Selling Legal: What if You FIRED All of Your Lawyers from Intake | Michael Patrick Strauch

Dive headfirst into an ocean of sales mastery with our special guest, Michael Patrick Strauch, partner at Your Practice Mastered. His entrepreneurial tale unfolds from a college dorm room to the pinnacle of the legal industry, offering a fresh vantage point on how non-attorney salespeople are shaking up the industry. Michael shares his roadmap to success, from creating a profitable web development company powered by his YouTube expertise, to the pivotal step towards 'done-for-you' services.

Strap in for a ride through the twists and turns of leveraging a YouTube channel audience into a robust email list, with a landing page that boasts almost a 50% conversion rate. The episode isn't just about the numbers; it's a deeper reflection on the value of a college education against the backdrop of already running a lucrative business. As we pivot to my own ventures, I recount the thrill of dabbling in TikTok and investments, underlining the significance of pursuing one's passions and how it fuels content diversification and audience engagement.

The crescendo of our conversation hits as we spotlight the Closing Room – a brainchild that's redefining sales training for law firms. We unfold the success stories that have resulted from implementing structured sales processes, like the Maryland law firm that doubled its closing rate—a testament to the power of strategic sales training. We don't stop there; the episode ventures into the realm of international events and the exhilaration of our Partners Club program's growth. Rounding off with a touch of humility and gratitude, I invite you to embrace the wisdom shared today and encourage a visit to yourpracticemaster.com for a complimentary book offer, along with more enriching resources.

Connect with Michael at the Your Practice Mastered Podcast or on Instagram @mpstrauch

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Brian Glass is a nationally recognized personal injury lawyer. He is passionate about living a life of his own design and looking for answers to solutions outside of the legal field. This podcast is his effort to share that passion with others.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

But the key is is a non-attorney salesperson can't give legal advice. And because they can't give legal advice, what we tend to find to be is that they close at higher rates than attorneys, and the reason is is because they have to follow that structure. When they deviate from it is when they start to see a decline in results and they know they can't give legal advice. So really, the structure is about going through. What is the prospect story right, building that empathy and getting to their pain points, getting to their goal and then really going through and laying out the plan of action for them. And, most importantly, science beyond the breeze, new automation to show you how to build a time-inducing don't want to be a line that sells best there on the back.

Speaker 2: 0:47

That's what I was also. Hey guys, welcome back to the show. Today I have a great guest for you, michael Patrick Strouck, who's a partner in your Practice Mastered. Michael is an expert in sales, especially in the sales in the legal community, and he recently partnered with his dad in your Practice Master master. So we'll talk about sales, we'll talk about working with your dad, which I'm doing also and we'll talk about the entrepreneurial lifestyle for a young guy who's now built more than one business, which I think is really interesting. Michael, how are you?

Speaker 1: 1:19

Hey Brian, I'm fantastic. I'm excited to be here and appreciate you having me on.

Speaker 2: 1:24

Good man, I'm excited to have you. So give me your backstory, because I said that you're young, but you're one of the few guys who I know who built and launched a six-figure business from his dorm room. So tell me about that.

Speaker 1: 1:39

Yeah. So I know when we had you on our podcast we talked about that born or kind of raised into entrepreneurship, and I would tell you it was a combo of both for me, but I've always just had that draw to entrepreneurship. So I would start young and I did little businesses growing up. Well, fast forward to about college.

Speaker 1: 1:58

During that time period I had built a YouTube channel. I had built a YouTube channel so I found a very unique niche in web development and particularly Wixcom and that was kind of an up and coming platform. And when I went to start trying to build a website for something I was doing on there, I was struggling to find any content. So I was like, hmm, this could be an opportunity. So I started building training content for that and during that period I had built up a community and I had built the channel to about 75,000 people and in that time period that was my lead generation source. So I was able to actually build a web development company off of the back of the YouTube channel and that was kind of my launch. During that process I loved the content creation, I loved the business development, I loved the sales. Ironically enough, what I didn't love was web development and design. So that was the opportunity at the time and I used that as a launchpad, graduated college and then started into the legal sales industry.

Speaker 2: 3:04

Did you have employees or re-employment building the websites on the back end?

Speaker 1: 3:08

I did so. I utilized both the combo of contractors and actual employees, so at one point I got it to having nine employees at the time. But during college that was a lot, A lot to manage.

Speaker 2: 3:23

Yeah, I mean, the interesting thing about that is Wix, when it came out, was like website building for dummies, yes, and then people couldn't figure it out, so they went to your YouTube channel and then they still couldn't figure it out, or they didn't want to figure it out, so then they hired you to build it. Yeah, what was the iteration for you of the discovery that this really isn't an information product so much as it is a done for you product at the end of the day?

Speaker 1: 3:50

So that's a really good question and I will tell you, a lot of it lies in what you originally said, which was built for kind of like web development for dummies.

Speaker 1: 4:00

Right, it's supposed to be easy. It's a done for our done DIY platform, excuse me, and because of that, the audience around it was pretty DIY and so whenever I would try to launch a course or an info product, it kind of fell flat because the audience is just trying to do it themselves, trying to keep things really low cost and bootstrap, and they weren't all that interested in kind of an info product. They just wanted it done Really, they just wanted it done for them. So then I made that pivot to open up the service of doing it for them. And rather than finding that person that just wanted DIY and just wanted some quick little projects done, I knew there were people out there looking for bigger projects that could be done. So I started kind of gearing my marketing and my sales process to capturing more of the bigger fish in the DIY or Wix market and so I really built more of a high-end web development business for Wix in Wix's terms and what Wix would consider high end at the time.

Speaker 2: 5:07

So there are many law firms now in 2024 who are building on YouTube or trying to build on social media. How are you moving people off of your YouTube channel into a sales call, did you? Have a website or an email address that you're driving people to. What does the value offer there?

Speaker 1: 5:24

website or an email address that you're driving people to. What does it allow you all for there? So that from early on, thankfully, I had Rich as an inspiration. He always stressed the value of your list, right, Building your list, and I knew that if I had an audience on YouTube, that's great, but I only have so much control of that audience, right. So it's really bound by what I could post on YouTube.

Speaker 1: 5:45

And at the time, YouTube didn't have all of what it has today, Didn't have shorts, didn't have the community features, didn't have a lot of the new features that it has to be able to reach your audience and a lot of different forms of media. So what I really identified was I need to figure out how do I get this audience off of YouTube and onto my house list. And so I just had a very simple landing page and I called it weekly Wix tips. And people can come off of YouTube and I would pitch it in every video. I would say hey, look, if you want to learn a little bit more about Wix and how Wix works, go ahead and head to the link in the description below and let's get you started. And when I tell you, it was literally like an email capture form and just the title Weekly Wix Tips. That's all it was. But hey, it converted at 49.7%. So yes.

Speaker 2: 6:36

What year were you in college when this was going on?

Speaker 1: 6:40

So I started the channel actually in about 2014, which was still in my high school age, but when I actually launched the web development company, I was a freshman in college.

Speaker 2: 6:53

So I'm just curious about the thought process, Like, imagine you were paying some money to go to college but all of a sudden you've turned on this six-figure stream of income. So I mean, was there any point where you were like, do I really need a college degree? Should I just back out?

Speaker 1: 7:08

Yes, I will tell you that. So my now wife we actually were high school sweethearts and so we started dating senior year of high school she was going out to college in St Louis. I was kind of undecided on where I wanted to go, what I wanted to do in terms of college, like I didn't really know what path in college I knew I wanted to own a business. So I was like do I go into marketing? Do I? Is there a sales degree? Well, there is entrepreneurial careers, right and degrees. So I headed out to St Louis with her.

Speaker 1: 7:43

So I headed out to St Louis with her and at the time I got in and after that first semester my friends and everyone they were begging me to stay because I was like, guys, this is, I don't see the point in this. Like I don't feel like I'm getting a ton of value from an education perspective, right, I felt like everything was by the textbook and I didn't feel like any of it really translated over to small business all that well, and I'm sure there's different programs at different universities that are far better, but where I was I didn't feel like it was all that helpful to me. So that conversation played a lot in my mind, but I decided ultimately to stay because I wanted to enjoy that point in my life.

Speaker 2: 8:26

I did build really great friends, really great connections and relationships, and so I did and I stayed really for that reason yeah, and so that's my sense now is like college, more than being a place where people go and learn stuff, is kind of a safe four-year place to mature. Um, I don't know, I don't know if that resonates with you, but like I'm looking at my kids, who are 10, 8 and 5 and we're saving for college, yeah, but you know anything that they want to learn, if they're driven, they can learn on youtube, right, um, and most ivy league schools now have even free courses on podcasts, right, yeah, so you can go and learn any of this stuff where, wherever. But really it's like a cultural I call it a safe haven to to grow up and make mistakes, kind of with a big safety net underneath you yeah, I mean, look, there are certain expensive safety net but expensive safety net, but there are.

Speaker 1: 9:22

There are certain degrees where it's like, yeah, I made all this sense to go to college attorneys, right, doctors, dentists, even teachers in some cases. Right, all very sensible, common paths to go. But for other careers out there, you know like right now, if you were to find a marketing graduate that just graduated and brought them in, they likely don't have a ton of understanding of what to do, right, and a lot of that just has to do with the way we're taught in college. It's less really experience and actually putting it to use. It's more understanding and getting like the logic behind it in the textbook style, at least where I went, and I just didn't find a ton of value there. So your point of you can find anything you need on YouTube and learn it. I couldn't agree more. You definitely can. It's a matter of do you want that? You know safety net as an opportunity to continue to grow in a personal sense and continue to get those experiences under your belt.

Speaker 2: 10:27

Am I remembering correctly that you also built like a TikTok trading channel? Was that you?

Speaker 1: 10:34

Yeah, yes, that was me. So, as I got around the web development stuff down and out, this was kind of during the very start of the COVID era, right before I was about to graduate, and my roommate and I we got heavily into kind of investing and trading. And so, you know, I proposed to him because he was like, you know, I really like what you do with the wick stuff, like, how do you like, what can I do? Is there something I did and I was just like, well, what do you like to do? And he's like I like to trade. He's like, okay, well, tiktok's like starting to get big, you like to trade and you're really good at it.

Speaker 1: 11:14

And he was. He was very good at reading fundamentals, doing the technical analysis, very strong at that. And I was like, look, why don't you just start posting some content of what you do right? Like, why don't you say what you do? You're not promoting financial advice, but you're just saying, hey, this is what I'm doing right and this is what I'm doing in my portfolio. And he did that and I decided I would help him in some of the content creation and some of the business stuff. And, yeah, within three weeks, you know we had a few thousand bucks a month and people paying to be in a discord channel to just literally communicate with one another, talk to one another about daily trades, and that's it was really. A community is what it was us.

Speaker 2: 12:03

This is a total tangent, but I'm really curious about why. You know why somebody would pay to be in a Discord channel for that when you could find it for free on Reddit, right, because plenty of trading communities that are out there and open. And so what was your? Either your pitch or your draw. How did you get people to hand over a couple of dollars a month to be in your channel?

Speaker 1: 12:19

So the big thing was that Josh was my roommate and Josh would do every morning he would do his breakdown of what he was looking at in the day and he would do his technical analysis. So he kind of said, hey, these are kind of the trades I'm looking at today, here's why, here's how I'm breaking it down, here's how I'm looking at today, here's why, here's how I'm breaking it down, here's how I'm looking at it and here's why I'm doing the things I'm doing. So it was a bit more curated in the sense that, one, they drew to like Josh and myself and the way we presented things, and then two, josh was actually giving tangible value every morning that they could access.

Speaker 2: 13:00

Awesome, okay, that makes total sense. All right, and so then you got out of college and you went and started business, at least business number three, which is the closing room, correct? So tell me about that.

Speaker 1: 13:10

Yes. So got done with college, uh, moved out to Charlotte and when we got to Charlotte I had kind of already completely wound down the web development side of things and I was looking for, kind of the next opportunity. What am I going to do next? It's that question what do you want to be when you grow up? Right, and that's a hard question to answer. Yeah, it's a hard question to answer. But at the same time I knew that my father had things going with, you know, partners Club and your practice master, and I looked at him and at the time it wasn't going to be anything in that round. I just said, hey, look, I'm looking for my next thing We've talked about. You know, at some point in time, if we have the opportunity, be cool to go into business together with something, and so this is probably the time to look into that.

Speaker 1: 14:03

And so they actually came out to Charlotte that December to come out for Christmas and we sat down and we went through literally just about every business you could think of and we were creating pros and cons. We were doing strengths and weaknesses of ourselves, what we, like the businesses everything from car like to do. If I boil it down, in any business. I like to sell, right, I'm good at it, I like to do that and I said so. So what if we did like sales training? What if we did sales?

Speaker 1: 14:49

And he's like, okay, uh, that's something we both align on. And I was like, all right, so we're gonna do training. But who are we going to do this for? And he's like, well, law firm owners really need to know how to sell. And so we nailed down, decided we were going to do sales training. I took at the time his extremely complicated sales structure whatever it was 72 steps and I was like, all right, well, if this isn't going to work, we need to boil this down to a structure and 72 steps. No one's going to want to follow, no one's following 72 steps.

Speaker 1: 15:25

Right, exactly. So I did my best to kind of mix my existing experience in sales and what works and his formula that he had at the time and I boiled it down to 19 steps. So I got, I got us to the 19 steps and before actually launching into anyone we had to prove that it could work. So I actually went into a firm out in Maryland I'm happy to share their name because I've done it before so the Grafton firm out in Maryland. They were a bankruptcy firm and they decided to give me the opportunity to kind of prove this out. They said, look, we'll give you 90 days. I told them, look, I'll work for free in those 90 days. I just want to prove this out. Right, and so they did. And they started with about a 50% close rate when I got there and this was during COVID, so everything was remote consults at the time and then at the end of those 90 days we increased their chapter seven fee by 20% and took them to consistently an 84% close rate. And so they loved it. Right, they're like oh, not only does this work, we love it.

Speaker 1: 16:28

Now how do we find someone to take your role so Will doesn't have to go back into the consoles, and so I helped them during that process start to find a non attorney salesperson, because they wanted to use a non-attorney salesperson. We did that and I launched into a beta group of different practice areas. At that point Then I found a beta group with about four clients over different practice areas. I said, okay, that was me running consults for the Graftons. Can I teach the law firms and sales how to do this? The answer turned out to be yes. They all started with an average of about a 33.7% close rate and at the end of 30 days we got them up to about 65%. So it was awesome. From there, use that as a launchpad to start going into the closing room and teaching law firms how to optimize their sales process, and we've done that with over 100 firms.

Speaker 2: 17:21

So what I love about that is you went in as somebody with no subject matter expertise in bankruptcy and you raised it, would you say, 50% to 87%, something like that 50% to 84% yep, yeah, so that's like a 66% raise. That's like a 66% raise. And then you taught other law firm closers not necessarily lawyers to go from 33 to 66 or something like. So you doubled the number of closings without an additional marketing spend. Yes, Right.

Speaker 1: 17:56

So is there a secret sauce to that? Yes, yes and no. So I would tell you the secret sauce is having a structure, right? So so many firms that I first meet with when I ask you know, what does your sales process look like? They're like well, like, what do you mean by process? And so there's no structure. And so when I say structure, I mean every single time we have a consultation, we're passing the prospect through the same structure, so we're using the same set of steps. Ideally, we're using the same word for word scripting and every consult is treated the exact same.

Speaker 1: 18:30

Now the thing with using a structure and something that I view a little bit differently than some other sales trainers a lot of other sales trainers indirectly try to get us to convert 100%, and what I mean by that is they want us to customize each consultation to each prospect. And the problem there is there's no dependability in that Some weeks you could have an 80% week, other weeks you could have a 20% week. Well, the purpose behind implementing a structure is not only implementing a proven structure that you know you could depend on and it works, but to create consistency. And I will tell you for most practice areas, it's usually somewhere between 60 and 80%. We're able to convert 60 to 80% of our consultations into paying clients. So you ask, what's that secret weapon? It's having a structure in place.

Speaker 2: 19:28

And you know, I can hear the lawyers and the lawyer in me objecting to the idea of a non-lawyer salesperson, right. So handle that sales guy, handle that objection for me, right? Oh, you can't give legal advice, right To me. You've got to demonstrate enough that you know what you're talking about without giving legal advice. Tell them why their problem requires a legal solution, but then kind of convince them to purchase what's behind door number two without really telling them what it is. So tell me about that.

Speaker 1: 19:52

Yes. So let's unpack this. I will tell you at the base level, having the proper structure in place helps facilitate that. So that's kind of the fundamental right. We have to have a sales structure in place. The beauty behind the sales structure we built is that I was a non-attorney salesperson, so when I went into this law firm it had to be built in a way that I can run the consults. Obviously, I can't give legal advice and I can get the deals closed. So the entire structure was built off of that premise. Now beauty behind that attorneys can use this too.

Speaker 1: 20:28

But the key is is a non-attorney salesperson can't give legal advice. And because they can't give legal advice, what we tend to find to be is that they close at higher rates than attorneys. And the reason is is because they have to follow that structure. They really can't deviate from it. When they deviate from it is when they start to see a decline in results and they know they can't give legal advice.

Speaker 1: 20:53

So really, the structure is about going through what is the prospect story right, building that empathy and getting to their pain points, getting to their goal and then really going through and laying out the plan of action for them and, most importantly, actually going for the close during the initial consultation, and because it's built in a way that legal advice A does not need to be given and B really should never be given because it can take us so off track. It allows us to maximize conversion in that sense, and so non-attorney salespeople, using the right structure, just tend to outperform and I know it sounds crazy, but they do not have to and they cannot give legal advice. And although it sounds like a phantom idea that a prospect will come in, not get legal advice and still retain the firm, I assure you it can happen. I've watched it happen literally hundreds and hundreds of times over with these firms.

Speaker 2: 21:51

Yeah. Is there a practice area where this doesn't work?

Speaker 1: 21:57

No, I'm still yet to find a practice area where the non-attorney can't get the deal closed without giving legal advice. So my short answer is no. I have not seen this not work in a particular practice area yet are doing or are not doing before somebody's sitting down for that consultation.

Speaker 2: 22:39

That makes it either work better or work less. And let me give you an example of what I mean. I mean, are there things in the marketing or in the first phone call that they're having with the reception or whoever it is, before they're going into an intake or consultation? That is a lever that says okay, if you follow these three steps before somebody sits down with the salesperson, then they are more or less likely to buy.

Speaker 1: 23:06

Yeah, that's a good question. So this is going to come as a shocker to everyone but, just like for consultations, we believe in a structure for appointment setting. Slash intake too right, and so same thing applies. We have a set structure and the key there is really building the relationship. We've got to build a relationship in that initial appointment setting call to, similar to a consultation, have to identify why are they calling in, what's what's fear, what's going on and what are they trying to achieve and genuinely building a relationship in that session. And then also, when we have a non-attorney salesperson being cautious and weary during appointment setting, that we're not saying, hey, we're going to get your appointment booked with the attorney, right, because it's not with the attorney, it's booking the appointment with whatever you would like to title that person legal consultant, legal team, you know, client concierge, whatever you'd like to title that person. So that also sets the prospect up for the understanding that they're not meeting with the attorney. Next, Right.

Speaker 2: 24:15

So when you have that mismatched expectation, that's a recipe for complete disaster. How do you deal with like pricing in terms of hourly fees or flat fee pricing of legal services in that non-attorney role?

Speaker 1: 25:00

no-transcript fee retainer and then obviously determining from there whether you're doing evergreen billing or replenishment at a certain point and whatever that may look like, and obviously deducting from the retainer off of the hourly. But having a flat fee in some capacity just makes life easier for the non-attorney salesperson and also maximizes conversions because we're creating less confusion during the consult.

Speaker 2: 25:31

And then they don't have to scope the work right. You don't have to guess is this a 20-hour or 40-hour project? Correct? A little bit easier for transactional things like bankruptcy, a little bit harder for Listen. I don't know how messy your divorce is going to be.

Speaker 1: 25:48

Right. Varying degrees right. If this appears to be uncontested, here's the uncontested retainer. If this looks like it's going to be pretty expansive, maybe somewhat intense, divorce, contested retainer. And then you have the differentiation between the two based off of listening to the prospector story and what's going on.

Speaker 2: 26:12

You and your dad, who you're working with and you're practice mastered now, both seem to be very process-oriented guys. Am I right about that? Yes, you're right about that. So talk to me a little bit about your working relationship and how you, all you know set goals for the company and then set those background processes, and how you break down the varying responsibilities for those jobs.

Speaker 1: 26:34

Yeah, great question. So he and I both have pretty darn busy days. So I'm still caught up in a lot of the sales role in the company, which is one of my goals, coincidentally, this year is to help get myself out of that role. There's a few puzzle pieces that we're putting together from a lead flow perspective and just sales process and nailing down a few things. But I tell you that because a lot of what we do happens outside of business hours.

Speaker 1: 27:05

So we will purposely take, you know, a monthly planning session and we'll have a monthly planning session on the calendar where we're reviewing, you know kind of what the month looked like, setting out our goals for the month. And then, for example, we just last weekend we went on a trip together to one, celebrate the new partnership. But two, we use it as an opportunity because those trips when it's just he and I, even if it's business trips, we're able to dial in and focus on just that, like when we went out to the mastermind with you guys, right, we were able to dial in and focus on that. But it's a lot of after hours, it's a lot of making sure we have time locks on the calendar to talk, because if we don't. We can quickly look up in a month.

Speaker 1: 27:53

Month and a half has passed and we didn't do certain things right. We didn't reflect on the last month, we didn't set a goal for the next month, and so that that's a big part of how we, as Wilder and Son, do that, in addition to you know the texting throughout the evenings. Hey, just listen to this podcast episode. Here's a good idea. We do a lot of that.

Speaker 2: 28:15

Yeah, and you guys are doing a lot of stuff. You're hosting four different quarterly events with the Partners Club in four different cities throughout the US, which I think would drive me absolutely crazy. Yeah, just like we use Sherry Sokolowski to plan a Great League of Marketing Summit, you're using her for all four of your events, but the one that you have coming up is in Guadalajara.

Speaker 1: 28:38

It is yeah, it's in Guadalajara, mexico, which we've got an incredible team down there for us on your practice master's side that manages our staffing room division, which our staffing room division does basically dedicated appointment setters for law firms, and so we've got a whole staffing solution down there in Guadalajara. And then we have a lot of members on our marketing team down there. So a lot of content, a lot of marketing, a lot of graphics and copywriting, and so we wanted to create an opportunity for some of the firms that utilize this staffing room to be able to not only come out to the event for our quarterly, but also get an opportunity to actually come meet their team. So we saw this as an opportunity to give firms that do have a team down there the ability to meet them in person, collaborate with them and get to spend some time with them.

Speaker 2: 29:33

That's really cool, but it is such a heavy lift to go out of the country and do all of that.

Speaker 1: 29:40

You're right about that. I mean you run into other things like traditionally, we have a storage unit in Arizona where everything was originally based out of, and we ship a pallet out to wherever we're going, whether that's Charlotte, whether that's Virginia Beach, whatever event that is. Well, it's not that easy to do, you know, internationally, across the border. So now it's a lot of local setup right and making sure some of the stuff we would normally bring we're shrinking down a little bit. So not that it's a bare bones event, but it's certainly a little bit more bare bones than normal because we're capped at some of the things we can actually do. I'm planning an event you know internationally is going to be great, but there's a lot of intricacies, even older than above, doing it here.

Speaker 2: 30:28

So we're recording this second week of January of 2024. What are you most excited about for this year?

Speaker 1: 30:35

Yeah, I'm great question. I'm most excited to really get the needle moving forward on really our flagship program, which is Partners Club. I'm excited to continue having more law firm owners come out to the events and building out our marketing team. Those are the two key things that I'm excited for is moving the needle forward in Partners Club and then building out our internal marketing team, which is a big initiative for us this year and we've already started making progress toward that. We've got some great team members that just started at the start of the year and already putting up some solid results, so I'm pretty fired up about that.

Speaker 2: 31:17

What about personally? Any trips coming up, anything fun for you?

Speaker 1: 31:20

Yes, actually, it's funny you say that. So tonight we're booking a trip to Costa Rica. So we have a group of friends here and they decided to do something a little bit different with us. So right before the new year they decided that each of us so myself, my wife himself, his wife we all created our own destination that we wanted to go, and then we did presentations. So we pitched each other on the presentations. I lost, but every presentation was pretty awesome and we all voted at the end of it and costa rica won. So they're coming over tonight and we're booking a trip to costa rica. So I'm really looking forward to to go in there. That'll be a cool experience that I've seen also.

Speaker 2: 32:08

Uh, drop all the names into a hat and draw the losers first and then the last one left is where you go. What was your place, that you wanted to go?

Speaker 1: 32:16

so I decided to go a little bit different this year. I actually voted for and created a presentation for a luxury dude ranch in Montana.

Speaker 2: 32:26

Uh-huh, yeah, I looked at that too.

Speaker 1: 32:30

Yeah, it didn't land quite as well with the audience, but hey, I thought it was a good idea.

Speaker 2: 32:35

Got to know your audience if you want to be able to sell them. You're right, Ironic right, All right my man, this has been very fun. I appreciate you coming on. Where do you want to direct people?

Speaker 1: 32:48

Yeah, first off, thank you for having me. This was awesome. I love how natural the conversation was and appreciate you giving me a platform to share my story just a little bit more. People can just head to yourpracticemastercom. We've got information on all the various things we do over there and can certainly hook you guys up with a free book if you head over there as well and then definitely take the time to go listen to Brian on the your Practice Master podcast as well. That'd be the two key areas that you can find on YouTube, but thank you very much for giving me an opportunity to share.

Speaker 2: 33:23

My pleasure, good, to talk to you Likewise.