The Travel Agent Guide
The Travel Agent Guide is a podcast created for travel advisors at every stage of their journey.
Each episode shares practical tips, real-world experiences, and honest conversations about building a successful travel advisor business—from client boundaries and workflows to marketing, growth, and sustainability.
Whether you’re new to the industry or looking to refine how you work, this podcast is here to help you work smarter, feel more confident, and grow with intention.
The Travel Agent Guide
Wait… Am I Qualified for This Trip? Travel Advisors Get Real
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In this episode, we dive into the very real experience of imposter syndrome in the travel industry and how self-doubt can show up at every stage of business. From feeling nervous on consultation calls to questioning your expertise when selling destinations you haven’t personally visited, we share honest experiences and practical ways to build confidence.
We talk about the importance of leading client conversations with confidence, being honest about what you do and don’t know, and leaning on trusted industry partners and DMCs to create incredible client experiences. The conversation also explores social media visibility, taking action instead of hiding behind endless training, and learning to recognize the value of your services.
Most importantly, this episode is a reminder that confidence comes through experience, consistency, and showing up — even before you feel fully ready.
00:00:00 - Introduction to Imposter Syndrome Travel
00:00:14 - Understanding Imposter Syndrome
00:00:57 - Personal Experiences with Imposter Syndrome
00:01:41 - Overcoming Zoom Call Anxiety
00:02:26 - Assuming the Zoom
00:03:47 - Handling Client Questions About Experience
00:06:45 - Using Destination Management Companies (DMCs)
00:08:06 - Building Trust with Clients
00:18:10 - Training vs. Networking
00:19:48 - The Value of Action Over Training
00:21:49 - Consultation Preparation Tips
00:22:49 - Confidence in Charging Fees
00:24:04 - Understanding Your Value
00:37:13 - Embracing Mistakes as Learning Opportunities
00:39:51 - Final Thoughts on Action and Confidence
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Welcome to the Travel Agent Guide, the podcast pulling back the curtain and what it really takes to be a travel agent. We're talking real life, the challenges, the wins, the money, the mistakes, and the growth. Whether you've been in the travel industry for years or are new to it, we're in this together and you're exactly where you need to be. All right. Today I'm so excited to talk about this topic. Um, overcoming imposter syndrome in the travel industry. Um, it's something that I hear of often. So I want to dive right in. I actually did a webinar a few weeks ago on this. So I'm excited to loop in Bird and kind of get her thoughts on this as we dive in, right? So the first thing is what imposter syndrome really looks like. Um and what is imposter syndrome? Imposter syndrome, I guess the best way to put it, it really is, you know, a psychological experience where you start to doubt your abilities and you have this immense fear of being exposed as a fraud. I think that's kind of the best way to put it. And naturally, I think coming into any type of job and starting something new, most people are gonna feel this. I'm assuming, Bird, you have felt imposter syndrome over the years.
SPEAKER_01Oh my gosh, how many times have you guys been sitting there and you're about to do a proposal and you're like, I really don't know enough about Madagascar to try to pretend to be the expert here, right? Like I felt it in every time I ever planned a proposal for like the first time I planned in that country. It was always just a little bit of like, why are these people trusting me? You know, like I didn't feel like I was truly the expert. I didn't feel like I was as knowledgeable as I should be. And no matter like the level of research I do, which you know me, like I'm gonna research something for 800 hours because it's my favorite thing to do. Like it, you still just don't feel like you're truly the expert. But at the end of the day, you are. And I think every advisor out there can relate to that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And I think it's good for people to understand that even you and I feel imposter syndrome and it still happens, right? I think we'll kind of dive in about how repetition and action truly changes your mindset with imposture syndrome. Um, but it's crazy. Like I just go back and forth with all the different examples, and I hear most often is how do I get on a consultation call, right? How do I get onto a Zoom call? I've never done a Zoom call live with somebody before. How do you get over that fear of just getting on the call? Um, when you first started coming into, you know, the industry bird, I know Zoom and and video calls are kind of it's you, it's it's who you are in in your business. So how do you get over that initial fear of just getting on that call?
SPEAKER_01My my favorite thing to say is just assume the Zoom. Like I don't ask people, do you want to get on a video call? I say, like, hey, do you have a quick minute to chat more about your trip? And they say, Yeah, I can talk at four. And I say, Great. And then I just send them an invite. I don't ask about it because I don't want them to be fearful either. And like, I think one of the things we all forget is the pandemic did give us a gift. Like it gave us a gift that video calls are now more just like obvious to everybody and it's a lot easier. And like, I mean, my grandma gets on video calls with me now, you know, like that would have never happened pre-pandemic. But the fear of getting in it is because a lot of people will be on a regular phone call and somebody asks them a question and they Google it right then, right? And they they BS their way through the answer. And I think the there's a couple of things that we need to remember as advisors is we don't necessarily have to be the expert on everything. We can say, like, I'm gonna need to look more into this, but I cannot wait to dig into it. Or we can say, like, look, I'm gonna bring in one of my partners at the tourism board, which is the word I use for DMCs, but the clients don't know what a DMC is. I'm gonna bring in one of my partners that specializes that's in country that's gonna talk to us more about this because I want to make sure you're getting the best advice possible, right? Like, it's okay if they call you out on not knowing anything. There's no assumption, we're just humans. We should not know everything in the world.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, they're hiring you to figure out the answer and present the correct answer to them, not to know every location in the world. Um, it's just not possible. I regardless of who you are, I don't care what you say, it's not possible. One of the things I hear very often is, well, what do I do if somebody puts me on the spot and they ask me if I've traveled to this destination? And I think that is, you know, puts a lot of fear in advisors of, okay, this is proving I'm a fraud. I haven't actually been to Italy. How am I gonna sit here and convince somebody that I'm able to, you know, put together their trip? The best advice that I can give is, you know, pivot around it. If somebody comes out and and tells you, I wouldn't lie to them. I wouldn't say, Yeah, I spend my summers in Italy. Don't do that. I think definitely just go into it with a pivot and say, Listen, Italy, I have not been to, unfortunately. It's on my list for hopefully next year, um, this year, and highlight the trip you're going to this year. This year I'm actually doing Germany and spending some time in Bavaria, whatever that looks like, to let them know you're still traveling, but maybe you didn't make it to Italy yet, but that's okay. And tell them, hey, I've booked dozens of trips to Italy and my clients are very happy. And I have partners, you know, on the ground in Italy. So I'm very confident in booking this trip for you. Has somebody put you on the spot with that before?
SPEAKER_01Well, so I was gonna I was gonna add to that because absolutely um I am not a sand and sun person. I think sand is nasty. I'm sorry, everybody. I know half the people probably just shut this podcast off, but it's not for me. So in 2021, when we couldn't go to Europe and we're stuck in the Caribbean, it's the only thing we can sell. Guess what I figured out how to sell? Sand and sun, right? So I have literally planned millions of dollars at this point to St. Lucia, never stepped foot on the island, never really intend to, if I'm gonna be honest. Maybe I'll end up.
SPEAKER_00You have been to St. Lucia. So that just proves out of all this time I've counted on you to help me with St. Lucia, I could have sworn you've been to St. Lucia four times. That is hilarious.
SPEAKER_01I feel like I could draw the entire island on I feel like I know it like the back of my hand, right? Because I loved selling it and I would just continuously dig, dig, dig, dig and learn more about it. So here's what I would want to say about have you been there before? Number one, if you have a solid team before you, like if any of our SAPA travel agents are listening, this is how you respond to that. I have not, but several people on my team have. So I can't wait to ask them about this after and make sure that I've got all the greatest details. Like, lean on the team for that kind of thing because there's no reason. Like for us, we have a we use Teams as our chat system. So you just go into the chat system and say, like, hey, they're looking for this little they're looking for a villa in Tuscany. Can someone point me in the right direction? And I guarantee you're gonna get a ton of answers. So start there with a team if you have a team that you can rely on. If not, I want to go back to the DMC thing for a minute because you can use them a couple of different ways. Like if the client tells you beforehand, we're interested in Sri Lanka, and you're like, girl, I don't have a damn clue what I'm doing in Sri Lanka. Like, you can have a DMC get on a call with you. There's nothing wrong with asking them to do that. And they most of them will absolutely get on a video call. They answer the specifics and you explain to the client, like, look, my job is to know people in every country around the world that can create the best travel experiences for you. But I'm not the best expert when it comes to Sri Lanka specifically. So I asked one of my partners to join me on the call. That's it. You're still the needed because you're the point of contact that you're the connector, right? And you're still excited and learning alongside them, right? And you're connecting them to the right person, you're still involved. Like, I think people hesitate too much about using those tools that are absolutely available to us. They feel like, oh, well, my client's gonna think I don't know, or my client's gonna think like, well, why don't I just work with them directly? You know why? Because their next trip, they're not going back to Sri Lanka, they're gonna go somewhere else and they need you and they need the hand holding. So that's my advice there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it beautifully put. Um, I agree. I think you just lean on the industry as a whole, your partnerships. And I have never had somebody come back to me and say, Oh, well, too bad you, you know, you haven't been to Croatia, but your partners are all there and they haven't booked me. In fact, anyone who's asked me, I've been able to pivot in a way they didn't care and they just knew I was the expert to help them with their trip. So it's all in how you word yourself and how you present yourself. And I think the confidence piece comes down to action, right? So yeah, of course, I've been kind of that uh in the moment not sure of what to say or do, but fake it until you make it. You know what I mean? I think you go out there and you just say what you can and in that moment, but also be real about it, right? Don't lie to your clients, like just pivot in whatever way makes sense. But yeah, with that.
SPEAKER_01I do love that that piece. And I do want to just highlight for a second that don't lie to your clients. Yeah. I am a person that has been guilty of omitting things in the past if they did not reflect positive on me. So it's something that I am actively working on. And I think what I have learned more than anything is like eventually it's going to come out. So you may as well just be like upfront and honest about it because okay, this conversation, you tell them, like, yeah, I summer in Italy. I know all about it, right? And then two years later, they ask something about like, oh, where exactly do you summer? And you've completely forgotten. You've moved on from that conversation and it just kind of exposes you. And they may not call you out. They may be like, no, she definitely told me she summered in Italy, right? And they may not call you out in the moment, but they're not gonna, they're not gonna trust you anymore. And I have to be honest, of the things that we have as travel advisors, trust is the most important, the most valuable asset we can have. So don't break it. Just be honest.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I love that. Exactly. Perfect way to approach it. When I start thinking about imposter syndrome and other ways it kind of shows up in the industry, one of the things I would say, and I know we often tell advisors, like any advisor coming on with Sava, we tell them about week two-ish. It's time to reach out to your network, it's time to post a video on social media and say, Hey, I'm here for it. This is me. I'm a travel advisor now. Go into it with kind of this confidence to do it. And I think imposter syndrome gets in the way of people actually putting themselves out there at the beginning because naturally they're like, I don't know anything. What, like, what if all of a sudden I'm gonna get flooded with a hundred requests, which is not gonna happen, right? But if it dies, if it does happen, like, okay, let's go. And again, lean on your team to help you with what that looks like. But what do you say, Bird, to travel advisors who truly feel like, okay, I'm not ready to make this leap yet. I'm not ready to put myself out there.
SPEAKER_01Okay, so I love the idea of posting a video as soon as you jump into the industry. I'm obsessed with it. I feel very strongly for a couple of different reasons. Number one, like, look at all the algorithms. They post videos way more than posts. So, like, you want the most people to see what you're doing. That's what you need to be doing. So if you're an advisor that's already in this industry, which if you're listening to this podcast, you are, then what you would be doing is still posting those videos. And people say, I don't want to post a video of me, or I don't like the way I look on video, or I don't like the way I sound on video. I have to be honest with you, that's the way you look and sound in real life. And people love you anyway. It's okay, right? Like however you look on video is just that's that's how we look. And we need to be okay with that. But the thing that I want to say about posting for the very first time, most people kind of take a step back and say, like, no, no, no, I don't want to do it, or I'm worried about getting getting a lead that I wasn't prepared for. I think. So uh it's not even if it's a first time, if you're experienced and you're posting a video the first time, I'm worried about getting a lead I don't want or I don't know how to do. I've never once seen a post on any social media travel agent Facebook group where an advisor says, Hey, I have a lead for X and I'm looking for someone in that that's an expert in that area to give this lead to, where you didn't have 500,000 people comment on it, right? At Sava Travel, one of our chat networks is just hot leads and it's for that purpose. So if someone comments and says, I want to go to Japan, and you're like, oh, hell no, I'm way in over my head in Japan. Give it to someone that is the expert. And you can even say, like, I'm gonna give it to you, but I want a hundred dollar referral fee or a $200 referral fee or whatever it is you want, 99% of the time, that's not gonna be a problem for people. So I would say don't let the result, the fear of the unwanted result hold you back. Instead, put yourself out there and hope and ask for the right thing that you want, right? Say, like, I want you to know I'm a travel agent, I specialize specifically in Europe, love doing international trips, reach out, right? Like that's the ask that you want to make.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's perfectly said. You know, with social media, I think a lot of advisors tend to get fearful, right? They see what is going on around them, how other travel agents maybe post daily and are doing all these crazy TikToks and stories, and how can I ever compete with that? And I think you're the one who told me this bird or somebody at Travel Birds, right? Is how we dive into it. Listen, I could go post a story right now, and maybe I get 10 people who watch it. You know what? At the end of the day, it was 10 people more that saw it that didn't see it before you did it, right? And I think that's the reality of it. It takes, you know, consistency in sticking with it and continuing with it before you build, you know.
SPEAKER_01So let's keep playing, let's keep playing on that topic because I think a lot of people are like, Well, I don't know what to post though. Like, what do I post? I think the easiest thing you can do is just go to travelweekly.com and whatever the headline is, talk about that. So this week, and I know this won't post until next week, but this week, Spirit Airlines shut down. Do a 30-second. Hey, there's a reason I don't like booking my clients on budget airlines. There's a lot of risks to be taken. They usually only go to routes once a week. You can see from Spirit Airlines, I'm rebooking, you know, all those people are having to rebook right now, and the prices are way higher. I personally keep all my clients on the main lines. Whatever it is, who cares what you want to say about it? Just pick the topic and say something about it. It's 30 seconds. This isn't, this shouldn't be like a big ask.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, the educational posts like that are, you know, position yourself as the expert. You're not looking for the sales, you're not highlighting a destination, you're really going to your social media with value, whether it's your personal page or your Facebook group, whatever that looks like. I always recommend a Facebook group where you can just keep everything tidy, people know where to go to find all the information about travel, right? Yeah. So I think that obviously social media is always going to be a place where imposter syndrome is pretty high for a lot of people.
SPEAKER_01I'll challenge you on the Facebook group just for a second. Okay. The only reason I'm going to is because if you're especially if you're like kind of newish to the industry, you're going to have the most people that know you on your normal personal channel. So while I don't think a Facebook group's a bad idea, I just wouldn't choose it if it's an either-or in your opinion. So if you're not going to also post to your personal networks, I think people think a lot like, oh, well, I don't want to annoy people with my travel stuff, or I don't want to overwhelm people with my travel stuff. And I if you're thinking that, you just don't understand how the algorithms work. They're not going to allow you to annoy your friends because if your friends aren't engaging with your post, then your post won't show up as often to them. So let's say you post about Croatia three times in a week, the algorithms are going to understand what you're posting about. And if it didn't resonate the first time, the second two don't make it to that friend. So if you're like, oh, I'm going to annoy my network, that's not your job. That's the algorithm's job. You need to post and you're going to have the most people following you on your regular personal channel. So all these people that like, oh, well, I started a new Instagram account for this. Again, I don't think it's bad if you're somebody that's going to post like every single day or multiple times a day. But if you're somebody that's posting once a week about travel, twice a week about travel, even, do that on your personal pages. The algorithms will take care of everything else.
SPEAKER_00Not only that, I mean with personal pages, you can post a story. I can't go to my Facebook group and post stories. I do love having my story go constantly with whatever that information looks like weekly or daily, to be honest. I know some travel advisors have their story going all the time. I know some travel advisors save all their pictures so it looks like they're traveling all the time, but maybe they only did two or three trips a year, right? And I've had people text me, like, where are you going to now? I'm like, I'm home behind my computer working. So there's definitely a way to do it that it just, you know, for your audience, it's you're presenting yourself as a true expert.
SPEAKER_01Um, I will also say I never post while I'm actually traveling. I wait until I get home so I can put some intentionality behind it and put the time. When I'm in Italy, I'm not trying to spend time on Instagram, like that's the last thing I want to be doing while I'm traveling. So you also don't need to feel like, oh, well, I'm on vacation. I don't want to do this. Just take a bunch of pictures and do it later. It doesn't matter. And I always do like day one of my trip. It doesn't mean I'm there right now. No, I will say every now and then, oh, it'll get me because someone will message me and be like, I'm in Rome right now too. Let's meet up. And I'm like, oh, I was in Rome last week. Love you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. No, which is a great point. I mean, I know some advisors who like to do it while traveling. For me, I kind of am once I get home, I'm back to the grind. Then I'll start forgetting. Then weeks go by and I'm like, oh crap, I never got to day four of Ireland, right? And I don't know. So definitely do it however it works for you. But also, I find time to calendar block for social media all the time, a couple times a week. So making sure you're getting out there and just don't feel like a fraud. You have it's your business. You're starting this brand new. It's you have to start somewhere, right? So all right. So a couple other things that I kind of see, bird, is really one is training. I think a lot of advisors dive deep into training themselves on destination trainings, on trainings with suppliers, and they just go down this rabbit hole of hours and hours and hours worth of training, which I kind of I, you know, I think at the beginning to fill up some time gaps, it's great. But I think you should be putting your time more towards like networking and getting out of there versus spending all this time with trainings. What are your thoughts on that?
SPEAKER_01I like to tell people wait to do the training until you have the lead. The time should be spent on getting out of your house and meeting people and putting yourself out there into the world versus now. I think you should do some baseline training. So at Sava Travel, we've got a handful of videos and you know, it teaches you the basics about how to get paid, what commission is, um, the different main vendors that we use and stuff like that. But if it comes to am I gonna spend, so for instance, the Princess Cruise training. I my BDM told me just the other day it is a 26-hour training if you go through all the different levels. Really? If you're yeah, it's like if you're spending that time and you don't have a lead for Princess Cruises, you've lost your mind. Like it's just, I would rather you spending your time out there and doing something to like promote yourself versus getting bogged down. I met an agent one time and and this was 2021, so take it for what it was, because this is early on and there wasn't a lot of opportunity out there, but she was kind of a bit braggadocious about the fact that she had done 118 destination trainings that year. And I couldn't help but be like, and how many trips did you sell? And I I would never call anyone out by name, but let's just say it was not 118 trips to say the least, right? And what she had done was she had used learning, which is very important in this role, but can be used as busy work. She created a space for learning, turned it into busy work, and did the busy work to feel busy and feel productive without actually ever being productive. Had she instead done five of those trainings, but then done a so a bunch of social media posts about this is what I learned on the training about Costa Rica. And then I learned this other fun fact about this training about Croatia, whatever it looks like. Had she done that instead and been more purposeful with her time instead of just feeling busy for the sake of busy. And I think that's what a lot of people do with those vendor trainings.
SPEAKER_00Agreed. I I don't know, myself personally, I'm not gonna retain all the information on 118 destinations. Yeah, it's not gonna be there. It's gonna be me diving in in when I get to proposing and even consultation. Like I'll do a pre um, let's do a little education beforehand. So I go in with some at least knowing logistics and um destinations and cities, right? If I don't do that, that would just be silly. But I'm not gonna do a 24-hour training prior because the reality is it's just not worth my time. I'll spend that 24 hours building clients and getting clients to come in the door. So yeah, I think that's kind of you know, people hide themselves behind in the training to hope that that brings value to their business. But in reality, you're gonna do way better off getting out of your house and talking to people and networking and bringing in the leads before you dive deep into the destinations.
SPEAKER_01I want to go back to the consultation for a second. Yeah. Because you you kind of mentioned like, you know, you feel this imposter syndrome if you don't know the destination very well when you're in the consultation. They will typically give you a destination before you get on the phone call. If not, there's no reason you can't ask for it, right? Like schedule the call first. That's the most important thing. Figure out when you're gonna talk to this person. But once you've done that, be like, can you tell me a little bit about the trip so I can come prepared? And I just take 15 minutes and do the standard Googling, like, when's the best time to travel there? What's the main airports? What do I need to know about? And I'll even go to AI and say, I'm a travel agent, but I've never planned a trip to this. I'm about to have my first consultation about this country. Tell me the main facts that I need to know before I go into it. Oh my gosh, it takes 14 seconds to type that. And then I get everything I need, I digest it, and I jump right into the consultation. So if your imposter syndrome is because you feel like, well, I just don't know. I'm not really the expert. Do what you can to feed yourself the talking points that you need to come across confident. Because there is an aspect of this that is fake it till you make it. And that's fine. You can come across confident until you know the ask from the client. Once you get the ask from the client, you can dive in and do the research that will actually produce a really well-rounded trip. You can't forget that piece. You can't just fake it and then not do the research.
SPEAKER_00Beautifully said. And on your consultation, have the ChatGPT pulled up to the left and your client on the video in front of you and have it there to reference, and you'll be completely fine. I promise you'll be fine. Yeah, I love that. Another thing, too, that I really want to touch on is kind of where imposter syndrome plays a role is in one, charging fees, right? Having that confidence to charge fees to clients. But not only that, having that confidence to not sell a deal trip, right? To not be like, oh, well, I'm going to get you the best deal here. And, you know, I don't know. When I dive into it, I think, okay, you need to have that confidence. You need to know your value going into this, which I think is natural for some people versus others. But typically, what do you how do you see that? Has that affected you at all, Bird? Like in the beginning, did it, or what did it take for you to get out of that?
SPEAKER_01Oh, I still get nervous about fees. Fees are, it just makes me sick to my stomach. So fees, I feel very strongly with, and we coach on a fee should be pitched at the end of the consultation. And the reason for that is simply so you can build trust with a client. Because if you're gonna go in and charge a $300 fee, a $400 fee, a $500 fee, you need to be worth $500. And you can't know that from an email exchange at the end of the day. Um, if all of you are balking at a $500 fee, remember Haley and I mostly do FIT to Europe and there's like 17 bookings per trip, right? We fully customize everything ourselves. So it's a very different experience than yeah, you're probably not charging $500 to book a carnival cruise. Those are different. But if you're doing it, um, you have to build the trust with the client. Through that, that's where that pitching the fee, the confidence is going to come. What I would say is I really love the saying of basically like action breeds confidence. And the idea behind it is just force yourself to do it a few times. And it does start to feel easier. I was joking that I always get so nervous about pitching a fee now. And I think now the reason I do is because it's people I know really well. I've there's random internet lead, give that to me all day. I'll pitch that guy a thousand bucks. But like, you know, best friend that I saw at dinner last night, it feels awkward to be like, hey, Caroline, um, you owe me $300. Like it just feels uncomfortable. Um, so I think that it's something where remind yourself, like, I am a professional, remind yourself that this is what I should be doing. And then the more you do it, the easier, the easier it gets. I mean, that's the same with everything in life, right? The first time you ride a bike, it wasn't easy.
SPEAKER_00Right. I think that comes down to process and you know, another podcast for process and how you start it from, but don't change your process for anyone. And the more you know your process, the more you're gonna stick with that, the more you're gonna build your confidence so it just becomes natural time after time. I think for you know, budget selling, you know, people again get this feeling of fraud or I just want the sale, but maybe I'm not worthy to try to add on $500 worth of commissions on this Caribbean package. I need to go in at it with a lower price to get the sale. Just, you know, my biggest remind to you is how much work you're actually gonna do in this trip, right? It doesn't seem like a lot of work right now, but once you book it, you have no idea how needy that client's gonna be. I just had an advisor tell me that they had a client text them on this Saturday at like 7 a.m. when their trip's traveling in four months to see if they had towels on their cruise ship. True story, true story. So these things will definitely happen. And, you know, pay yourself, right? So I think not being afraid to pay yourself, putting your value out there, you know, evaluating a package that you're selling and making sure the bottom line is there. That comes with confidence and obviously time and repetition, but it's there, right, Bird? Everybody should value it.
SPEAKER_01I want to validate because there are agents out there that say, I'll get you the lowest price no matter what. Send me whatever quote you have and I'm gonna beat it. That is a business model. Yeah. That is a business model. Those people can sell millions, and I'm not trying to belittle that. It is not the business model that makes our industry respected at the end of the day. Hence why I really push hard for my advisors not to lean in that direction. When somebody says, Are you going to get me the cheapest price? My response is very clear to them. My job is not to get you the rock bottom cheapest price ever. If you would like that, you should go to Costco because that is where you're going to get that. My job is to make sure you have the best possible experience within your budget. So I'm going to make sure that you find value in every single hotel stay, every single tour we book, every single transfer. It's going to be the most valuable for what you have. It's why I also ask for a kind of a range in the budget. Look, I'm going to create a trip at the bottom of your range and you can absolutely go with it. But if you have some flexibility, I want to show you where I would spend more money to invest, right? I think a lot of people think from their own pocketbook. Um, so for instance, like I'm I'm never gonna spend 30 grand on a trip. Like I just wouldn't. It's not who I am. It's not where I would put my money. My husband and I are very frugal people. Um, we absolutely could afford to spend 30 grand on a trip. It would not be a worry, but it's just not who I am. But if I sold like I would sell out of my pocketbook, if I sold like I was selling to me, I would never make any money in this industry, right? I book $30,000 trips all the time. And I have to remind myself, like, no, no, it's that is what they are wanting to invest their money in. That is what they're wanting to spend it on. So I need to respect the ask and I need to spend it, right? So again, those are two very different clients because I'm sure the $30,000 trip is not asking for the rock bottom price. But if you do have someone that is, I would say stick to your guns and make sure they understand, just reiterate your value. My value is in the research, my value is finding the best options, my value is finding saving you time and also finding the best possible solution for what you want to experience.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. Right? Highlight all the things you're gonna do for them so they don't have to worry about it anymore. And then they're not gonna question the couple hundred dollar difference, right? I think that's what it comes down to.
SPEAKER_01And don't be scared to let someone go. That like that's don't be scared to fire a client. Don't be scared to encourage them to use Costco. Like, I could care if you're using Costco, we were not gonna be friends anyway. Like, let's be honest. That's not my client.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, these are the clients who are already coming at you with, hey, I have Marriott points, or hey, I want to use my Southwest Sky Miles or whatever they are. And immediately it is, hey, there's not much I can do for you here. You know, go, you know, book through your travel points. There's that. So yeah, I think those are kind of important to highlight. I think with the bigger budget clients, this is another, oh, I get so scared. Like, am I a fraud? I don't know how to sell a $50,000 trip. What do I do? Right. I've seen that happen. Um, I remember my first big budget trip. I think it was 20 grand. This is back in 2020. It was a $20,000 trip. To me, that was like, oh my God, people spend 20 grand on traveling. And I I really couldn't believe it. I was like, all right, so we're doing this. And it's funny because one of the things I think about my early on imposter syndrome. Bird, do you remember when I wouldn't touch Europe? Oh, yes. Yeah, yeah. So this is a true story. I came into the industry, you know, fully, hey, I'm doing Caribbean. Everybody in Boston wants to fly to the Caribbean in the winter. We we hate the winter. And that's truly what I thought my business model was gonna be. And Bird kept saying to me, Well, Haley, when are you gonna like, when are you gonna look at Europe? Like, don't give up a Europe lead. What are you gonna dive in? And I'm like, I don't know Europe. I've never been to Europe. I don't, I don't feel like I'm the right person to sell Europe. Finally, she gave me enough courage. I got a lead, right? And I went in and it was that $20,000 lead. And I'm like, okay, well, this is a lot different than the $4,000 Jamaica lead. And yeah, I went at it. I connected with, you know, destination expert on Italy and Greece, and they helped me build out the trip. And I spent so much time just putting together my consultation, running through a proposal mock with myself a few times. So I felt really good about it. And that was it. I closed the deal. They were in love with it, and it was great. And that to me was like, okay, well, what have I been wasting this last year for? Like, why did I do this? But you truly have to get there to know it, to understand it before it changes. At that point, I started selling Europe almost exclusively, and I still never have been to Europe. Well, I have since, right? But the first couple of years, I never went to Europe. This was the biggest fake it until you make it for me. It's what I did, and it's just how I positioned myself with the confidence, and it worked out good.
SPEAKER_01So well, and I would commend you, I really would, because I think you did a really good job with clients over the years. I mean, Haley was literally selling like one and a half million in travel almost exclusively to Europe for multiple years before she ever made it happen. She has a little kiddo at home. So it was a little, she couldn't just pick up and go run off to Europe for a while. And it was just very interesting because I think anyone on even on our team didn't really understand that about her, about like, no, what she did was she took the time and put in the work and did a shit ton of research. So she felt really confident in Italy before ever going there. So she felt really confident in Greece before ever going there. And I think that's what advisors forget very often. You know, I'm not discounting actually experiencing it yourself. I think that's extremely important. But if you are in a life position where that's not an option for you, I don't think that needs to breed imposter syndrome. I think instead you need to put in the work to create your own confidence. No, no, no. I've I've spent 10 hours on this proposal. Like it's amazing. And I now know everything there is to know about Rome, right? Whatever it is. Like, yeah, you might have to spend more time because you haven't been there, but it's worth the time and effort to do to learn it. So don't let that hold you back. Don't let that get in your head.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I, and the one thing I hear people, I've heard this kind of feedback, the fake it till you make it a few times. Like, I heard another advisor who says, fake it till you make it. Like, why would I do that? That's just not the right thing to do. And I'm like, I think you're misunderstanding the actual phrase of make it, fake it until you make it. It's not pretending to know things that you actually do. It means you're acting with courage before you actually feel confident, right? I think it's fake it till you make it. It's hey, I'm gonna go into this confident. I'm gonna pivot. I'm gonna make it sound good. People are gonna love me versus me just pretending. Um, I don't think faking until you make it's pretending. I I was never once pretending it's what I wanted. I wanted to build my business, I wanted to get to Europe, I wanted to sell these trips. So that was never kind of a question for me. I had to throw that out there because I've I've heard a little feedback on that fake it till you make it phrase before.
SPEAKER_01Beautifully put. I do agree with that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Uh so I kind of have thought about some framework, right? And how to actually overcome imposter syndrome. Some of the framework that I think about is is taking action, right? How action actually creates confidence. So when we think of the proposal, when we think of the consultation and getting on the Zoom call, when we think about sending out a quote, the reality is until you make those changes and you create that action and you're confident with the change, then it's it's going to get you out of that imposter syndrome. It's going to get you to where you need to be to feel really good about it. So get on the consult five, six, eight times and get on that Zoom call. Don't be afraid to. Or, and that's how it's going to change. That's how you're going to feel good about it. Same with the quotes. Add a couple hundred dollars in commission. Sell yourself and your value. See if it changes. If you get five quotes in, then you notice you're not selling it. Something is going on. You need to pivot, but you have to create that action to change it to get better. Another thing is, it's not going to happen overnight, right? You're not going to be able to wake up tomorrow and have all this confidence just radiating off of you and you're good to go. You have to put in the time to make the changes and feel good about it. Is that kind of what you think, Bard, right? Action?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I would say there's two big steps you can take in that action mindset. One of them, I don't want to discount how powerful an affirmation can be. And if it's just every time I sit down at my computer, I say, I'm an agent, I'm a travel advisor that sells over a million dollars a year specifically to Europe. Whatever that affirmation is, there's a real power in saying it out loud. And if saying it out loud feels silly to you and you're not there yet, write it down. Don't type it, write it down. There's a huge connection between the physicality of holding a pen and writing something and it the thought connecting back to your brain. So whatever that affirmation is can actually really help that a lot. And second, I would say invest in yourself. Like coaching is so important. I absolutely will never not have a coach because it surprises me. You would think, like after having a coach, different coaches over the last decade, I should be coached up at this point, right? I should be coached. I should be there. That's just not how it works, right? Because you evolve and you hit a new level. And now the coach, you might need a different coach over the years, but I think it's really important to work with someone. So if you are feeling really stressed about imposter syndrome, you can either take it to a coach or you could take it to a therapist because it could also have to do with other underlying things. But I'm gonna be honest, you can't always do it yourself. You can't just bootstrap this one. And that investment you make in yourself will pay off tenfold. I will tell you, there is not one year that I couldn't point to something one of my coaches said that made me make that much money that I owed them or much, much more usually. There was always a decision I made because of a conversation with them that ended up increasing my net worth at the end of the day. Invest in yourself. It's important.
SPEAKER_00I love that. Yes, we all need to invest ourselves. I coaching was everything for me, it just held me accountable. It gave me that confidence. I had somebody to go back and say, Hey, I'm so nervous for this $20,000 trip. Like, is and you know, after that, after a conversation, I was able to pivot after our call and make it happen. So I agree, coaching is everything in this industry. Get out there and do it. I think another thing a lot of us see often is our new advisors is making mistakes. Don't be afraid to make mistakes. Everybody makes mistakes. I make mistakes all the time. Most mistakes can be fixed. So keep that in mind, right? But that holds a lot of people back from not booking the air or doing these things because they don't want to deal with a mistake if they make it. So again, just do it and see what happens. And you may surprise yourself, right? When it goes smooth, you're gonna come back with this confidence and be ready to rock and say, okay, that wasn't so bad after all. And I made more money. Yay, right?
SPEAKER_01Oh, I love that. Um, shameless plug. Also, have somebody check your trips before it they depart. There, it just makes you feel so much better at the end of the day. And it was a huge reason why we started Sava Travel. I was like, there should be a pre-departure team for every advisor everywhere in the world. Like it shouldn't just be your eyes on something because you are going to make mistakes. Like you can be as scared as you want of it. Doesn't matter, it's gonna happen. So I love that Haley said, don't be scary because you shouldn't. It's going to happen. Um, but create a safety net for yourself. I think it's one of the most important things you can do in this industry.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, perfectly said. I used to be so terrified to book the air. Like, I was like, what if I mess up and spell the name wrong? Then we're screwed and we're gonna lose so much money. And it just you call the airline, you get it fixed. Sometimes there's a fee, right? But I honestly knock on wood, I've never encountered an airline saying, Hey, you owe me $200 for a change fee. If you're like, hey, I'm a travel agent, I screwed up, I need your help, they're usually like, I got you, right? Don't worry about it. For the most part, that's what I've encountered. I'm curious to hear from other advisors what that sounds like.
SPEAKER_01I had it once where she actually tried to change it, would charge me, and I hung up and called back. And the next lady didn't. So there's my solid piece of advice.
SPEAKER_00Oh, that's great advice, Bird. I think with every supplier or anytime you're fixing an issue, I've called three, four, five times until I finally said, okay, I'm done. And that person's like, yeah. And then they're like, really, I just wasted two hours calling back five times, and then you're able to do your job. I I love it. So I agree. I think it always is dependent on the person you're connected with. What are any other thoughts on imposter syndrome at Albert?
SPEAKER_01Or no, honestly, I think we covered it. I really think it's important that you, as a newer advisor, even as a more tenured advisor, understand that only action will cure this. Only by doing something will you start to feel more confident in the thing that needs to get done. So it's something where you just need to wake up every morning. If you've never heard me use the term eat the frog, there's a wonderful book uh with the same title. And the idea behind it is basically whatever is the thing that you don't want to do, do it first thing in the morning. Because if not, you spend all day kind of stressing about it, right? We've all had that thing that we don't want to do. Um, and I love the idea. And I think if you find yourself feeling a bit like an imposter, you want to just kind of rush at that, like lean into that experience. And if you're a person that's like, hell no, Bird, I'm not, I'm turning this off right now, do it for a short period of time. Say, okay, for the month of May, I am going to, every time I feel uncomfortable, I'm gonna lean into it just for this month. And then I'll go back to who I was before, and that's no problem. And test the waters. You don't have to, you know, rip it all off at once. You could dip your toe into trying something that makes you uncomfortable and then see what it takes the space and make sure to take the time and see what it did for you. Be like, oh, okay, that that actually wasn't as bad as I thought. Oh, I like that a lot. Oh, when I'm on a video call, you know what I could see? Their face. Like that was so nice.
SPEAKER_00I could see their facial expressions. It changes everything until you try it. You don't know, right? So get out there and try it, and it could change your entire business. Yes. I love it. One more thing I want to ask. Have you ever heard of bicycle face? Okay, I'm gonna enlighten you. And this is a shout out to um Teresa Chubermuda. She's actually in our Facebook group. So I posted something about imposter syndrome a few weeks ago, and you know, she referenced Rashmasujani. Um, so naturally I went, I'm like, oh, I'm gonna go look this up and dive into it. She gave a speech uh a few years ago at a graduation, kind of describing what bicycle faces, and it's it's linked heavily to imposter syndrome, right? So back a hundred years ago when bicycles became a thing, women would get on these bicycles and go to take off. It was all of a sudden they had this freedom, they could get out and go explore. And men didn't like it. They lived in this very, you know, misogynistic society, and it wasn't what how it should have been, right? So they started telling them, okay, if you go on this bike bicycle and you ride, the wind is gonna make your hair gray, it's gonna deform your face, you're gonna have wrinkles. And the woman started believing it, right? And then that was their way to pull them back from riding on this bike and going and living their life and doing it the way they need to. So I think that mentality is what really truly exists today. It just you know exists a little differently. Women, men, we all become terrified to be seen trying and seen growing and seen failing. And that's what we need to get out of our minds with imposter syndrome. You're scared to fail. So don't be scared to fail. I think it's more scared for the visibility of having people see you fail. And it's just get out there and do it. Who cares? Right. At the end of the day, you have to believe in yourself and not let society tell you, oh, Haley looks like a fool in our Instagram story. Ha ha ha. I don't care. I just sold 1.5 million this year. I'm doing okay, right? So that's I think the mentality that we all need to have. So yeah, that's kind of my final thought on imposter syndrome. I I really enjoyed this episode. I think a lot of advisors will find it useful.
SPEAKER_01I love Teresa and I love bicycle face, and it also makes me like that much more of a feminist because I'm like, come on, like you can't give us bicycles, like Jesus.
SPEAKER_00I know it's when you think about it, it's mind blowing, I'm telling you.
SPEAKER_01Times have changed. Luckily, we are empowered women over here owning our own businesses and doing amazing things in the world. All right. I do want to, before we wrap up, give a gentle shout out. We don't have details, signups are not ready, but I want you to mark it on your calendars because we're very, very excited. Haley and I are gonna be doing a live recording of the podcast as well as an all-day conference. It's going to be not a vendor spiel. Sandals is not gonna tell you about their new resort. This is going to be an agent workshop where we're gonna be really hands-on about working through the marbles in your mouth for all the different things that, you know, pitching fees and all the different things we need to do well to do our job. So I'm really, really excited. I started outlining the content last week. Um, can't wait for that. It is on November 6th and it's gonna be in Charlotte, North Carolina. So mark your calendars Friday, November 6th. It's right before Haley's birthday. So we'll have a big celebration for all of us together. I hope you guys can make it. We will keep it very, very cheap. Because we just watch, we wanna see everybody.
SPEAKER_00We're super excited. It'll be a fun time. Anytime you can get together a large group of travel advisors and talk shop and just support each other, it's a beautiful thing. I I'm really looking forward to it.
SPEAKER_01Especially motivated ones like the ones that listen to this podcast. Like this is such a fun and amazing community. And it's you're gonna learn a ton. It's gonna be a great experience. All right, guys, until next week. Till next week.