The Anthony Amen Show

From Statins To Squats: Rethinking Everyday Medicine

• Anthony Amen • Season 5 • Episode 40

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A brutal chest tear, a fast recovery, and a bigger question: what happens when fitness, nutrition, and medicine actually work together? In this episode of The Anthony Amen Show (formerly Health & Fitness Redefined), Anthony breaks down his own post-op journey—how early movement, protein, creatine, collagen, and fish oil dramatically reduced pain and accelerated healing. Then we zoom out with Dr. Anderson, a family physician who believes the best care blends evidence-based medicine with lifestyle habits that actually stick.

We get candid about the realities of modern healthcare. Many clinics still default to statins; insurance restrictions rush appointments; and most doctors receive almost no training in nutrition or movement. Dr. Anderson explains what a real partnership looks like—where “no” isn’t the end of a visit but the beginning of a plan. We map out supplement strategies that actually move the needle—from omega-3s to collagen to protein intake for women 40+—and why movement, not bedrest, is the engine of recovery.

Then we tackle the surge in GLP-1 medications like Ozempic and Wegovy. Where can they help? When do they fall short? It often comes down to habits. These meds can flip hunger cues, but long-term success still relies on protein-forward eating, resistance training, and sleep—the same foundational principles we coach every day at Redefine Fitness in Stony Brook and Mount Sinai, NY. We challenge outdated measures like BMI, discuss better metrics for real health, and highlight new research showing how training the non-injured limb can speed healing on the injured side through neurological cross-education.

We also shine a light on the divide between rural care deserts and urban abundance, why healthcare needs more lifestyle medicine now, and how clients can get better outcomes when doctors and coaches work with each other instead of in silos. If you’re tired of extremes—pill-only fixes or wellness-only promises—this conversation shows the productive middle where real success lives.

Hit play to learn how to partner with your doctor, choose supplements wisely, train through setbacks, and protect your long-term health with strategies that last. If this resonated, subscribe, share with a friend, and leave a review. Your support helps more people discover why fitness is medicine—and how Redefine Fitness helps people recover smarter and live stronger every day.

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Learn More at: www.Redefine-Fitness.com

SPEAKER_00:

This is Health and Fitness Redefined, brought to you by Redefined Fitness. Hello and welcome to Health and Fitness Redefined. I'm your host, Anthony Man, and today we've got another great episode for all of you. Before we introduce our amazing guest, Dr. Anderson, some life update news for everybody. For those that may or may not know, like a couple weeks ago I made a post about it, but I totally ripped my chest in half. So then going through that, just a constant reminder for me that one, eagle lifting, when people tell you not to do something, you probably shouldn't do that. When someone says, Yeah, you shouldn't do that, I go, What's the worst that happens? Um, two, I think life just has a way of coming back at me and then reinforcing lessons that I already know. And um how 15 days post-op is of the day of this recording and the fact that I took pain medicine one day and then Tylenol only till four days after. And I learned a lot through these last 16 days, and it's a good reinforcement of why fitness is medicine and why it can help people recover faster. And we'll probably jump into this in the show, but I think it's important. Really cool and not surprising. I was in a lot of pain, obviously, post op. Day five, I was like, you know what? Let me go work out. And I went to my gym, obviously, in a sling, and I started just doing legs like I normally would. Obviously, I didn't put any pressure on my chest, and I just said mostly machines. But about like 10-15 minutes in, the most miraculous thing happened. All the blood that was pulled up in my chest, causing like an immense pain pulled out. And after that workout was when I dropped even taking Tylenol. It was like just a reminder, like how much your body is designed to heal in motion. We're not designed to heal laying down in bed. We're designed, we're gonna heal and do better as we keep going, moving on in the world. And sleeping is ideal for just sleeping, and that's it. So pretty cool. Without further ado, though, let's welcome Dr. Anderson on the show. It's a pleasure to have you on today.

SPEAKER_02:

Hey, I'm so excited to be here and glad that you're doing well. Great to see you today. And I love that intro, just the you beginning to talk about how much fitness really is medicine. And I love this idea. And I talk to my patients all the time about you know, it's it's hard to heal laying down, right? And it's hard to get over a lot of things laying down. And so I'm super excited to be here with you today. Anthony, excited, just chat about health in general and the role that you know fitness and nutrition and all these things play in our health. So thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, absolutely. And it's just kind of miraculous to me on a standpoint, is right when I get like, okay, I've talked about the same things over and over again about 400 times. It's okay, I went through it now again and I'm going through a healing process, and I'm watching myself recover way faster than most people ever, because it was a it was not just a little minor tear. The doctor that did this surgery said, and I quote, I have never seen anyone tear their muscle like this before. It was huge. Wow.

SPEAKER_03:

Wow, that's that's impressive, and not always in a good way.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, exactly. But the fact I'm here, like I'm doing a show with you, I've done multiple workouts at this point. Uh, I'm really getting range of motion back in my shoulder. It's a testament to everything. One thing I did, which I want to hop right into with you because I know you say to listen to that episode, was I looked right at supplements first. I said, what's something I can enact right now? Right with the day I tore my chest, right? I went, got a checked out, got an MRI, and then went back to work because I'm a psychopath. It's crazy. But then like eventually, when I knew like I needed like surgery, it's okay. How can I give myself the best odds of getting surgery? Because surgery was gonna be for like another 12 days after the accident. So I immediately hopped on creatine, like I've been doing. I've been taking 10 grams of that a day because I knew that would help. I needed to keep my muscle fibers intact for surgery so they didn't start dying on me. I doubled my protein goal, I started taking collagen, I started enacting uh really heavy multivitamin that was a good one, not heavily involved in like calcium carbonate, like we talked about. Yeah, and I I didn't have any bleeding, so I hopped in taking fish oils just to get an immense amount of omega-3s in my diet. But like those things set me up for success. And then when I had the surgery, the doctor said all my tendons were so intact, it was super easy just to stitch the muscle to muscle and then take the other part and anchor it right into my bone. So pretty interesting. So, what are your thoughts on overall that episode we did on supplements? And do you have any specific recommendations as being a family medicine doctor that you would like to see most people on?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, absolutely. And so that was such a great episode. We were talking about a little bit before we started today. I'm in family medicine, I will do everything but deliver a baby at this point, and so I see the full range of medicine in practice. That's from kids all the way to adults. And one of the more common things that I'm asked through the day is about supplements. And so many times, Anthony, it said, Oh, I saw this on TikTok or, you know, I saw this on Facebook or social media otherwise. And is this okay to take? And while the easy answer, and even sometimes maybe the cop-out, is, you know, well, most of these things or all of these things haven't been, you know, FDA approved or reviewed. And it's hard for me as a physician to give you a yes or no on these. I will admit that early in my practice, that is absolutely the answer that I gave so many people. But we have to change as physicians, we have to start then looking at that research, both anecdotally figuring out what works for our patients, what doesn't work. And so to answer your question of you know, recommendations that I give, one is I take everything that patients tell me they bring in, you know, a bottle or will pull up something on their phone and show me about it. I take that time and sit down and look at it with them and actually have the discussion with them. And I think that's the first part, and the first part that's so important. But to answer your question of what recommendations I give, I love that you just said a good daily multivitamin. I think there's no substitute. We in general, just as people in this country these days, eat so much junk, right? We eat so much junk a lot of times because it's cheap or because it's fast, you know, we lead these really busy lives, and it's just like what can we get? And we're not getting so much of the vitamins that we actually need. We're not getting it, you know, nutritionally from what we're eating. And so I think having just a really good daily multivitamin is so good. I love omega-3 fatty acids and fish oils, especially as we start thinking about heart health, those preventive medicine, which is so much of what I practice, and making sure that patients, you know, especially as we age, as we get into our you know, 30s, 40s, 50s, and beyond, are getting those supplements in in the form of omega-3 fatty acids, fish oil. It's one thing to tell everyone to you know eat the seafood components that give you so much of these, but it's a whole other thing if you can just find reasonable, kind of good quality multivitamins and vitamin and supplements otherwise to be able to take in. When you said doubling your protein, it felt good to my heart because that's so much of it, too, right? We think about that protein intake and and how protein does such a good job, even of just helping keep us full through the day. You get an adequate amount of protein, you're not putting trash in your mouth through the day, otherwise, because you've got that good protein which your body needs, which is so good for you know muscle mass, especially after a muscle injury like you had, um, and in in women as we age and we start to lose muscle mass and in men as well. And so I think those you hit big ones multivitamin, omega-3, fatty acids, fish oil, and then um making sure we're getting adequate protein is so important and things that we can find healthy supplements that are good for that.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, I I couldn't agree more, and I'm really glad it came on the show because I I talk a lot. I mean, I've done 300 episodes of recommendations, and I always come back to the same kind of processy. And I want you, based upon your experience being a doctor, to walk us through specific things. Because like I I mentioned previously, and for those that listen, like oh family's physicians, and I try to have these conversations with them, and it's tough. So as a physician, right? Why do you think it's the case that a lot of doctors still turn to things like as an example cholesterol, like to statins, as opposed to finding healthier alternative routes for that patient? And why do you think they do it? And then how do you think we can create the conversation to change it? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

All right, so I'm gonna start with this. I love a statin. All right, I'm not mad at a statin. I don't think that statins are the worst things out there. I'm not mad at a statin. I I think that the the studies are there that show that the statins work, but we also anecdotally see that some patients just don't do well with them, or some patients are just hard set against they're not gonna take them. And as physicians, and one of the heart, and there you go, and that is okay. And I think when when we establish that with our patients, or when I establish that with my patients, it opens up so many other things. It opens up the opportunity for us to then sit down across from each other and start having a real conversation about what I will or won't put in my body, what I do or don't feel good about, and what are my other options, right? And so um I have gotten away. I I am at a space in my own private practice where you know there's not the I have more autonomy, I have more freedom, more flexibility, kind of do things the way I feel comfortable doing. And one of the reasons that I went into private practice was to really allow me to be able to um to work that relationship with my patients, to be able to spend more time with them, develop a good rapport with them. Where when I say, you know what, looking at you know the data that's out there, we need to think about a statin and and them to understand that I either, you know, am that I'm always gonna give the recommendation of what I feel like is best for them, but I'm also always gonna listen to what they do want and don't want. And we've got to be able to say, all right, if you don't want to do this as a patient, I told you kind of where I feel about it, you have the right to say yes or no to it. Let's figure out the other things that are out there. Statins are not the end-all, be-all, they're not the only options. We can change our diet, we can change our exercise, we can, you know, look at other supplements that are out there as an option. At the end of the day, what I don't want is my patient to have a heart attack or stroke or, you know, have other heart disease that I can't do anything about. And I think that it's tough for me as a physician then to be in front of a patient, and we're using the statins as the example, in front of a patient who, you know, I've I've been seeing them as a family doc. I see their spouse, I see their sister, their brother, their kid, their grandma. And for me to hear them say, I don't want to take this medicine, and I say, okay, well, you got to go somewhere else. Like, we don't get along here. This isn't gonna work. And so um, it's it's meeting patients where they are and realizing that there's more than one way to skin a cat and that we can figure out something that gives us good compromise. And then we track numbers, right? And sometimes what happens is we track numbers and uh you know we say, all right, I'm gonna try the supplement or I'm gonna do this instead. And we come back and we have actual, you know, objective data in front of us. And more times than not, we say, you know what? Good call. Keep doing what you're doing, keep making those changes. Um, and then sometimes though we say, All right, Dr. Anderson, I gave it a try. Maybe I will. If you can, you know, find something that won't give me side effects that I don't love, that kind of thing, then we um push on there. But I I just I think there are a lot of things that we're rigid in, and some things that we should be rigid in, and some things that I'm absolutely rigid in in my practice because of my training, but there are also other things that we say, you know what, let's see if there's another way that you're comfortable with, and we find something that's a good solution that we both feel good about. And I think too that when patients, when you give them that kind of um freedom to help make some of their own decisions, then you see the folks who say, I really don't want this statin. Then all of a sudden they're in the gym more often, they're eating better, they start doing the other things, which if we all did in the first place, we'd probably be in a better space.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, my point wasn't uh, and I probably should have reworded the question better, to those that push back on it. I would say if you had 10 patients come in in the door, three of them would say, like, give a little pushback for it. The other seven, so the majority, just wouldn't it's not it's a not knowing that there's other options. And that's more what I'm referring to. And I know I I know private practice is way different. So you have the blessing of really getting to know your patients. Whereas those that work for a major corporation, they have a hundred patients, 10 minutes to see them, and they're just walking and writing a script and leaving, as opposed to asking even the person, like, hey, do you exercise? Do you eat better? Like, have you thought of those alternatives? So it really comes down to because I know you said you wanted to change like legislation and really push everything going on in Alabama to help people get healthier. It's how do we create those conversations inside this world that exists for the general population that doesn't understand like there's other alternatives we can start with first before it comes straight to medicine.

SPEAKER_02:

I think you're so right. I was on a um, you know, we talk so much about genetics, and I'll have patients come in and they say, Oh, you know, um, you know, Dr. Anderson, I have this, it's just it's just genetics. There's nothing that that I can do about it. And I say, you know, genetics are are real. We give that its space. But I was recording one of a podcast of my own with a guest yesterday who does lifestyle medicine, which is kind of this new arm of medicine, um, which I think is great because you're right, they don't look first to medications, they look at lifestyle changes we can make. And she said something that I thought was so great. She's Anthony, she said, most people will say that things run in their family, but the real issue is that their family doesn't run. And I was like, oh my gosh, that was great. And it just wasn't it great. And it just went to show that so many of the things that we do, um, you know, we think, oh, this is genetics because my mom dad has this, my dad has this. But really, it's because that those are there are those learned behaviors that we get from folks otherwise. And so it it goes back to what you said just now about the education, letting people know that there are options that are out there, that there are other things that they can do, that we don't always have to jump to medicine, or we don't have to have, you know, um a list that looks like a CBS receipt of medications that people take. And so um, so letting people know their options is is exactly the right um way to do that.

SPEAKER_00:

So, how do we create that on a national scale? Is the question. How do we get doctors and corporations and legislation to start looking at truly what somebody needs, as opposed to let's push for the ABC medication so this drug company can get paid?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, and so I really I think that it starts with education for sure. And it starts with platforms like this one that you have, like my platform, like other docs who are out there, like the introduction of this field of you know lifestyle medicine to start really having these discussions about health changes that we can make. I think so much of it is related to, you know, again, the the foods that we eat, the and just kind of generally where we are as a society, I think. I don't get in trouble for this, but just saying how it's easier to have a quick fix for something than to make the real change that's needed. And um I think that you hit it right on the head when you said that it's so hard in an employed big system to be able to do that as a physician. Um, but that's where we see docs going. We see docs coming out of their training, going into big employed systems because the freedom, the um the options aren't always there to do private practice because these big systems are just gobbling everything up. We're not teaching medical students and residents that private practice is an option. And that takes away being in a big system like that, takes away some of our autonomy. And then you have you know just the the shortage of physicians across the country. Um, and when you're already short and then everyone's going into a big system, it's harder to get those docs who you know have the um desire to uh build strong relationships, or not even the desire, who have the ability to build those strong relationships because they're checking boxes. So I think it's it's changing the way we train medical students, residents, a big part of it, um, putting more emphasis just as a whole on what we eat. Then really starting to crack down on on uh on some of the the push that we have towards you know going straight to medicines when there's sometimes other options. And that's not to say I I believe in in medicines, most medicines, and I believe that um sometimes it does need to be the first step. I'm not gonna have a patient in my office whose blood pressure is you know 200 over 120, and I say, oh, let's let's just eat better and and exercise, but but realizing that that that there are things that we can do in conjunction with each other to overall improve our health.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, let me let me make something abundantly clear to even like people that listen to the show, because I don't think they know this about me. It might sound like I'm extreme, like, no medicine, no that I am so not. I think I think people take it too much to the opposite extreme where they go and start looking now at essential oils to cure cancer. Like no, if I have cancer, I'm gonna go to see an oncologist and go figure out how to get rid of this said cancer. It's not my expertise. So I I do it's it's just these constant jumping to extremes. Like you look at COVID as an example. I was really and still am against the COVID vaccine. Like my son's not never got it, I never got it, my wife never got it. So people keep saying, Well, you're anti-vax. No, my son still got the polio vaccine, still got like multiple vaccines that I know work, and I know I'd much rather him get that than end up with those diseases.

SPEAKER_02:

Absolutely. Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

But is there a problem with too many vaccines on the schedule now than there was 20 years ago? Absolutely. But it's looking at we do still need a blend, and I think we need more people in the middle ground instead of the polar where you really think people belong. Like I sit right in the middle when it comes to those specific things. And I want to address something you brought up earlier, which was the big corporation world, right? And why it's so much harder for doctors to do what they need to do. There's something for those that know like ICB codes and when a doctor sees a patient in this big corporation, corporations are there to make money. Period. If regardless of not-for-profit, for profit, nor your North Wales, because I'm in the Northeast, that's what we have big here. Cleveland clinics, like they're they're there to make money. So doctors are known to if I see a patient, how many ICB codes or issues can I pinpoint so therefore I can get draw more money from the insurance company to help pay for XYZ th through the corporation. And I think the incentivization of how that system operates is wrong. Because then what happens is the insurance company comes back and says, Hey doctor, you're billing me$300 for all these issues. I'm only gonna pay you$50 because that's what I decided. So they argue and sit there and fight with medical building, which makes an overall nightmare for both the physicians who are trying to do the right thing and help a patient, and for the patient, because now it builds a not like a not trust with the doctor, even though it's not the doctor's fault, it's the insurance companies fighting with the corporations, and each one is just constantly at each other's throats, which is constantly raising the rates of everything else. Right. I just wish there was a better system involved in that.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, the system is is wild. I'll say that. Um, I think maybe ICD 10 codes is is kind of what you're referring to, those ICB 10 codes, which are the diagnosis codes, and they're not necessarily, you know, whether you put two codes on there or 10, it doesn't change what I was actually listening to a podcast related to that this morning because there's that misconception there. But whether you put two or 10, it doesn't change what the insurance company is is gonna pay you. Um the kicker though, what you're getting to is is very much the point that you know we uh we do work as physicians, we uh you know send our claims out and the insurance companies say, you know what, just just kidding, you know, not paying you for this visit, um, or paying you less than the work that you did. There are even, you know, we can use time-based billing as well. And so, you know, for docs who are spending, you know, you know, X amount of time in a room with the patient, you can bill for your time instead. And so you can have a patient come in, you spend, you know, 40 minutes with them talking about something, and you expect a certain level of reimbursement from the insurance company, et cetera. And they say, you know what, just kidding, you know, psych, not gonna do it. And that I think is where lies the difference in kind of the sustainability of private practices versus big systems, because big systems can say, okay, we can gobble that up, you know, or that you know, all works out fine. But what that means is you got to see more patients in order. If the insurance company is gonna undercut us, then you got to be seeing more patients to make up for that. And it just, you know, just bastardizes the whole system, right? It really does to where, you know, it it almost negatively, um, negatively incentivizes people, if that's just oxymoron, right? Um, physicians to be able to sit down and have these discussions about lifestyle changes and that kind of stuff, because there is big company XYZ over here that's saying, well, if insurance is only gonna pay us this much, the math has the math. That means you've got to see more people in that period of time. And it's just it's something that that has to change, but we don't always see that not don't always, we don't see that from insurance companies. And so you know, people adjust to it, and adjusting to it doesn't always give us the best that we want for patients. Now, there is this whole push in our our country right now to direct care, so whether that's direct primary care, direct specialty care, or concierge medicine, which kind of takes that insurance out of the um, you know, out of the picture and it makes it a cash pay practice cash pay practice. But in some places that's hard to do. I'm in rural Alabama. My patients are not paying a thousand dollars a month to be on a membership list for me to call whenever they want to. It's just not something that they can do here. So I think that that works. That model of medicine works for many people and for many physicians because it takes insurance kind of out of the picture of it. But it's um it's just it's not a model that that works everywhere. But the fact that it does work in some places shows you that we've got an issue with the system, right? And that something has to has to change. And and who is gonna fix that, I I don't know, but um, they've got a wild fight on their hands if they're trying to.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, good luck.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, I know, right? It's like, you know what? What did what did Pfizer do last year?

SPEAKER_00:

I'm stupid amount of money.

SPEAKER_02:

Any number of wild things on any given day.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, it's just it's just such a law, heavy lobbying, money, cash-based system that and we got I I always like pointing out that we're stuck in this what I call this limbo, right? I think medicine can work either straight private, kind of like we were saying with the concierge, but it has to be truly private, or it could be you could figure out kinks and figure out how to make it truly public. Yeah, like this middle ground, it's tough. This is where shit sucks.

SPEAKER_02:

It's tough. It's a hard place, it's a hard place to be. It's hard for you know patients who are trying to navigate it, right? It's hard for patients who are trying to navigate it, it's hard for physicians who are trying to survive in it. There's so much more physician burnout these days, and you know, that is not just because of the insurance companies or reimbursement or all these things. It's also what we talked about earlier that patients are going, you know, far extreme, right? And and they're coming in and it is things that you know that you learned. Like medical school is not easy. They don't just let anybody into medical school, they don't let anybody graduate from medical school. We put in some work and to have patients sometimes come in who uh you've not been able to establish a relationship with them so they trust you and you know value your opinion and your part in the two-person conversation, but instead are like, oh, I saw this on social media to your point earlier. I'm gonna take essential oils to you know treat my cancer. I don't want anything that you're talking about here. It is it is mind-blowing and it's frustrating and and it doesn't do very much at all for the um for the already shortage of physicians we have in the country or burnout of physicians who are just leaving the practice of medicine altogether.

SPEAKER_00:

Can I say something you're gonna like? I think it's originally gonna sound like you're not gonna like it. Okay. I don't think there's a physician shortage. I think there's a patient overage. I think there's just too many sick people. And too many people like are too reliant on the medical community. So if we had less patients, therefore you would see less and have a more comfortable like outcome. You look at just the obesity population alone, yeah, we're at 70%. Oh, yeah, it's wild. It's wild.

SPEAKER_02:

I I don't know. I think I still stand in the not like that one, right? Because I'm so big on prevention, right? I'm so pr big on prevention and the need for kind of your your regular check-ins, right? Even if nothing's going on. That's why we call hypertension a silo killer because you walk around with it, don't know that you have it, right? So I think for prevention is huge. It is hard for me where I am in Alabama to say there's not a shortage, right? Because, but but to your point, I I see the point that you're making, because there are there's you know the rates of obesity and diabetes and hypertension, all those things here in our state, especially, are wild.

SPEAKER_00:

But we've got Obama's number one and number two.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, it's it's wild and nothing to be to be proud of. We are at a space where I live right now, there is no labor and delivery unit in our hospital because there's not an OB gyne in our area, right? And so you cannot deliver a baby here unless you want me, the family doc, who delivered some in med in residency and medical school to come out, or if you want the ER doc, you know, who is trained as an ER physician and is trained to handle emergencies to do it. But to get to an OB gynecologist, an obstetrician to deliver your baby from where I live is an hour 15 minutes up the road. And there's some counties that are, you know, west of ours who you've got to travel two hours to see it to get to an obstetrician. Now, do I drive around with a labor and delivery kit in the back of my car? Yes, I do. Am I totally prepared to pull over and deliver a baby if it's me or the state trooper on the side of the road? Absolutely, right? But that's what happens in our in our areas. And so there are certainly pockets where it's just not there. And here it's not there because why? Reimbursement is is lower in our state for all these other reasons that we don't have to get into today. But but dogs are leaving, or these residents are coming out of their training, or dogs who have been in practice who say, you know what, I don't want to practice you know, clinical medicine anymore. I don't want to see patients anymore because we have so much um, so much uh burnout that's in medicine these days. And a lot of that is just related to the things we've talked about already. So still some true shortages here. We've got hospitals that are closing left and right, you know, counties in our state that there's not an ambulance service in the county.

SPEAKER_00:

And so um shows like how different you go from one part of the country to the next. I'll tell you it's the exact opposite here. Uh there's every other building here is a medical building. That's wild. Like to the point, it's you just see construction and you go, must be a medical office. That is wild. Because doctors get reimbursed extremely well here, and all of them are flocking here, and there's a big pop, there's no more young people because it got too expensive to live here. Yeah, so it's a very older population, so they just keep building 55 older communities and medical offices. That's all that's being built around here.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, the exact opposite, it in the exact opposite here. So you're right. It's so so interesting to see the extremes and the things that I stay up and worry about are not things that have dots in your area worrying about.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh no, like I know doctors making almost a million a year, like salaried. Wild. They're they're not stressed from a good point. But there's just so much competition with like different corporations that they fight over the doctors, right? They get these abundance of salaries and stuff, and then New York State emberses well, so they flock here, can afford them and pay those things, which is kind of wild when you see just even like a state-by-state basis. Because to your point, like if I'm I was like envisioning when you're talking about there having OB and my wife's having our second kid in January. It's like that would suck. An hour and a half away. It does. I just couldn't even imagine that. That's like such a different you gotta be more open, is I guess what I'm looking for. You gotta see visually where you step, how things are impacted differently. Absolutely. Absolutely. So I love that. I want to I want to talk about something that is recent and in the news, and I think it's just so relevant. Uh RFK came out like three months ago, and four medical schools pushed that they have to do one year of nutrition because it was never offered in medical schools as a whole. And I'm very familiar with it because I'll give a little I'll give a little background and context of me personally. My grandparents founded a medical school and wrote the books for that set of medical school. My brother went to that medical school. So I like I read his doctor books and his nutrition book was like three pages long. And it's funny because like we argue about it, and then he ends up like looking up the things I talk about, and he goes, Oh, I guess you're right. I was like, Yeah, you just didn't learn it. So, how do you feel about the push for medical schools adding a nutrition requirement? And do you think there's anything else missing? Or do you believe that it's already a lot? Like you have to learn a lot in four years. So it's just now just adding more and it might create more burnout.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, so I think that there definitely is a place for more nutrition in our medical training. That is in both medical school and our residency programs. I was really fortunate that in my residency program, I think most across the country, you know, you've got um you know in-house nutritionists there who you do rotations with and you can consult on your patients for in a space like ours, that's so important. Um, I think that there certainly is a space for more nutrition education in medical schools. Let that not be confused with me thinking that that anywhere near most of what RFK Jr. says is at all medically sound, reasonable, or anything. But I do think that there is certainly a space for more nutrition education in our schools, absolutely in our medical schools, because so much of the issues or so many of the issues that we see in our patients, especially those of us who are doing primary care, are tied into nutrition issues, nutrition concerns, and things that can be directly impacted and addressed by people being able to change some of their nutrition habits. And if we are the people, the experts that they're coming to see to talk about it, then we need to know what we're talking about. And so I I do think that there is a space, certainly a space for more nutrition education in medical schools and residency programs.

SPEAKER_00:

Do you think there's anything else missing from that component of the whole that you wish you'd learned more from?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, there's a long list of things I wish I'd learned.

SPEAKER_03:

I wish I'd learned what to do with money when I made it, right? That's another big part. We don't teach financial literacy.

SPEAKER_02:

I mean, you have these students who come out of their medical training in so much debt, and then you give them money for more money than than any of us have made otherwise, um, and expect us to make good decisions with it. So I think financial literacy is something that should certainly be introduced into um into the medical space. You know, we we don't get enough of the you know, fitness education, so many of those things otherwise that I think are are important. And you're starting to see with the kind of rise of osteopathic schools across the country, you're starting to see that as well. But it does also have to be introduced into the allopathic or the MD uh part of medical training as well. And I think that those things are we're starting to see that shift because patients are demanding it, right? Patients are starting to demand it, and where there is the demand, you got to follow it with um with education. And so I think it's coming for sure. I hope it's coming, I should say.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm seeing a trend. So I've been doing this for almost 10 years as far as the training side of it. And I will tell you, pre-COVID, every like doctors would tell patients, like with the silliest things, like, don't work out, you don't need to do this. And even post-injuries, whatever, they would just constantly dissuade people from being a part of a gym and moving, not understanding like you can still do other things, you can work around things, like it's not always the case. You're you're seeing a shift now, yeah, where I'm getting less of that. Yeah, and we're seeing the opposite.

SPEAKER_02:

Exactly. We're seeing orthopedics. So one of the ortho guides that I refer to, I mean, he is replacing knees, and patients are walking up and down the stairs and walking out, and you're in PP the next day. And and so I think even that starts to show the the shift that's happening that is changing kind of the expectations of how we're you know expected to heal from either illness, surgery, all those things.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, case in point with the case in point injury, which is so funny. Like I was looking for a physician to do the surgery, right? And I interviewed a bunch of them just with help of my brother, because I was it's a big surgery, so I wanted to make sure the person I chose was right. And I though I ended up choosing the specific doctor that ended up doing the surgery because he brought up a study that I previously have read that came out about six months ago. I didn't have to prompt him, he brought it up, and I was like, okay, he pays attention to the current things. That study, which is so interesting, it's a cross-sectional study. They had people who had shoulder surgery, and what they did was right after shoulder surgery, they worked the opposing arm. Like they still worked out that opposing arm. And what they showed was that there was muscular gains in that injured arm when they worked the other side of it. And there's way more nerve firings on that side as well, and it healed way quicker. Most people just say, I hurt my left shoulder, I can't work out, period. I'm gonna lay it out all day. Whereas opposed to you can work your other arm, you can work your lower body like this. So right. Other things to do.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, absolutely. And and I see that sometimes in in my own practice with patients that I'm talking about, you know, getting some more exercise in, and it's like, oh, but you know, my my knee hurts so much that I can't exercise, and it just it becomes this cycle, right? Like your knee hurts because you have this chronic arthritis because you're you know, you're you're putting more weight on it, you're heavier than you need to be up top. And so then you don't do anything. Well, all you're doing is feeding the cycle. And so I love that. I'm not familiar with that study, but it it certainly makes sense. And and I love that you were able to find a doc who is is still reading, right? I think that's so important to still be reading, still be learning and knowing what's out there to best suit patients.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, you look at just a silly, stupid example. Like I have aunts and uncles, obviously, that are practicing physicians, right? So they're older, and they still think eggs are bad for you. It's like I try to like explain, like, you know, diet or cholesterol doesn't raise cholesterol, and they go, that's not true.

SPEAKER_02:

It's like I I literally was um it was the nutritionist that I mentioned from my residency, she came on my podcast and she said something about eggs, and she and I both were yelling, like, eat the eggs, eat the eggs, because it's so funny that you say that. That eggs get such a bad rap. And and I tell my patients, I'd rather you eat eggs and Snicker bars every day of the week, right? No offense to Snickers bars, but um, but eggs are are not as bad as we have been taught that they are, and um, and and it's just that, you know, that there are shifts, things that we're learning that are changing now that patients are finding out and are coming in saying that you know docs are still like, wait, what are you talking about? And so that ever reading, ever learning is is certainly important.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, I couldn't agree more. I got into a massive fight with my uncle four years ago over Thanksgiving dinner, because he's going around telling people that BMI is the gold standard of figuring out if someone's healthy. And I tried explaining to him, like, you know, BMI is a stupid measurement, and nobody should even give a shit what their BMI is. And he's like, That's not true. I'm a physician. I was like, Do you know what BMI is? It's height overweight. So you take me, I'm 200 pounds at 6'1, I'm considered overweight. Do I look overweight to you?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, he goes, uh and it's just not reflect, it's not it does, it's not representative of the uh population that we apply it to, right? BMI is based off of a white male, right? We cannot apply it to everyone. And so um yeah, interesting conversation, I'm sure you had.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh yeah, I just say, man, it takes three seconds to check someone's body fat. Like just get a biological impedance, you can get within three percent of it at this point with technology. Oh, waste hip ratios, like silly simple stuff. You can get a good uh disposition of how someone is healthy. I want to bring up something super specific because it's still like trending like crazy. People are still on a kick, and I want to get your take on it. And that would be your GLP ones or like your Ozempics that every other person seems to be on at this point. What's your take on that? Uh pros, cons, yeah, and do you like where it's headed?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, um I think it's wild where it's headed. I think it goes back to a little bit of my comp my mention earlier that we sometimes look for quick fixes when there are some other things that we can do. But I very quickly want to also say that I think that there are some very bad options out there for weight loss that have so often been used for it, right? So you know, you think about things like you know, fentramine loading people up with injections of things they don't need, etc. So I'm not mad at GLP1s at all, right? I love them in my patients with diabetes to make sure that they're as long as they have no contraindications, there's no reason they can't take them. And I like them for weight loss. I don't mind them for weight loss at all because I think that they are certainly um better for you than you know other things that folks are getting from weight loss clinics, right? Things that can cause heart issues down the road, things that are just meant to jack up your metabolism, right? If you want to jack up your metabolism, go for a run, you know, do other things instead. But I I think GLP1s are are good. I think that they are gonna help a lot of people who have tried to lose weight unsuccessfully be able to do it. What I caution my patients against, though, is not letting the medicine be the only thing that does the work. And it's hard because the way, you know, one of the central ways that the medicine works is, you know, I tell patients it turns on that feeling of being full and turns off that feeling of being hungry. And so it's easy for the medicine to do all the work alone, but it's still important that when you put something in your mouth, that you're putting the right thing in your mouth, because we're also at this crazy space of coverage for the medicines, right? I don't love the idea of compounded GLP1 because you don't know what you're getting, where you're getting it from, that kind of thing. But the manufacturer companies, the companies that make these do not make it easy to afford. And so there's something that unfortunately people can't be on for long term because they can't afford to be on it for long term. So I worry sometimes that people that patients aren't learning to make changes, lifestyle changes for the time that they have to come off the medicine, right? Because what we see sometimes is that people do really, really well when they're taking it, but then for whatever reason, financial reasons or others, when they can't take it anymore, that weight slowly comes back because the medicine's been doing all the work. Now, if you can deal with a little bit of constipation and the other things that come along with it, um then I think that the GLP ones are okay. I think that there are patients who patients I see in my clinic every day who uh you know can't make some of the other changes that I want them to make, but gosh, if they could drop a quick, you know, 20 pounds or so, maybe they'd be better able to physically move their body to start doing the you know the the work that they want to do. And so I don't mind them. I write them for my patients as long as I know that their you know pancreas labs are fine and that there's nothing else that I need to be worried about otherwise, but I think that the the cost is prohibitive, but I don't love the idea of some of the other things that we've always had to use or that I haven't written them that have been used in the past for quick weight loss that's just gonna come back later. So it does require the education that comes around it that hey, you still got to make some lifestyle changes. Yes, this medicine will make you not want to eat, but there may come a day where you're not gonna be able to take the medicine. What are you learning from it so that all that weight doesn't come back?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, it's I feel very similar to how you feel, maybe a little more with a a little more chip on my shoulder, but mostly exactly where you said like giving anti-seizion medications and the shit that people used to present for weight loss. Why? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It just made no sense. I'm gonna even tie that into what I always hated growing up was gastric bypass, like surgery to get surgery being a quick option, it shouldn't be.

SPEAKER_02:

You know, try other things, right?

SPEAKER_00:

I have I know so many people who got gastric bypass, lost 100 pounds, and then gained 200 because there's so many issues that come after it. And now not only did you gain the weight back, now it's harder to lose the weight because you can't digest things the proper way, you're not getting your proper nutrients and stuff, and you have to supplement for the rest of your life. So it's like do I like GLP ones better than that? Absolutely, no questions asked. Do I like it better than the She's in medicines? Absolutely, no questions asked. But like what you said in the very, very beginning of that, does it create a habit change? And that's truly the question we have to put out there because you can lead a horse to water, but you can't get it to drink, right? So how do we teach people to start creating those habit changers? And it's such a tough recall because people lie all the time. I tried everything, right? I eat super healthy. I can't tell you this is my favorite thing in training, and try this as a physician next time. Ask people, how do you eat? And they'll give you, like, oh, I eat generally well. Then I asked the same question give me your complete dietary recall of what you eat yesterday.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, absolutely. I do that all the time. Yep, all the time.

SPEAKER_00:

And then always it's like, well, yesterday was a bad day.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It it absolutely happens. And um, I think there certainly is a space for kind of logging. I'll ask my patients to log what you eat. Log what you eat, bring this back in. You don't have to wait to see me or anything. Just bring it and drop it off at the front desk and I'll look at it, you know, tomorrow afternoon one day. Just do it for one day and let's see. Do it for one day, then next time it's do it for a week. And I think that when people do that, they're really able to see, wait a minute, if they're being honest, they're really able to see, wait a minute, there's this is a lot, there's a lot here. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh man, that's that's the biggest pet fever is that people think they're eating healthy. But then there's the people that talk about education as a whole, like think they're eating healthy but aren't. Yeah, and they just like miss have all this misinformation of what actually is considered healthy. Like, I look at uh middle-aged women, I just thought I know it's very generalized and people are different, but just a general population when it comes to having higher protein amounts, they're very it push back a lot on it. No, no, no, that's not good for me, that's not good for me. Absolutely, and it's like, no, like menopause and postmenopause are like, no, you need a lot more.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, especially as we start to lose that body mass, as we less estrogen, a whole other conversation, but you're so right, you're so right there.

SPEAKER_00:

It's so like mind-blowing just the pushback you get on specific things of having to teach people over and over again. Oh man, I think we got kick you got kicked out of here, so I'll get you back in. I think she hopped out. Maybe I saw something that was like, no, I'm totally kidding. I think she just had technical issues. But anyway, I hope you guys appreciated this episode of Health the Fitness Redefined. Please don't forget. We got it back. I was just giving a word out and I was like, she left. She didn't like the conversation she said. No, yes, totally.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah.

unknown:

Sorry.

SPEAKER_03:

So sorry. I don't know what happened. I went to move it down and turned it off. Excuse me, please. Pardon.

SPEAKER_00:

No, no, it's all good. That makes the show fun, right? Real life things happen.

SPEAKER_03:

Technical issues. So sorry about that. But but thank you again for having me. This has been fun.

SPEAKER_00:

This has been a blast, and honestly, I think it's a good place to kind of wrap up anyway. So, Dr. Anderson, I'm gonna ask you the final two questions I ask everybody on the show. Yeah. The first one is if we were to summarize this episode in one or two sentences, what'll be your take-home message?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, so my take-home message would be that you know, it's important to develop a relationship with your physician where you're you feel comfortable sharing what you are and are not comfortable with, right? And that then allows you to start to have that discussion about medications, about you know, exercise, about nutrition, all those things that um that really impact your health. So find a physician that you can develop a good relationship with who will listen to you and you feel comfortable listening to them.

SPEAKER_00:

I I love that. That's perfect. And then the second one, how can people find you get a hold of you? I know you said you're gonna have two shows. I know listen out. Give us the rundown.

SPEAKER_02:

All right. So one of them is is called Physicians Hanging a Shingle. It's for dogs who are interested in starting their own private practice. So you've heard me say throughout how much I love the idea of private practice and how my own private practice has given me my you know autonomy and joy back in practicing medicine. So that's there's that podcast, Physicians Hanging a Shingle, for any docs who may be interested. Um, for the general population, I've got a podcast also that's called Headed to Healthier. And it is primarily for women, but I know some guys who listen to it as well. Um, but for women who are 40 plus, lead really busy lives, and who have said, I know that I need to take more control of my health. And so um every other week it's a solo show, me talking about things that either I've seen in practice or I've talked to my patients about recently. And then every other week I bring on you know someone in the healthcare space who comes and shares their knowledge with me and with my audience. And so um, those two podcasts are available anywhere you listen to podcasts.

unknown:

Dr.

SPEAKER_00:

Anderson, thank you so much for coming on. Thank you guys for listening to this week's episode of Help the Fitness Redefine. Please don't forget to subscribe, share. We don't run ads. So this is the only way this show grows, guys. It means the absolute world to me so we can spread the message that fitness is truly medicine. Until next time.

SPEAKER_02:

Absolutely. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_00:

Thank you guys for listening to this week's episode of Help the Fitness Redefined. Please don't forget to subscribe and share the show with a friend, with a loved one, for those that need to hear it. And ultimately, don't forget that fitness is medicine. I'll see you next time.

Contributor

Anthony Amen

Host