel on Instagram where people can comment and respond back and just really feel, again, like they have a stake in something and that their voice is being heard and they feel seen and they feel connected, they feel like recognized and they feel very comfortable. And this is people make friends online, right? This is part of their social community, could potentially be your brand. So you're really opening yourself up to that vulnerability as a business owner, but that is what we need to do as personal brands in order to really create those human-to-human connections that are going to lead to the trust in our businesses and lead to the customers, which of course, yes, we all want to make the money. We want the clients, we want the customers, but we have to put human first, community first, and authenticity first.

SPEAKER_01 18:24

Do you believe every founder could benefit from having a personal brand?

SPEAKER_00 18:28

I absolutely do, to be totally honest with you. I mean, I can't think of a space where it wouldn't be beneficial. Now, sometimes if you have a brand, it would make sense for you to start a separate page, and that would be sort of your founder story page if you have like a very strong product-based business, for example. However, I also see product businesses where the founder is still coming on and sharing that story, or whether it's email marketing, note from the founder, you know, really being creative about it and touching your people in different ways so that they feel that the person at the top, whether you're a small business or a multi-million billion dollar brand, sees you, right? We see this with Delta Airlines. You get on the plane and there's always that CEO, the owner of Delta, comes talking first and foremost about the safety tips that they've implemented this year. So they there's that visual, right? And of course they're not answering DMs on Instagram, but hey, they probably have done some sort of marketing moment like that because people do really want to feel like the higher ups, even if you're a solopreneur, are listening. So I absolutely think it can only benefit your business. It's not going to hurt your business. And when we're talking about small solopreneurs or small businesses, small women run businesses, absolutely the personal brand element is just going to create those connections so much faster.

SPEAKER_01 19:53

What do you think is a misconception about having a personal brand?

SPEAKER_00 19:59

I think the idea is that I have to show everything about my life to be a personal brand. And let's say I'm a very private person. I don't share my kids' faces. I don't want people to know if I'm married or single. I don't want people to know the city I live in necessarily or what school my kids go to or where I might hang out. That is not what it is. You can be absolutely so private and still have an authentic personal brand. We are not saying share everything from your private, you know, doctor's appointments moments, although some people do, right? It's your level of comfortability, but showing up and speaking on your expertise and what you offer and your values, your visions, that isn't a breach of your privacy. So I think it's that idea that, well, you know, this is just for me. This isn't for social media, I think can be harmful to your business because it's not about this voyeurism. Sure, people love the reality TV model and seeing behind the scenes, but that's not what a personal brand is. A personal brand is showing up as the face of your business and giving them that authentic human piece that could potentially really be missing and be that spark and that connection that people are looking for in order to feel connected to your business.

SPEAKER_01 21:19

I feel like a lot of times too, we see within social media is chasing virality. Everyone wants to hit a hundred thousand in their next posts, but they're not really taking the time or space to build those connections, build that community. I saw a recent post you made on Threads about trial reels, and that's uh a prime example of that because I think, yes, it gets you in front of a new audience, but you still have to maintain that audience.

SPEAKER_00 21:48

I talk about the idea of chasing likes and followers in these metrics a lot. I always say, don't get me wrong, more followers, more eyeballs on your business, that's incredible because more opportunities. Opportunity to find people that are interested in working with you, collaborating, buying from you, etc. However, I think that when people jump into creating a personal brand or starting a business, their immediate thought is virality, followers. They haven't built a business model and a messaging strategy that is going to connect to people. So they're just throwing content against the wall like spaghetti, hoping that something sticks, but it's not sticking because the messaging is not clear and there's a lot of noise out there. So the people that are clear and cut through the noise are the ones that are being heard and purchased from. So it's of course a great thing to grow and have a viral moment, but also are you ready for this viral moment? How are you going to capitalize? Do you have enough inventory? Do you have a system to capture everyone's email via a many chat automization? Going viral is great, but I know personally people on TikTok, Instagram with hundreds of thousands of followers who are not making a dime. So the idea that money equals followers or that there's a connection between the number of dollar signs that you're seeing in your bank account and the number of followers is just false. And it is a hard sort of thought process to break because people just instinctively do feel that more followers, more likes, more viral moments is going to make me more money. And they're skipping the foundations that we talked about before. And it's never going to connect and hit when you don't have that messaging crystal clear and you don't really know who you're speaking to and what you're really sharing. So that's that piece where we love going viral. Of course, I want you to go viral, but I want you to be prepared for it and I want you to know how to capitalize on it when it does happen, so that it's not just a blip in time, but it is a true milestone for your business that shifts you into that next tier of success.

SPEAKER_01 24:11

We see a lot of influencer culture and we think, oh, virality equals gifting, it equals opportunities, it equals events. But like you said, if you don't have anything to capitalize on that moment, if you don't have the offer, if you don't have the space, if you don't have the stripe invoices ready to be sent out, if you are not building your capacity to accept that influx, it's really just a vanity metric at that point.

SPEAKER_00 24:41

Yes. And you know what I've seen, and this has been somewhat recently, is the content creators out there on TikTok are really being transparent about how difficult it is to make a living off of content creation. Sure, I can be gifted here and there. Yes, I made$500 off a collab, but guess what, guys? My rent is$2,000. I made$500. The math isn't mathing. And they're coming out and saying, hey, I went back and got a real job, and my life is infinitely better. I'm still doing collaborations, I'm still making side money and getting gifted products and doing different influencer type events, but I'm not relying on it for my sole income. And I really like that because I think there was this moment, especially probably after 2020 and when TikTok really took off, where everyone just thought, oh, I'm gonna start creating content and getting brand deals, and that will be my full-time job. But content creation is a full-time job. I personally couldn't imagine filming some of these videos that take so much time to film and so much time to edit. And again, you don't know if someone's gonna want it or not. You know, reaching out to brands, pitching deals, this is like all a lot of work. So I like the transparency around that now. Of course, there's still different things popping up, scams about, oh, you know, work from home and you know, make 10K and you're gonna post this one audio. But I think people are coming to realize, and I do like that the younger people are really kind of being authentic and saying, I went back to corporate life and I'm happier now. And there's really this like idea, oh my God, working in corporate is just the worst. And actually, when you're in your 20s, it's kind of great to just have this steady paycheck and just feel like very solid and not wonder where the money is going to come from. I know in my 20s, I would always say I would never want to work for myself because it seems like a lot of work. And that just wasn't what I was interested in as a 20-something. I wanted to work for someone else and grow my potential and all of my skills. I never thought I would be an entrepreneur. I was an accidental entrepreneur, as they say, but of course, there's people in their 20s that have that drive and that want that now, and I love that. But there's nothing wrong with working a quote unquote regular job. They can actually be really cool. And it's kind of cool to just leave work and go to yoga and go grocery shopping and not be on your computer and having clients yelling at you and maybe your boss is yelling at you, which is another story. But I mean, there really are some benefits to just being a regular person or that idea that I started a business, so I have to quit my job today. I mean, listen, in your 20s, I had so much time and energy. I feel like I could have been running a business over here and working. I mean, these girls, they're fitness instructors and they have side hustles and they are full-time, you know, attorneys or consultants. And it's like you have all this energy, ladies own that because it goes away. It goes away when you turn 40. Actually, 35, but I digress.

SPEAKER_01 27:48

Yeah. People, the narrative around entrepreneurship right now is that freedom, flexibility. They look at content creators and they're like, oh, I can get paid for posting content for being myself. And it's like there's so much strategy behind that. There are people behind the scenes, there are emails being sent, there are people who are managing the content that is being created, sending the draft content first. Like, there is so much work behind it that I almost when I ask people, like, how much do you want to think about work? If you like thinking about work, if you like working, reach for the stars, content creations for you. But if you really want to go to yoga without thinking about how you can document it, if you want to be able to go to lunch without thinking about the client that's behind you, like you can work for somebody because there's also that steady income, like entrepreneurship, and every week doesn't look the same. Working for somebody.

SPEAKER_00 28:48

And I talk to so many women entrepreneurs, it doesn't matter what their business is, is that work really is on their mind all the time. And of course, we have these practices to disconnect and put our phone on DD, and you can do all of that, but I mean, it's just a different kind of lifestyle that I can be laying in bed with my phone off, but I'm still having ideas populating in my brain. And I have clients that aren't sleeping. And, you know, you can set yourself up for success and create these rituals and these habits that you stick to. But at the end of the day, it is your business and it is your bank account and is your livelihood. So it's definitely something that you take very, very seriously. And of course, at any age, anyone can do it, but there's it's a choice to be made for sure. And dabble in it, see, but maybe stay with your real job for a little bit, which I know a lot of entrepreneurs do as well. And then they've got that kind of duality of incomes until they're ready to make the full switch. So there's never just like a right answer. It doesn't have to be black or white. I think a side hustle is an awesome start. And I think there's obviously time for most people, especially if you're younger and you don't have children, to start something and test it out and see. The 20s are such a time to explore and figure out what you want to do. Like I said, never would have thought I would be running a business. Definitely wanted to be a Range Rover Pilates mom. And here I am. So hello everyone. Things change and that's that's life, right? I think I saw on Instagram, I didn't see the number, but it was like Americans or humans have five to seven careers in their life on average, right? It's normal. Changing, pivoting, evolving, quitting something that isn't serving you and that's draining you mentally is huge, right? Whether it's your business or your job, you can start fresh and you can, you know, restart and create something different for yourself. So that's kind of the message there.

SPEAKER_01 30:48

Is there a trend or a form of content that you are enjoying seeing lately?

SPEAKER_00 30:52

Well, I'm actually really loving threads. We met on threads, and I kind of like to call threads like nice girl Twitter. Of course, now they have ads and these media platforms, they start out really great with no ads and then they start getting ads, and then it's gonna be, you know, the sponsored and the DMing and all that. But um, no, it's kind of cool. But for me, to be totally honest, I even kind of took a break from threads because we get so many platforms that, especially as a business owner that works in digital, I am on my phone so much. It's almost like stepping away for me. I love the idea of a broadcast channel. So I have a broadcast channel, it's an Instagram channel. I like to call it my mini podcast. And I actually have tons of clients starting these now too, where product, service, it doesn't matter. You kind of get on there, you share voice notes, you share copy and just little riffs and ideas and little sneak peeks and brainstorms and tips that you aren't sharing on stories on the feed. You aren't sharing these anywhere else. This is your little kind of like secret community that people feel really special to be a part of, but it's also free for them. So it's not like you're saying, hey, pay me for this secret little channel. And I've really, really been loving that and kind of building that community up and focusing on that. Um, it kind of reminds me of a Facebook group in a way, except obviously I'm the only one that's speaking, although you can allow people to chat if you do want to. For me, I just have it sit up where I'm just sharing or I'm sharing a post or even a trial reel. I can share that to my broadcast group and honestly never even share it to my whole community. I can just share the trial reel. So it's kind of cool. And it's something that I've been playing around with a lot. I'm definitely in a lot of broadcast channels too. They go dead very quickly. People love to start a broadcast channel and then never post in it again. Um, I'm trying not to be that person. So that's something that I would say as like a trend. They have been around for a while, but I don't think they're really utilized, and I think they can be really beneficial. So you could you could offer something special to people in there and kind of before you offer it to anyone else, or maybe it's you know a discounted rate that you kind of want to test out with people, give it to your your broadcast community, and you're just you're giving value constantly though. That's what you're doing, is you're pumping them with value and inspiration. And it's just another place to give value because for me, a lot of people say, I don't know what to post. I have the opposite problem. I have too much to post. And my drafts and my carousels get backed up to the point where I've got to just start putting this information into my channel because I've got too much to share. So I know you guys are like, I wish I had that problem. You could, trust me, when you really hone in on what you want to do. But that's also like a dump for these things where I'm like, you know what? I can't post on stories anymore today because I've been inundating and my feed I posted. TikTok, you can post as much as you want, which is also fun because it's much more unhinged over there. So leaning into that when I just have something I have to share, but on Instagram, I have to play by the algorithm rules, which means not talking too much.

SPEAKER_01 34:04

I will say when I am looking for a motivational tip or a marketing tip, I am in your broadcast channel. I've loved following it. Um, it is so informative and so helpful. So it's really good to hear.

SPEAKER_00 34:18

And honestly, it's like what you're doing in your broadcast, you're mimicking something that you're offering to people. So, of course, your goal is adding value, but you want people to come into your communities and buy your products or services. You're just warming them, you're warming them, and you're taking care of them and you're nurturing them and you're wrapping them with a big fat hug. And like for me, I do truly care. I just have all this info that I want to put out there to people. And some people forget broadcast channels exist. I've started dropping so much of this kind of stuff into my group coaching community because I'm like, well, why not add more value? Why not give them this stuff that I'm just thinking in my head? Those broadcast channels that really hit are the ones where you're just having these experts in whatever it might be, sharing these moments that no one else is hearing. You're like, okay, that's that behind the scenes like undercover boss. Like, I'm like listening in and get hearing their kind of day-to-day, which is again that voyeuristic thing people want to know more, like the behind, like, oh, how did you ideate this? Or what was that thought you had? And that's that's what I try to do with that. So it's it's fun, guys. I love it. I'll join your broadcast channel if you start one. But if you stop posting, I'm deleting it.

SPEAKER_01 35:27

We've talked about all of like the major social media platforms. Is there one that's your favorite?

SPEAKER_00 35:34

Well, I have to say I'm an Instagram girly because of my elder millennial status. We say Instagram is our bread and butter at our social media agency, and it really is. But I don't discount Facebook. So I will say Instagram is my favorite, and maybe that's my generation. It's just where I think that for businesses, you're going to create the most sales, minus maybe a TikTok shop moment for a product. You are nurturing people and converting them on Instagram with links and stories, with DMs. That's the nurturing. TikTok, love it for that exposure and that visibility and reaching more people without all of the aesthetics and that curated feeling that can really wear you out. And then you're bringing them to Instagram to kind of massage. And then we don't forget Facebook because reels are going on Facebook. And I have clients that have 20K reels, you know, 20K followers on Facebook. And we're like, where do these people come from? It's from Facebook reels that are truly just reposting. I'm not even talking about we're posting separately. It's in app repost button and it's going over to Facebook and getting virality and questions and DMs. So I never discount Facebook. And as a millennial that was one of the first several thousand people to join Facebook, I can say, you know, I still respect you, but you're not my favorite.

SPEAKER_01 37:00

That just inspired me to activate my Facebook a little bit more.

SPEAKER_00 37:05

I mean, at least at the very least, putting the content out from Instagram to Facebook, I do it to LinkedIn, I do it to Pinterest. And guys, there's so many channels. You don't have to be everywhere, but you do have to be in certain places. And I will mention that email marketing isn't a platform per se. However, it is the number one place that you probably are not that you need to be as a business owner. Because with email, you're taking people off of another network and you're bringing them to your own list that is literally downloaded into an Excel sheet and you have all of their information where you can reach them right in their inbox. Whereas they have to come to you on social media. They have to come to your TikTok, scroll upon your Instagram reel. So email is really, really key and it's it's different, right? We're not talking about creating a reel. We're talking about creating, you know, sales emails. Or what I like to do personally, I recommend is starting like a weekly series and sending it on a Saturday or a Sunday because people are kind of more relaxed and it's like, hey, grab your coffee and pull up a seat. We're talking today about blank. It feels less forced and pressure, especially if you haven't done email yet, but especially for product-based businesses, like those emails and those funnels, they have got to be locked in empty cart and someone saw the checkout but didn't come. That's how you generate that revenue and really get it rolling. So I know I named every platform, but I'm a digital marketing person. Can you blame me for giving everyone a little credit?

SPEAKER_01 38:39

Well, I've the insights that you just offered for each one, I imagine is gonna be so helpful to listeners. What is a first step that you would offer to someone that is just thinking about building their personal brand?

SPEAKER_00 38:51

So I would say let's get your foundations locked in. And some of these things are the tangibles that are gonna cost a little bit of money is professional brand photography. I want you to position yourself as the CEO, as the founder of your stationary business and not just mom in my basement. Okay. I want to really step into this as this is a business. I am the founder, and here is what I have to share: website design or some sort of landing page, professionally designed logo really does make a difference. I promise you. And then I would really get my messaging honed in and think, what does my audience want? What do they need? What need am I fulfilling to them? And how am I getting them there? And then create messaging that is going to bridge the gap between where they are and where they want to be. And even with a product like Stationery, I have clients that will say, Well, my product isn't life-changing. I'm not really bringing them anywhere. I'm just selling them paper. Well, that's the mindset shift. You are. You're transforming the way that they communicate with their friends and family. You're transforming the way they're able to present their business on a business card or the way that they're able to execute their wedding and create this experience for their guests by this gorgeous invitation, right? So you are being transformative in whatever you are selling and believing in yourself and believing that is so key. You don't just sell anything, you create a complete evolution and transformation for the people buying from you.

SPEAKER_01 40:37

Kelsey, this conversation was absolutely amazing. If anything, I hope that it inspires my audience to just really reimagine how they approach their personal branding, how they approach being visible and really show up with confidence. Everything will be linked in the show notes if you want to reach out to Kelsey to learn more. As a closing question to all of my guests, I am asking, what is a word that you want to embody by the end of 2025?

SPEAKER_00 41:06

My word is audacity. I actually think this is somewhat of a buzzword right now, but I've been using it. And then I saw a post that said audacity. I'm like, audacious, audacity. I love it. I love that word. I'm gonna use it for something like a program, you know, Audacious Woman. I can just see it. I have a photo shoot coming up, and like audacity is really kind of just the vibe and aesthetic that I'm going for. So that is my word. It is audacity, and I really want to encourage everyone to step into some audacity because you can be audacious regardless of what you are doing. And I'm just that is the word I'm loving right now. I love it. Ooh, I love it. Thank you so much. Thank you, Jasmine.