222. How Retreat Can Revitalize Your Life with Lora Grabow

In a world full of noise and constant demands, silence can feel uncomfortable—but it’s exactly what we need. 

In this episode of Health Bite, Dr. Adrienne Youdim and therapist Lora Grabow explore how intentional silence and retreat can nourish your mind, body, and soul. Laura shares how silent retreats transformed her relationship with herself and her work—and how creating space for stillness can lead to emotional clarity, deeper self-awareness, and greater fulfillment in life and relationships. 

Who is Lora Grabow?

• Therapist specializing in obesity medicine and weight management
• Expert in helping clients explore their relationship with food and emotional needs
• Advocate for the importance of silence and reflection in personal growth
• Speaker and facilitator of workshops on mindfulness and self-compassion

What You'll Discover in This Episode:

• How silence can serve as a nutrient for your soul and overall well-being
• The connection between emotional hunger and unmet needs
• Practical tips for incorporating intentional silence into your busy life
• The significance of journaling and self-reflection in understanding your emotions
• How to create a personal retreat experience to recharge and reconnect with yourself

Why This Episode Matters:

If constant noise and busyness leave you feeling drained and disconnected, you're not alone. This episode will reveal how intentional silence and retreat can help you recharge, reconnect with yourself, and find the clarity you’ve been craving.

This episode will help you:

• Break free from the overwhelm of constant noise and distractions
• Use silenceand retreat  as a tool to reconnect with yourself and your inner needs
• Create small moments of retreat in your daily life
• Feel more clear, calm, and emotionally aligned

"Retreat is about strategic withdrawal, taking yourself away to be, to listen, to restl." 

– Lora Grabow

Connect with Lora Grabow:

• Website: https://loragrabow.com/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/loragrabow
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bariatric.therapist/ 

Ways that Dr. Adrienne Youdim Can Support You

1. Join the Monthly Free Mind-Body Workshops: Participate in engaging mind-body practices designed to help manage your stress response. Register here.
2. Sign Up for the Newsletter: Stay updated with valuable insights and resources by subscribing to the newsletter. Sign up here.
3. Freebie alert. Register for our monthly free MindBody Workshop and receive a downloadable guide on emotional labeling to help you manage your emotions effectively.

Connect with Dr. Adrienne Youdim

• Website :https://www.dradriennespeaks.com/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dradrienneyoudim/

Transcript

Adrienne Youdim

Welcome back to Health Bite, the podcast where I offer essential nutrients for physical, mental, emotional, and professional health and wellbeing. I'm your host, Dr. Adrienne Udim. I'm a triple board certified internist, obesity medicine, and physician nutrition specialist. And I've learned in working with patients and clients for nearly 20 years that good nutrition is not just about the food that you eat, but all the ways in which we can nourish ourselves. And this week's nutrient is silence. I'm grateful to have with us today, Laura Grabo. She's a therapist specializing in obesity medicine and weight management. And she has a different take on nutrition. Welcome, Laura. It is so good to be here. Thank you for having me. It's such a pleasure to have you. And I always like to speak with like minded guests. And I know that you and I share common experiences as well as common intentions and how we work with our clients and with our patients. in that we recognize that our relationship with food is really a mirror into our relationship with ourselves and that hunger often represents an unmet desire or an unmet need.

Lora Grabow

Absolutely. You really just described the work I do as a therapist, whether that's individually or in groups or in book studies or specialty classes, is helping people dive deeper to use your title of your amazing book, Hungry for More. What is my relationship with food really all about? Because often it's not about fuel and hunger. There's deeper things.

Adrienne Youdim

Right. And sometimes that's hard for people to recognize at the outset, particularly because, you know, particularly if they're having difficulty with weight loss or with their nutrition, you know, in other ways, people really want kind of actionable guidance. So how do you approach your patients in addressing this other realm of hunger?

Lora Grabow

Well, I think by the time, you know, they're, they're in my office, they're realizing something's not working right. And I think we also have, you know, we said they have a hard time recognizing there's this deeper impact. And I think that's on us as the providers in the industry. We haven't given them what I call the missing piece. right? They have been given a lot of information about nutrition, a lot of in nutrition as not like we're talking about it today in your podcast, but nutrition about, you know, protein and fiber and macros and calorie counting. And they've been given a lot of information on movement and strength training and cardio. But who's taught them what I call the head work, the deeper work. if you're really going to have success, and I believe our clients know this when they come, because they'll say, I know it's 90% in my head. And I'll often, you know, point to their head and say, it's 90% up here. But no one's taught them to take time and hold space for that question. Why do I eat? What am I truly hungering for? And yes, I wish we could say, this is how you do it. Step one, step two, step three. But it takes more reflection than that. And you have to go deeper. And I've learned so much as I'm sure you have from your clients through the years. What are they really hungering for? It's not food.

Adrienne Youdim

And to your point, I think it's so important not only to bring about this awareness, but also to reframe this concept of it's in your head. Because I think when when people talk about that or talk about it in that way what they're referring to is a level of like. shame around the psychological component but what we're really speaking about here is that this hunger for something more the hunger for something deeper is a psychological need an unmet need that is hardwired in our neural neurobiology hardwired in our biology and it's totally human to get to a point where you recognize that you're not being nourished the way that you need to be. And if you're not, then a hunger develops, that we can soothe with food, right? Soothe with alcohol or smoking or very acceptable things like people pleasing or overworking, right? But at the end of the day, whether it's societally accepted or not, it is an unmet need that is being addressed in a way that is not nourishing.

Lora Grabow

Right. And I often say to my clients, if if your needs could talk, right, if they could talk to you, they would say, please stop giving me food. Please stop giving me shopping. Right. Please stop giving me perfectionism. That's not what I need. You're you know, you're missing the boat. But it's the default because we're not teaching people how to recognize this. We need more of what we're doing today. Yeah, I love that talking to your hunger.

Adrienne Youdim

So I also you know that I'm very transparent on this podcast. I'm very transparent in my own book hungry for more. And what I often share is just because we do this work doesn't mean that we are immune from this work. We are all human and all experiencing this shared collective. And so you shared with me that you stumbled upon your own hunger. So tell us a little bit about that.

Lora Grabow

Yes, I did. And again, thank you for the opportunity to share personally on a podcast. I'm super excited to do that because as you said, we all have universal hunger needs and I'm an extrovert. People ask me what my hobby is. I will often say people. I'm a people builder. I'm an encourager. I'm a two on the ideogram. I'm a helper. No surprises there. Helping profession. I would often, as once was said to me, really focus on the human doing versus being a human being. B-E-I-N-G, right? Do, do, do. Go, go, go. Drive, drive, drive. And I got to a point about 10 years ago, I think it was a little over 10 years ago, as I was preparing, thinking, there's got to be something more. Like, I'm tired. I feel like I'm running on empty. I'm depleted. And I was introduced to this idea of carving out intentional silence in my life. taking time to unplug, much more than self-care, much more than a bubble bath, that could be part of my intentional silence, but giving myself that nutrient to just be, to just rest, yeah, to just be still. And that is so counter-cultural right now.

Adrienne Youdim

It sure is. you know, I feel like I have to share something with you. And this is so, I just love the serendipity of life sometimes. So, you know, I do a mind body group and actually we're having our third session today. And one of the things that I teach them is, or what we will be doing today is expressive writing prompts called dialogue with a symptom. And I woke up this morning with a headache for like the sixth day in a row. And I've been taking Advil and Tylenol. Anyway, long story short, I'm like, I need to figure out what's going on here. And I dialogued with my headache, which sounds funny, but it does work. And what I came to was, in essence, that I needed silence. And so this morning on my drive to drop off my daughter, I didn't listen to my audio book, which is what I often do. And then on my run this morning, I usually listen to a podcast or I went without earbuds. And it was so uncomfortable at the beginning because I'm like bored and fidgety. And, you know, I wanted to listen to something. But I really needed that silence. And heading back from my run, I realized, wow, this is what I really needed. I just needed to stop filling my head with input and information. And so that's really what you're speaking to. really went all in on this and silenced to the next level. So share that with us.

Lora Grabow

Yeah, so I do, you know, I think we learn from each other, like you just said, you know, everything is serendipitous. And I have you know, a wonderful friend who introduced me this idea, I'd heard her say, yeah, I go on these silent retreats. And she would say things like silent retreat. And I'm like, what are you talking about? Like, what is a silent retreat? And I, you know, I became curious, because I knew I was just hungering to just be, I was hungering for the nutrient silence. you know, today, as you talked about, you dialogued with your symptom, I think you gave space for what I would call your soul to come out and tell you what you really needed, because you took time to hold space for your soul and to listen. And that's what my friend told me and she walked me through a rhythm, if you will, because I think, again, we can call them rhythms, we can call them nutrients, things to make us healthier at all levels of getting away for a silent retreat, that being intentional. And sadly, I think we got the word retreat all wrong. When I, you know, I think of, you know, we go on work retreats. No, I'm not talking about a work retreat. Why are we calling that a work retreat? That's really like, let's get a lot of done in a short amount of time with no interruptions. No, retreat is about strategic withdrawal, taking yourself away to be, to listen, to rest. And so what does this look like? Everyone, cause I was like that too. I said to my friend, what do you mean? Like, and she went with me on the first one, but we practice silence together in different areas of the beautiful condo, if you will. And so it's putting it on your calendar, being intentional, letting people know you're not going to be available. That's a discipline in itself. Realizing that life can go on without Laura Grabo. Everything will be okay. And I often do daytime, just daytime retreats or overnight. And I can talk about that a little bit later, but I'll talk about it overnight one. So really what it is is, you know, we drive up together. Sometimes I'm doing it by myself, but I'll talk about the one I did with a good friend. we drive together up to usually a beautiful condo. I'm from Michigan, right? So something overlooking the beach in like Michigan water is very restorative to me. And we kind of talk about, you know, how are we doing? Like how you listened to your headache today? Like how, how's the state of our souls? What are we carrying? What's, what's heavy in our hearts right now? We share a little bit of how we're hoping to be met, but learning to be open, it may go a completely different direction, right? So breaking out of that rigidity, which was hard for me at first. And we usually when we get there, it's nighttime, because you know, we both worked full days. And so we have a simple dinner together. And we go to bed relatively early. And I think that's a big back to silence. Another s word is we need sleep. And so one of the things I love about giving myself the nutrient of silence, if I'm going to get the best benefit, I need to rest well. So I go to sleep, I don't set an alarm. wake up the next morning, good coffee, right? And my intentional silence starts. And how I do that is first, I will do an exercise called leave it all behind because our minds are going a bazillion ways. And I'm thinking about my kids. I'm thinking about deadlines. I'm thinking about sick parent, right? Like there's so many things going on. And we need to settle that, not judge ourselves for it, be compassionate. And so I will literally write down things I need to leave behind and I put it in an envelope where I can see it throughout the day with the letters on it, leave it behind. Because when my mind goes to it, it's a visual reminder to just gently bring my mind back to being silent and being present.

Adrienne Youdim

And so I have a question. Do you actually, you actually write down the things that are in your head and you put it in the envelope? I do. I love that. Because you're literally, it's a physical representation of getting it out of your head, which is so hard, and putting it aside. I love that.

Lora Grabow

Yes. And once I left it, because it was a friend's condo we were using, and she's like, I didn't open it. I figured it was part of your retreat experience. So I just, do you need it? Or can I throw it away? I'm like, you can throw it away. But yeah, I set it where I can see it throughout the silent retreat. And then after that, I do some, you know, you mentioned tonight, you're doing some journal prompt work, some symptom communication. For me, it's giving myself some space to listen to what is my soul carrying? What are some things, if I sat at the base of the tree of my life, what are some things I'm noticing? Is there a joy I need to celebrate? Is there a loss I need to grieve? Is there an emotion I need to feel? A lot of the work, right, that I do with my clients, this is time for me to do it with myself. Our emotions are messengers, they're signposts to what we need. And I really practice at, and I'm journaling a lot of this, and no right or wrong, it's free form. I'm often doing it in circles around a little tree, if you will, that I wrote in my journal, and kind of just paying attention to that. And working on being with it instead of fixing it. It's hard to explain. And resting in it. And for me, it's a very spiritual act in this journaling exercise, as I will ask myself, what does it look like to bring God into this? And that I'm not all in control. I will then find, I'll be honest, Dr. Eugene, I get tired again. I'm still sleepy. And I used to get mad at myself, but by the time I get myself extricated from the world, I'm exhausted. And I've learned that it's okay to go take another nap. that we need that nutrient as well. And so I've learned to do that without guilt. Then I want to cruise through this for the sake of time. And so then it's probably around lunchtime, again, a real simple lunch. We bring prepped food so we don't have to spend a lot of time. And by the way, my friend, she's in another room in the condo, you know, doing her thing. We don't meet up again.

Adrienne Youdim

And you're not talking to each other. It's silence.

Lora Grabow

Yeah, it's silence. And, um, The afternoon, I always incorporate movement. I think movement needs to be done in silence. What you did this morning, right? And it is uncomfortable at first, right? We're always listening to a podcast or getting that phone call in or returning that email. No, I like to take a mindful walk. I think nature needs to be part of our silence. And that's why I pick pretty places to go, like the beach and Great Lakes and hikes in beautiful Northern Michigan, because part of silence for me is experiencing awe and experiencing how small I am, if you will, in this beautiful created world. And I'm okay. Like if the trees are doing okay, I'm okay. Like we are all part of this. And I wish I could have that experience, you know, every day where we hike in these beautiful places, but we don't, but I can take it back to me. it nourishes my soul. So I do some movement. And then I come back and I do some more intentional exercises of different books I've read, almost look at the sources of my exhaustion, being able to name it. And again, not being judgmental, trying to practice those mindfulness skills of showing up without judgment, right, being compassionate. You know, what are the sources of my exhaustion? What can I do about it? And, and I'll be honest, it's often the same themes. It's often the same things too busy trying to do much, you know, do so much of my own strength. Go, go, go do do do too much social media on the news. Oh, just one more email just right in that silence allows me to sit back and say, okay, how is this working for you or Yeah, I think it's

Adrienne Youdim

it's so important, you know, you use these terms, like soul and, and God and, and, you know, sometimes we wonder if that resonates with everyone. And also, you know, the even just the concept of like, retreating in silence, like, does that resonate with the busy mother or the busy professional? And You know, what I would say is that, first of all, to speak to that, there are plenty of successful people out there that live by this. Like, you know, like Steve Jobs would take time off on his own, or a sabbatical, or why am I forgetting the name of Microsoft? I don't know. Thank you. But he's known for taking sabbaticals twice a year. Arianna Huffington talks about it. So all these highly professional people have realized that they need this kind of time for not just for rejuvenation, but also for inspiration, which ultimately leads to better productivity. Renee Brown does it each summer now. Right, right. The whole staff do a summer sabbatical. I didn't know that. That's incredible. But you know, it's it speaks to this notion that I always bring up, which is what's good for your body. And what's good for your mind is also good for your relationships and for your success in the workplace.

Lora Grabow

Right? Because I often say, so people ask me, well, how are you different? What are you noticing? Because you are giving yourself the nutrient silence. What I notice is when I reenter, if you will, reentry can be tough after a silent retreat, by the way, it's a little bumpy sometimes. But nothing in my world has changed. But I have changed. I'm filled up. I have greater capacity. because I've taken time to be and to rest. And that then does increase my productivity at work. It improves my marriage. It improves my parenting, right? I am better because I take time away.

Adrienne Youdim

So I have to ask you this question because I can imagine for a lot of people that this just sounds like pure torture. I remember several years ago I had a patient who, this is many years ago, who was the first one to even ever talk to me about a silent retreat. He would go away every year for three days in silence. I had never even heard that such a thing existed and to me it sounded like sheer torture.

Lora Grabow

So yes, when I friend first told me like, Are you kidding me? I'm the extrovert. I'm always talking. I'm always filling up space with words. I'm just supposed to be quiet.

Adrienne Youdim

So speak to that. Like, was it hard? And how did you manage the hardness? And what would you say to the person who, you know, would start and in the first hour say, this is for the birds. Like, I want to be with my kids. I want, like, I don't like being in silence. This is not me. What do you say to that?

Lora Grabow

I would say completely normal, right? It's a new skill. It's a new nutrient we're adding. It's going to feel uncomfortable. I would say be kind to yourself. Don't judge yourself. There's very different ways to do it. So you mentioned I'm not the only one doing silent retreat. So that first one I did, my good friend had given me like a structure, like a silent retreat book, not a book, oh gosh, what would I call it? Like a step, some guided, some guided structure. Yeah, to like, okay, read this and then reflect on it and then write this down. And, you know, that was really helpful. You know, when I was preparing for this podcast, I'm like, wow, I have come a long way. It's been 10 plus years of using this discipline. There are retreat centers where they have the day set up for you, right? There's some times as large groups. I've done those before and they're, teaching you different things or maybe something like your class and then you go and practice that and you take a walk in the woods and reflect and then you come back and there's, you know, silent retreat directors or sometimes called spiritual directors. I've never done it but you can meet with them and they can help you walk through it. There's all different ways but you don't have to start with a whole day. Start with 10 minutes of silence in the morning. Right? When I was a, when I was, I don't, I wouldn't officially call it a silent retreat, but I knew the importance of having time to myself. When I was a young mom with two littles, I would hire a babysitter every other Friday, because we didn't have family in our town, to just go sit at a bookshop for three hours. That's it. right? Because I needed that time. And so I'm, you know, I'm empty nester now and I own my own business so I can make my own schedule and carve out time for retreat, but everyone's going to be at different and, you know, um, stick with it until you start realizing, oh, there is benefits and oh, the world did survive without me checking Instagram.

Adrienne Youdim

And I think you spoke to this already, but what would you say that you really, have learned over the years in doing this? Like what have you gained? So kind of giving people some motivation to getting through maybe what invariably is going to feel uncomfortable at first because again, we are doing beings and we're busy and so it is Especially these days, right, with the fact that we're inundated with so much in terms of, you know, the people who need from us our workplaces and being 24-7 on thanks to technology. What is your incentive? And what did you learn? And how did you change?

Lora Grabow

Yeah, that's a lot, but no, I love it because there has to be incentive. Like why would I really want to do this? Because it makes you a better you and that sounds so generic, but okay, let's look at my profession, right? Let's go back to, I said, I'm a helper, right? I need to practice that myself. We often talk about put on your own oxygen mask. Well, what does that mean? It helps give me oxygen, right? It's like, it's more than that bubble bath. It's more than a walk is part of it or just a walk. It really is, if you will, if I could give you another word, it gives me soul care, right? We know how to take care of ourselves physically, mentally, emotionally, but I think there's a deeper part of us. Are we tending to our own soul? And so it's helped me prevent burnout. It's increased my productivity. We're doing a personal podcast. I struggle with some chronic health problems. I have Crohn's disease. I have some cardiac issues, and I've had them from a young age. It improves my physical health because I take time for silence and rest. As much as I've wanted to fight that, there's a big component to that that I hear from my treatment team. So it helps me physically, emotionally, mentally,

Adrienne Youdim

And then of course, spiritually, I like that you mentioned soul care as opposed to self care, because I think self care, we do think of bubble baths and manicures and, or, you know, golf. And that's great. I mean, I get a manicure every two weeks, but the, and I love it, but that's different than soul care and, and whether you call it the soul or. your intuition or your inner wisdom or your internal knowing, right? There is this thing inside of us that is a North Star or a source that guides us, that knows what's best for us. But when we don't take the time to dial in, then we can feel kind of discombobulated. And so I think what you're offering is an opportunity to slow down enough, quiet down enough to access that place. And I think it's important to reiterate that that is uncomfortable, but that doesn't mean that it's not right. Soul care, as opposed to self care, doesn't always feel giggly and bubbly. Sometimes it's uncomfortable, but that doesn't mean that it's not necessary.

Lora Grabow

Absolutely. look what happened to you today. Like you dialed in, you listened, and you realized, oh, I need silence. It was coming out in a physical symptom, your headache, right? But then when you got to the true need, and many times it wasn't uncomfortable. I mean, yeah, many times it wasn't comfortable, After my mom died in 2017, she had cancer. She was 67. So, I mean, we never want to say goodbye to your moms, but my moms, but that was hard. And I found when I would go away on retreat, it was time to do some more grieving. And I would almost get mad sometimes, Dr. Udine. I'm like, are you kidding me? There's another layer here. But I needed to carve that time out to listen to my emotions and journal about my tears and be present with them. That is certainly uncomfortable, but the only way to heal is to feel. And that rhythm of silence gave me what I needed at that time in my journey, you know.

Adrienne Youdim

You know, I heard somewhere that grief is the ultimate form of or allowing ourselves to experience grief is the ultimate form of self compassion. And, you know, I also have done so much of this kind of work with my clients or with my patients. And I always joke, I'm I'm an untrained therapist, which is so dangerous. That's why I love your work. I read your book, I said, are you sure you're not a therapist? I think my inner child is, or I was in a past life. Yes, yes. But in terms of, you know, taking the time to slow down, to dial in, to experience that grief. And I had an opportunity, unfortunately, to do that recently. But what I want to say is that I really felt that in experiencing that grief, it was the ultimate form of self-compassion because it is just so raw and brutal and painful. that you can't help but have compassion for yourself. And I think self-compassion is something that is so difficult for us. It sounds, there's somebody who calls it, I always forget his name, even though I reference him all the time, but he's the, Dan Harris. Dan Harris does the, right? The Happier Podcast, it's now called the Happier Podcast. or 10% happier. He always says self-care is Pollyannish and I think people often think of it that way. But we know now the science shows that it's so critical for habit change and for productivity and all those mental health, all those things. But it is so difficult to do because it does feel kind of icky and Pollyannish. But one thing I learned about grief is that you can't help but have compassion for yourself because it is just so very painful. And when I think when people give themselves the opportunity to feel that there really is this important self-compassion, self-love that comes out of it, that is so necessary in then showing up as a parent or as a leader, whether it's a leader in your workplace or in your community or in your household. We have to have compassion for ourselves in order to have compassion for the people around us. and you know I say this all the time in my groups but I do think that this is what the world is calling of us right now especially right now when when things feel so kind of convoluted and divisive the world is asking us to have more compassion for each other and we cannot do that until we have compassion for ourselves

Lora Grabow

I agree with you 100%, and that's so much of the work I do with my clients, too, is the journey of self-compassion. And again, it's a brand new skill. How did they know what they didn't know? It's, you know, I always motivated myself by shame. Society motivated me by shame. And when you introduce self-compassion, they're like, oh, that's really just letting myself off the hook. That's just really, you know, just being too easy. But like you said, the research shows, it actually improves, right, our behavior change and the things we're trying to change. And being present with ourself and our grief, uncomfortable, like you said, but extremely self compassionate.

Adrienne Youdim

Yeah. So I wonder, this has been a lovely conversation. I wonder what kind of nourishing bites you would like to leave our listeners with? Is there something that is still top of mind that we haven't had the opportunity to share?

Lora Grabow

Well, if you're okay with it, I would love just to read a little story about the keeper of the stream. And we could close there. Are you okay with that? Absolutely. Okay. So it is in a book called soul keeping caring for the most important part of you. And it goes like this. There once was a town high in the Alps that straddled the banks of a beautiful stream. The stream was fed by springs that were old as the earth and deep as the sea. The water was clear like crystal. Children laughed and played beside it. Swans and geese swam on it. You could see the rocks and the sand and the rainbow trout that swarmed at the bottom of the stream. High in the hills, far beyond anyone's sight, lived an old man who served as the keeper of the stream. He had been hired a long time ago, and no one could remember a time when he wasn't there. He would travel from one spring to another in the hills, removing branches or fallen leaves or debris that might pollute the water, but his work was unseen. One year the town council decided they had better things to do with their money. No one supervised the old man anyway. They had roads to repair and taxes to collect and services to offer and giving money to some unseen stream cleaner had become a luxury that no one could afford. So the old man left his post. High in the mountains the springs went unintended, untended. Twigs and branches and worse muddled the liquid flow. Mud and silt compacted the creek bed. Farm waste turned parts of the stream into stagnant bogs. For a time, no one in the village noticed. But after a while, the water was not the same. It started to look brackish. The swans flew away to live elsewhere. The water no longer had a crisp scent that drew children to play by it. Some people in the town began to grow ill. all noticed the loss of sparkling beauty that used to flow between the banks of the streams that fed the town. The life of the village depended on the stream, and the life of the stream depended on the keeper. The city council reconvened, the money was found, the old man was rehired. After yet another time, the springs were clean, the stream was pure, children played again on its banks. Illness was replaced by health. The swans came home and the village came back to life. The life of a village depended on the health of the stream. The stream is your soul, and you are the keeper.

Adrienne Youdim

Thank you for sharing that. Goosebumps. I loved it.

Lora Grabow

 I love it, too, is one of those first things I read when I started this rhythm of hungering for silence and feeling that hunger in healthy ways.

Adrienne Youdim

Yeah, we'll be sure to put that the information to that book in the show notes. And along those lines, Laura, if people want to connect with you and hear more about what you do, how can we find you?

Lora Grabow

Yeah. And you know, all the socials, my handle on Instagram is at bariatric.therapist. I'm just my name, Laura Grabo on Facebook, Laura Grabo LMSW is my professional for those that still do Facebook. And I have a wonderful website, just lauragrabo.com. Head on over, get to know me a little bit. All the podcasts I've been on are there. You can contact me through the website. I would love to stay in touch and be part of your community.

Adrienne Youdim

Wonderful. We'll make sure that we put all that information there. And this was just such a lovely conversation. Thank you so much for joining me. Thank you so much for having me. I've been looking forward to it. I know it's been a long time in coming. And thank you so much to all of our listeners. If you loved this episode, please share it. And don't forget to rate and review. It just helps us to share this message and to grow our community. And so I look forward to seeing you all again next week on Health Bite.

Lora Grabow

Bye-bye.