Break Your Kettlebell Press Plateau

In this episode, we explore effective strategies to break through pressing plateaus, emphasizing technical adjustments, recovery, and alternative training methods like deadlifts and kettlebell carries. Perfect for lifters in their 40s and beyond, aiming to optimize shoulder health and strength gains.

 key  topics

Press plateau solutions

Technical form adjustments

Recovery and deload strategies

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Kettlebell Training

02:30 Breaking Through Press Plateaus

05:02 Assessing Mobility and Pain

07:41 The Importance of Technique

10:33 Understanding Recovery and Deloading

13:13 Alternative Strength Training Methods

16:07 Post-Activation Potentiation Explained

18:58 Final Thoughts and Encouragement

Download the Bells kettlebell training app from the apple app store here:  https://apps.apple.com/us/app/bells-by-iron-revival/id1554919084

Get Roger Parks’ book Kettlebell Essentials: Ballistics on kindle or paperback here:

https://a.co/d/3JmimHQ

Follow us on instagram https://www.instagram.com/theironrevival/?locale=no

Subscribe to our YouTube: https://youtube.com/@ironrevival?si=zhcY_GxBkz0D3GKw

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to Kettlebell Corner, where strength meets theory, where we take you on a deeper dive into all things kettlebell. I'm Jeremiah Whalen, and that laughing guy is Roger Parks. And in today's episode, we're gonna answer a question we got. And uh first question is Roger, how you doing? Depends. On?

SPEAKER_01 0:23

I haven't decided yet.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

Okay. Well then say that. Don't say it depends. Because you clearly know. Well, whatever it depends on. Hopefully we resolve that today. Um do you want to get into this question? What question? This one. Okay. I've hit a Okay. All right, here it is. We got this question. It says, I've hit a wall with my press, and everyone tells me to just keep adding volume or go heavier. Strange advice. But I'm in my late 40s and grinding through that advice keeps beating up my shoulder. Is there any specific way to break a plas a press plateau that doesn't wreck me in the process? Probably. Probably. There definitely is.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

Um not definitely.

SPEAKER_00 1:10

Okay. There probably is. I mean you you know, I'm living in absolutes right now, Roger. Accept me for who I am.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

Aaron Powell There is such a thing as uh uh captagenetic potential. Maybe there's an anatomical constraint that you just can't clear up. It's not likely, but I'm just you know, don't talk in absolutes.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

So this this captagenetic word you're throwing around.

SPEAKER_01 1:32

You have to clarify what that means for some less educated folks like myself who haven't just meaning there there's there's there is a cap to the ability that you can do genetically. Like maybe you just can't go farther than that.

SPEAKER_00 1:46

I love that. That is we all learned something here today. So if you're listening to this, your cap to genetic possibilities have risen. Did I use that right? No, it's it's not one word.

SPEAKER_01 2:00

Cap to genetic. Three words.

SPEAKER_00 2:03

Oh well, that makes more sense. I thought you I thought it was one word. I was like, what? Well, we made up a word for you, and I'm famous for that.

unknown 2:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 2:14

No, it's three words. Cap to genetic potential. Anyway, moving on. So let's assume that that is not the case. And let's also assume that we can help this person. So let's try.

SPEAKER_00 2:32

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 2:33

First thing we want to do is we do want to look at, excuse me, we want to look at um mobility constraints. We want to look at pain. We want to look at anything that we could do to make that shoulder happier. Sometimes the shoulder is as good as it's gonna get, and a certain amount of volume will make it grouchy. That's just the way it is. There's there's there's no way around that. Um, but sometimes you can, you know, do some mobility work and and get things moving a little bit better, uh, maybe strengthen something. Who knows? There, there are some options there. But that would be the first first thing to do is is honestly assess what is the quality of your shoulders? Because what if more volume or more load is exactly the right way to to move forward, and you can't do that because your shoulders are are torn up. So that that is that's gonna be the first thing you're gonna do. Honest assessment there. Um once we get that out of the way, let's say that the shoulder is fine, you know, it's it's working as well as it's going to, then there are there are really two things that stand out right away. One is whatever you're doing, do something else. Don't continue to do the same thing if it's not working. Clearly, something's off.

SPEAKER_00 3:56

What is that, the definition of insanity, Roger?

SPEAKER_01 3:59

Uh, you know, I I hear I hear that that quote is uh often misattributed to him. Um so I I I don't know. And that hymn is Einstein? Yeah. Uh I don't know whether that's true or not, but I I have heard that, and I don't know what the definition of insanity is. But anyway, clearly we have evidence, right? What you're doing isn't working. Stop doing it, do something else. I think we've done a an episode on this, and there is definitely some value to novel stimulus. Sometimes you you need something a little different. So something's got to change. Now, ideally, the thing should change in line with, excuse me, whatever your limiting factor is. That's that's really what we're talking about here. Uh, we've got to figure out what the limiting factor is, what's getting in your way from, you know, from making progress. And and that's what we want to do. So those are gonna be the the the two things combined. Um, you know, think to yourself, okay, um, is it is it truly a strength deficit, uh, strength deficit? Is it an endurance deficit? You know, are you you you just can't get any stronger? Or if I could, if I had better endurance, could I train longer or better? Um, you know, is it a mobility thing? Is it is it a midsection thing? You know, you and I, you and I worked, for example, with your stance, and it was a technical thing. That that was the thing that made the biggest difference. And there were some other workouts and you know, exercises that we tried that were helpful, but I'd say the thing that that got you the most progress was a slight change to your stance, which is a technical thing. So, you know, the goal is twofold in this case. You want to figure out what the limiting factor is, see, you know, and those are going to be some categories, um, muscular strength, muscular endurance, pain, mobility. Is it uh a technical thing? Do you really understand, you know, could you could you improve your press by gripping the bell better, by cleaning the bell better, by standing in a different way? When when you are doing your press, are you leaning too far to the front, the back, the side, whatever? These are all technical flaws. Is there too big of a pause between your clean and your press? Um, are you not breathing well? So, you know, these are these are some things that you're gonna want to think about. And why we want to think about those things is we want to have whatever novel stimuli you pick, meaning, you know, different different workout focusing on different things. We want to have the new stuff focus on that thing that you need. That would be the the ideal situation. That you with me so far?

SPEAKER_00 6:45

Yeah. And I actually was curious of those things, is there like a hierarchy in which you should choose or just pick one and and go with it? I I do think there is.

SPEAKER_01 6:55

I think that um, you know, the the first, if you if you're gonna go through, you know, uh a a sort of algorithm like we know we talked about with the with the last episode. For me, the the thing that I always go through first is is pain. We've gotta go, we've gotta, we've gotta figure that out. If there's pain or or if things just aren't working, you're gonna get inhibition somewhere. Your body's not gonna work as as well as it should. That unfortunately is is about all we can really say there, because it's such a complex topic that we couldn't do it justice. And this really is not our this really is not our strong suit. That's unless this is not what we do, it's not what we're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 7:32

Just rub some dirt on it.

SPEAKER_01 7:34

Yeah, walk it off. So clear that up. But then after that, I do think that there's a hierarchy, and I think that um we have to get into the the technical first. I think we need to make sure that the lift itself is functioning well because that's where we get into things like balance. So, you know, balance I think is so important for a lift, is it makes the nervous system feel safe or not? And safety is going to be um, you know, often people have the physical strength to do something, but their nervous systems inhibit them somehow because you're it doesn't feel safe. So I would go after the mobility pain stuff or pain, then mobility. And then I would go after the technical stuff first. Make sure those things are solid. Um, because the technical things are usually going to clear up um things that have to do with balance and it may make you feel unsettled. And if your nervous system is is not doesn't feel safe, you're not going to get the same strength output. So that alone is is often enough to um often enough to make you progress. And then and at the same time, when you focus on the physics of the lift, which is really what technique comes down to, it's not just about making yourself more safe or feel more safe. It's about making yourself more efficient. So whatever force that you do, that you are generating, maybe it makes it to the bell in a in a better way, in a more meaningful way, and suddenly you have a lift that goes up, whereas before it didn't. And then after that, you know, you you have some you have some options, you know, physically. Are you uh do you think that your do you think that your problem with your with your training is a lack of endurance, or do you think it's a lack of peak strength? And and then you can start, you know, programming from there. So that those are those are kind of the you know, you you start with the the pain and mobility, you get into the technical stuff, and then you get into the specific muscle adaptation. And then there's one other thing too, but but let's let's not move on from this just yet. Okay. Um does that answer that question? Yeah. Okay. So there is one other thing I think we can we can talk about, and that is recovery. And that that may that may have um an equal input, um, just like technique does. Often what people will do is they're lifting too heavy, or they're lifting with too much volume, or they're they're not adequately recovered. And I know we've done I know we've done episodes on that. Yeah. But the the overall systemic recovery that you require to get stronger, and again, you know, we've talked about this this triangle of things that you need at least to get to get stronger, you need the sufficient stimulus, you need sufficient nutrition, and you need sufficient recovery. Without those three things, you're not going to gain the the size, the strength, whatever it is you want. If you don't have adequate recovery, or if let's say life is getting in the way, maybe you're you're you give yourself plenty of recovery from exercise and you're not overdoing it, but you're just going through a really rough patch personally, you you may be under underrecovered and and that is enough to keep your that is enough to keep you stalled. Um it could be it could be a dietary thing, it could be a sleep thing. So you want to clean, you want to kind of clean those things up the best you can. But another thing that people don't really talk about or use because they don't think they need it is this idea of a deload. Are you familiar with the con you're familiar with the concept?

SPEAKER_00 11:11

But it's like, is it where you've worked to a certain point, obviously, probably like maybe where you're at a plateau, and then you take and reduce sets, reps, and weight and all that stuff, but still continue in sort of your regular training schedule where it's less at that point. Is that basically what we're talking about?

SPEAKER_01 11:30

That that's basically what we're at, but my understanding is that we want to do a D-load before we hit a plateau. Plateau is, you know, from my understanding is we're stuck. We don't want to get stuck. So let's say we're we're doing our press work and you know, we're grinding away, we're feeling pretty good. What people want to keep going and doing is is it because they're greedy, they say, oh, I did this, let me let me go up a bell size, let me add, you know, when you do the math, I've had people, you know, do 500% jumps in one workout. Like, oh, you don't feel good after? Huh. Who knew? Well, so it, you know, people, people do get greedy, but a D load is it's designed to come after a period of work. When you're doing the work, often the end result of that work is you're feeling a little tired. You might feel a little, maybe not quite beat up. Kettlebells are not supposed to do that. But you you feel, you, you don't feel as strong as possible. When when you are exposed to a stimulus, a training stimulus, the the initial response is not going to be in most cases, I'm stronger. It's going to be I'm weaker. You know, if you just think about this with a little through through the lens of common sense, if we are, if you're doing a workout, right? Um, are you gonna go, you know, you're you're a fighter. Are you gonna have a fight after a big workout? Not not ideally. Not ideally. You're weaker, you're tired, you've expended your your physical resources. So we we want to uh we want to keep in mind that while you're doing the work, while you're doing the hard training, you are often below your your peak capacity because your body's trying to adapt to it. So a D load diminishes the amount that you lift, it diminishes the volume, it can work in a few different ways. But what it does is it is it allows the stimulus to continue. It doesn't just drop it off out of nowhere. It allows the stimulus to continue while your body can absorb the progress and you can really start to feel that, oh, I am getting stronger. And this is this is important to, you know, in a sense, consolidate. You know, it's like it's like you've got this this long chaotic meeting, and then you've got this wrap-up that kind of summarizes everything together. It's like, oh, this is what we've been talking about for an hour and a half. So that D load. The the D load is is a lower load, whether it be, you know, the the actual volume, the intensity, the the weight, whatever it is, in order to allow your body to adapt. And sometimes we need things like that because the the work we've done may not have the ability to stick. If we don't have a meaningful D load at some point, then what can happen is we keep pushing, pushing, pushing until we get frustrated or until we overwork. And then the body's just exhausted. So it drops up or something. Exactly. So you don't even have the opportunity to push and say, oh, well, am I really making progress or not? You know, when you go into some kind of uh powerlifting meet or some sort of strength event, you you don't work really, really hard all the way up to the minute you, you, you, you don't want to peak right then and there, but peaking usually comes after a back-off. So you work really, really hard, you you minimize the volume, you minimize the loads. You know, if you're going to a powerlifting meet, why so many people hit a PR at a powerlifting um meet is because you've done all the hard work, you back off a little bit, you don't completely abandon the stimulus because in your body and brain, like, what is this? But you're not doing, you know, uh some people might. And and I'm just trying to illustrate this conceptually. But generally speaking, you're not doing what would be your hardest lift before the meat. You're saving it for the meat. And that period between the work you do and the the taper or the back off is allowing your body to rest a little bit. And then once you go into the meat, that's when all of your strength gains have kind of solidified and you you lift more than you've ever lifted before. So it's it's, you know, there there could be other aspects too. There could be, you know, a social aspect or adrenaline, whatever. But the point is there is there's a very viable mechanism in in in the backing off before the meat because it allows all the hard work to solidify. Now you're stronger than you you were before. And people don't often take that into account in their training. So they focus on, you know, when we look at that one triangle, uh, that triangle idea again, they focus on the stimulus. They don't focus on the recovery or they don't focus on the nutrition. And, you know, that that's something that you want to get set and you want to figure that out rather than just, you know, grinding through, you know, let me take these other factors seriously. And am I, am I programming a D load? And it could be just a, you know, for me, my D loads are I change the type of exercise I do.

unknown 16:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:32

And it's um, and this person, you know, they sit in their 40s. So it's also, you know, you should at this point hopefully realize that you can have some patience with this whole process. And if you are trying to train like you're in your 20s, and even if you're in your 20s and listening to this, yes, you should still have to delo, but the recovery time is going to be greater in your 40s, at least in my experience as a in my 40s. Um it's so common with things like like event focus. You mentioned the powerlifting meet and stuff like that. But if you're just training in general and whatever your goal is, if it's like, I just want to be stronger or what some obligatory goal, you're gonna have to use critical thinking, I guess, at this point then and and and say, I'm going to have to put this in like every four weeks or six weeks or whatever the case may be. I don't know what the interval is, but that's why you hire somebody like us to set that up for you. But with the marathon running and stuff like that, there's or any sort of running race, that's a that's a common occurrence. And people look forward to that because you've worked so hard and you're like, oh, good, I get like a week and a half sort of break before this big event or this powerlifting meet or these sort of things. And it reminds me of the last certification that we did together where I had to do the half body weight press. And I recall calling you from a place, I was at a gym and I pressed a 44 kilo, and we were still two weeks out from this from this the certification. And you're like, you're being a dumbass. You're peaking too soon. I was like, no, I think I got this. I think I got this. And sure enough, of course I got there, and at the time I, you know, I eventually I did do it at the at the event, but not in the the moment when I was wanting to do it.

SPEAKER_01 18:21

And uh, you know, and it was it was a lot harder than than it should have been.

SPEAKER_00 18:25

Oh, way harder because when I did it at the gym following my program, I just ill timed it, obviously. You know, because I think there was naturally in that program, however I designed it, I think there was like a bit of enough of a taper, so to speak, where I was like able to come back at whatever day of that week that was and do it. And it was like no big deal. I was like, oh uh, I've got this now. It is my is my new thing. I should press this every time, as we also know and mentioned in other things. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_01 18:51

And to be clear, that was the real problem. It's you know, every now and then when you're you're doing really well on a program, you might hit you might hit a weight that you weren't expecting to hit. That's not necessarily a bad thing. But then when you get greedy and you treat this as your new max and you start you start going, oh, I should press this every time. That that's that's where the problem comes in.

SPEAKER_00 19:11

Yeah. And then we we did talk about another episode. I think we used the bench press as an example where you're like, oh, now I bench press my new max at 150, you know, for huge weight. Every time that's my every time. So I start at 150 and now I should be at 155 on my second set and this sort of thing, and that just doesn't work out in real life.

SPEAKER_01 19:28

Aaron Powell No, I mean look, well let's it potentially potentially you know moving up in in small increments can, but you have to adjust something else. So let's not let's not you know let's not open that worms. Is 150 really my bench max? I one thing though, I I do want to point out before we before we wrap this up is this idea of a D-oad. You have to earn a D-load with training. I have several clients that I don't use deloads for because life tends to do that naturally. Schedules get busy, holidays come up, kids get sick. There, there's a natural um uh a natural reduction in their training based on life. So, you know, sometimes we need to do that. And I do switch up the stimulus and things like that. But um for people listening to this, don't think, oh, I need a D-Load week. Like, okay, you're already being lazy. You're already doing, you know, 50% of what you should be doing. Don't think you've earned a D-Load week because maybe you haven't. If you're if you're training, if you're following a program, if you're being systematic, if you've been working at it pretty hard for a while, then sure, you've earned earned something. You know, give yourself a week or two of uh at a at a lighter load, um, less stimulus, and then move on to a different type of training. That's totally cool. Um, but some people don't need to do that. And and it really depends on how hard you've been working, and and more importantly, um how consistently you've been working.

SPEAKER_00 20:59

So don't be greedy and don't be lazy. So find that that middle ground, Goldilocks.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

And I think there's one other thing uh for the um the press goal that I do want to talk about, and and I give this advice to people pretty, pretty frequently, especially other coaches. Um, don't be afraid to do something else to express strength that you might be a little better at. You know, the my my go-to move usually is the deadlift. And you know, when you when you get the you know, the functional training people and you get the the sports-specific people, they tell me it's not gonna work. Um, okay, well, it's worked every time I've used it. It worked for me. Worked every time I've suggested it. Strength is is neurological and is systemic. So I I I understand that you are not pushing your arms over your head when you deadlift. And I also understand that you might think that whatever you do needs to look like the thing that. Um you're you're trying to do, but let's just save everyone some time. I'm right and you are wrong. So use an an alternative stimulus when possible. Squatting, deadlifting, stuff where you can, you know, even carries with heavy kettlebells, these things will carry over and they will make you stronger without beating up your shoulders. You know, one one another thing I like to do is um, you know, some people call them cheek cleans, I call them two-hand cleans. I'll do that with a bigger bell. And get, you know, if if I'm trying to, let's say you're trying to press a 40, um, use a 44. You know, get that. Yep. Do do it too, do some two-hand cleans. And and, you know, when you do get to the bell, you you uh you're intending to press, it's gonna feel lighter and you're you're gonna feel comfortable with it. You're gonna you're gonna feel it's not gonna be a shock or a surprise. So don't be afraid to do uh other stimulus. And you know, sometimes people are good if they've got a lot of endurance with their shoulders, which doesn't sound like this is the the case we're talking about. Sometimes bench press is an acceptable um stimulus as well. But for this particular goal, I like using something with the legs and I do like using the deadlift. And why I like using the deadlift is you are increasing the neurological drive. Okay. When you when you lift heavy, you know, a 200-pound deadlift is not a heavy deadlift for an adult male in most cases. So if you're doing a 200-pound deadlift, it's not heavy. However, it's going to be probably twice as heavy as any kettlebell that you're going to try to lift. Oh, 40 for sure, right? So we're we're getting we're getting more neurological stimulus. Um, we're getting more neurological stimulus, but we're not taxing the shoulders directly. You also need to understand how, you know, proper force transmission works. Uh, there's a lot of of linking in the deadlift of of the bar to your body, and that's where your lats are going to come in. And that is something you also need for your press. You need to be solid to connect the upper body to the lower body, um, even though you are pressing with your arm, it's a it's a total body thing.

SPEAKER_00 24:24

Yeah. And and that deadlift thing works at works every time. Well, at least for me, in that when I've experienced it, and we've done it together nearly every time like that. Uh but yeah, it does bring in the that whole body tension and that that that feeling of connectedness that you need. And then so the what we did, and I don't know if this is what you recommend, but let's say you go in, um, we used the trap bar the last time and we put, I don't know, I think 315 on it or something like that. And the goal was pressing the 44 kilo. We did the the 315, and I pressed the 44, and I was like, this feels incredibly light. And it just was like, oh, this is an ease. We gave it a little rest, we did it again, and then I pressed it twice, and it's like, oh my gosh, this is like the greatest pressing day of my life, and I haven't pressed since, just so I don't ruin it. No, I'm just kidding on that.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

But that's that's a specific technique. Um and and I I could be getting this wrong, but I don't think I am. I think the idea there is is something called post-activation potentiation. So that's when we're that these are these are the big words. Oh, yes. It it really is what was the other what was the other one already for?

SPEAKER_00 25:32

Captagenetic. Captogenetic. That's what I'm gonna call this episode.

SPEAKER_01 25:37

But the the uh post-activation potentiation idea is you do you do something heavy that ideally doesn't compete with something else that you're about to do, and your your nervous system takes notice, your muscles fire, you're you're you're ready to go. And in in that case, in that case, um you're you're more ready for this other weight, and it's gonna feel a little bit lighter. And you can do something similar to with uh sometimes you can even do swings rather than a heavy load, you can do, you can move in intent uh with intent or you know, increase the intensity, and that's also helpful sometimes. So that's that's slightly different. I'm talking about using um that is definitely a valid technique, but I'm talking about using a deadlift as a staple in your training. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:26

Oh, okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

Uh like a staple in your training. Like, okay, um maybe maybe if if there's one thing to take from this, if you can, if you can deadlift or you can squat, just try it. Try something new. And let's assume that you know you're you're going to do all the other stuff you need to do, but let's throw a throw a deadlift into your into your program for a while. And then do your pressing sparingly. Don't don't forget it. You know, if that's the goal, then you don't want to completely abandon the stimulus. But drop the drop the volume down, drop the load down temporarily, um, and focus on some other stuff to get strong. That that that that works a lot of the time.

SPEAKER_00 27:07

All right. So with all that, you should be able to press your ass off.

SPEAKER_01 27:12

Right, Roger? You you you should. And and if we get specific, you know, if we get specific examples, you send us a video.

SPEAKER_00 27:19

Yeah. Yeah, send the video, send the questions. As you can see, we'll answer them. And uh this was just one question that we received, and we uh we want to hear from you and help you. So put those in the comments, send them to us via direct message. You know where we're at, the iron revival, everywhere. And uh be sure to download the Bells app where you can get plenty of press workouts, D loads included. Okay. I promise. Anything else, Roger? Nope. All right, cool. Stay strong, everybody, and thanks for listening.