Walking From The Shadows: My Journey with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder

What if the way back from trauma isn’t a single breakthrough, but a stack of small, stubborn habits that actually hold you up? We sit down with Navy veteran and author Kevin Macomber to trace a path from complex childhood trauma and Beirut-era deployments to breakdown, suicidality, and a hard-won recovery built on practical daily steps.

Macomber opens up about losing trust, withdrawing from the world, and slowly rebuilding with tools that require no perfection —just repetition. Journaling becomes a compass for messy minds, revealing patterns across hours and weeks. Nature does the quiet work that clinics can’t, as a hiking trail reawakens senses dulled by hyperarousal and numbness.

Chapters

10:21

Journaling To Untangle PTSD Symptoms

12:04

Nature As Therapy And Ending Isolation

15:37

Veteran Suicide, Stigma, And Transition Gaps

18:20

25:20

Choosing Therapists And Owning Sessions

27:04

Triggers, Breathing, And Planned Coping

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Chapters

• 0:00 Why The Book And Mission Began
• 1:04 Meet Kevin: Author, Veteran, Advocate
• 1:55 Childhood Trauma And Early Enlistment
• 3:27 Life In The 1980s Navy And Beirut
• 5:04 The First Breakdown And Aftermath
• 7:49 Church Support And Stabilizing Years
• 9:07 Adventure Interlude: Kayaks And Nature
• 10:21 Journaling To Untangle PTSD Symptoms
• 12:04 Nature As Therapy And Ending Isolation
• 14:02 Writing The Book From 15 Years Of Notes
• 15:37 Veteran Suicide, Stigma, And Transition Gaps
• 18:20 Reframing Thoughts And Forest Bathing
• 20:04 Therapy That Works And Self-Management
• 22:08 Food As Medicine: Ditching Dirty Carbs
• 24:28 Listener Resources And Newsletter
• 25:20 Choosing Therapists And Owning Sessions
• 27:04 Triggers, Breathing, And Planned Coping
• 29:10 Self-Advocacy With Providers And Meds
• 31:14 Bring An Advocate And Journal Care
• 33:05 Hope, Community, And Practice Over Time
• 35:04 Closing Reflections And Next Steps

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:00

At that point, I had the opportunity to do more in the PTSD advocacy. And I just one day I said, you know, I'm tired of hearing about 22 veterans killing themselves every day. It's not getting better. And if anything, it's probably getting worse. And so I started looking at it, and everything I saw pointed, it's actually getting worse, but they're not sharing the data. So I said, okay, I'm just gonna go take those notes and gonna go write a book. That's literally all I did. And so I sat down in a five, six-month period and wrote the entire book on what I thought somebody with PTSD or somebody who may be a friend or a family member of somebody with PTSD would want to hear. And I got it down to 16 topics.

SPEAKER_01: 0:47

Hi friends, welcome to the New Normal Big Life podcast. We bring you natural news and stories about nature that we hope will inspire you to get outside an adventure, along with a step-by-step plan to help you practice what you've learned and create your own new normal and live the biggest life you can dream. I'm your host, Antoinette Lee, the wellness warrior. Kevin McComer is an American author and advocate and Navy veteran, known for his work in raising awareness about post-traumatic stress disorder. He penned the book Walking from the Shadows, My Journey with Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder, which details his personal journey and strategies for healing from trauma. He aims to normalize discussions about mental health and reduce the stigma surrounding post-traumatic stress. The book is written to be a trauma agnostic book focusing on the healing process rather than the specific cause of trauma. The book has been accepted by all four military academies and estimates one million have heard this message. Kevin, welcome to New Normal Big Life.

SPEAKER_00: 1:45

Hey, thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01: 1:47

Can you share a bit about your life before entering the military? What was your upbringing like? What shaped you into the person you were?

SPEAKER_00: 1:55

That's interesting because that is actually part of my trauma. Today they refer to uh it as CPTSD. Most people haven't heard that, but that means complex PTSD or repeating traumas and uh events. And I grew up uh in a very dysfunctional family. Both my mother and my father were both dysfunctional in different ways, and they came from two very dysfunctional families. So uh my childhood was quite chaotic. Uh for it may have been just I was adept enough when I was a kid to say, hey, this isn't so good. So I spent much of my friend uh time at friends' homes, and uh I got some normalcy at their homes, but I did the best I could to avoid my home. By the time I was probably 15, I began the process of talking to recruiters, which is sort of young. And 16, I was actively engaged with a marine recruiter. Um, a couple months after I was 17, I joined the Navy and I had my mom sign me in uh so I could go on uh in early at a younger age. And so my childhood, I wanted to leave it in the past. I want to leave my family in the past and uh and move on. And uh, you know, in some ways that was a very mature thing to do, though I don't know I fully grasped it the time, you know, what I was doing.

SPEAKER_01: 3:18

Tell us about what experiences shaped your life in the military and just immediately after the military.

SPEAKER_00: 3:27

Sure. Well, um, to put in perspective, I went into the Navy in 1981, and it was a very different Navy than it is today. Uh, it was very difficult. Uh, the equipment still at that point, uh, they hadn't been spending much. I mean, they spent money during the Vietnam War, but overall, the Navy was pretty beat up. Uh, the equipment was old, it didn't work well, and it was a very difficult life that translated into a lot of extra hours, working weekends, working nights, and also a lot of challenges. Um, when we went out to a cruise or we went patrolling, uh, we frequently had issues and it made for a very difficult life. You really physically didn't get much of a break. You were all always tired. And for anybody who's ever deployed, and I've deployed three times and for a significant period of time, you understand that you sort of get on a rotation of work, rest. And in the Navy back in the day, you were probably only getting about five hours rest a day. And it wasn't necessarily all together. Maybe every three weeks you got a period where you were getting maybe five or six hours rest at one stretch. But the others, it was broken because you were shifting, you're you're rotating your uh watch. And uh, so you you became fatigued by that. And then uh for me, I was sent to the Middle East. I was part of the Beirut theater. It was extremely tenacious. It was a very difficult, very dangerous uh place to be at.

SPEAKER_01: 4:57

Well, the lack of sleep and the constant worry about safety is a recipe for trauma there. You've mentioned a mental breakdown in the 90s. Will you walk us through what led to that moment and how it impacted your life at the time?

SPEAKER_00: 5:12

Yeah, you know, and there's the lesson here. If you have had mental health issues and you've been traumatized a number of times, if you need help, get it. I I, in hindsight, tried putting the pieces together. I think I realized to some degree I needed it. Uh, but it was also a different time. There wasn't a reference point to this type of mental health. People didn't talk about it. There weren't resources. So when I got out of the military, I jumped into college. And uh my discipline, my work ethic was tremendous. I did it really, really well in college. Um, my grades were very high, worked a part-time job. So between those two things, it kept me so busy that I ignored the actual um situations I was facing from a mental health perspective. And then in my very late 20s, I went through a massive trauma yet again. And uh, you know, I'd been in an accident, I had my my time in the Middle East and on and on. And I, in normal circumstances, it probably wouldn't have cleaned somebody's clock like it did mine, but it did because I had not taken care of myself. And so I didn't realize I was a lot more vulnerable than I was, and and it got to me and I just broke down. And I remember that day. It was very confusing because, again, there wasn't a reference point, what was going on, why my body and my brain were both doing what they were doing. They basically were shutting down without you know, doing it on its own. It did it with, you know, here I am here. I could feel myself falling. And sort of the experience I give is I slipped on a wet floor once, and I remember looking, and all of a sudden my feet were above my eyes. And uh it was sort of like then boom. And uh it was uh a lot like that, that mental breakdown. All of a sudden I said, Oh my gosh, what's happening to me? And then I had a mental breakdown that went on for an extended period of time, and I wasn't getting help there either. And that's eventually what uh led me to attempt suicide.

SPEAKER_01: 7:21

So many veterans like us have this period of very high functioning while we're in the military. And then even for a time after the military, we're super high functioning because we're so focused on the mission. The things that we did in process for many years just kind of hit us like a ton of bricks. So, after experiencing your second breakdown, what was different about that period and how did it push you toward recovery?

SPEAKER_00: 7:49

Something unique happened for me. I the company I'd started a new job, so I had multiple life situations changing at the same time as well. And somebody I knew brought me a newspaper article, and in that newspaper article was a uh support recovery group at a local church, and I hadn't been to church in a long time. I mean, a really long time. It wasn't even on my mind. And he says, I think you should go check this out. And that's sort of what got me started. I got into this church and met some people who were understanding and caring, and they, you know, surrounded me. And uh that comfort um and kindness is at least what slowed me a little. Um, the recovery from my breakdown probably took, at the worst of it, was probably three or four years that it took to, you know, slow it down, turn it around, and at least be aiming in the forward direction. Uh there was no healing going on there. It was just trying to get the hemorrhaging to stop, getting the pain, the extensive pain to get it to stop. And uh that in fact happened.

SPEAKER_01: 9:04

We'll be back after this brief break for an adventure to talk about the journey to post-traumatic stress recovery with author Kevin McOmer. Before we cover the next topic in this episode, I want to introduce you to the adventure sports lifestyle with what I like to call a micro story about an adventure that I've had. The adventure sports lifestyle, my deep connection to nature, is essential to my good health. So here's the story. The day before this recording, Matt and I kayed to an island and spent a couple of hours fishing. I had to ferry across a new river, the bow of my kayak putting slightly upriver with a steady, strong, rhythmic paddle stroke. Matt was so proud of how well I did that he can't stop telling me and anyone who will listen how well I did. He said, My grasshopper did so well. Some of my favorite things about adventure sports is that it allows you to in those you love to create memories and it offers opportunities to learn new things and improve over time and experience a sense of accomplishment. And this is so critical to your journey to recovery from a mental or physical health challenge. So I hope this inspires you to get outside in adventure along with friends or the people you love most. Now, back to the show where we're talking with author Kevin McComer about his post-traumatic stress recovery journey. So, Kevin, your recovery journey is central to walking from the shadows. What are the pivotal moments or strategies that help you to heal and also to find the resources that you need that would work? Because although there are resources, many of them don't work for some people, myself included. And how did journaling play a role?

SPEAKER_00: 10:44

So, what happened with me, uh, I think a lot of it was sort of trial error on my my own, uh, just sort of stumbling into it. I uh, you know, people here, oh, I came up with this idea or I was told to do this. That didn't happen. A lot of it was I just stumbled into it. Um, on the journaling, I'll start with that. I my my mind was a mess. It was an absolute mess. And when you have PTSD, it's not one symptom, it's multiple symptoms, and they can all be undulating, going up and down in different uh intensities by the day or by the hour. And when you come, you know, and you start combining multiple symptoms together, really is a very hard thing to comprehend. So I started writing, trying to put words to what was going on in my head. And that, of course, was the beginning of my journaling. One of the more transformative moments was uh anybody with PTSD or has been traumatized. There are two things that absolutely affect every single person. And one is the ability to trust others, and the second one is isolation. I had lost complete trust of everybody. I mean, literally everybody, with maybe the exclusion of a couple friends and my sister. I trusted nobody. And I put myself into a deep isolation, and it would be, you know, a long period, maybe a year or two after that, uh, just out of pure boredom, um, I found a canal trail and I started walking. And still at this point, I physically was numb. My face was numb, my brain was numb. Everything about me was numb. And uh this canal trail was low traffic, very level, easy walking. It was really quiet, you know, safe, meaning there's no stimulation. And after having done it for a while, my senses kicked in. And that was probably the biggest transformation of where I connected with being outdoors and understanding, oh my goodness, I can smell something again. I can actually hear a bird in the background. You know, I can feel the sun on my face. And these very subtle things were probably the point where I started re-engaging, you know, with my with my feelings, having literally had them stripped away, completely stripped away.

SPEAKER_01: 13:12

That's the incredible healing power of nature and why nature-based therapy is so um impactful, but yet subtle. It's not this big action, it just kind of a slow knowing uh that happens when you're out in nature. And that was sort of what happened for me too. And like you, I spent 18 months in my home, not leaving my home, thank God for telemedicine, because uh I couldn't force myself to step one foot outside my luxury condo at the time. And um, so what really resonates with me is how you talk about isolation. So, why did you decide to write the book? And what did you hope that readers would get? What insights?

SPEAKER_00: 14:03

Well, I I tell people this I had no plans to write a book. So uh there's a couple things that happen in parallel. Uh, I've been doing PTSD service projects, advocacy for 20, 25 years, and I told bits and pieces of my story over time, and people were were always fascinated with it. When we moved to Pennsylvania five years ago, I found over a box of all my journaling notes. So I journaled for 15 years. I wrote a lot, and I knew where the box was, and then something peculiar happened. Um, this was during the COVID period. We thought that I was experiencing a form of fatigue, burnout, and I did have COVID once and possibly residual effects of that. I was just, I was just spent. I started making you know mistakes at work, and and I just I wasn't at at my A game. It came out that my latent TBI and PTSD symptoms started having an impact on my brain, on my cognition. I've been through all kinds of tests, I mean scores of tests, and it's still going. My brain's been impacted, they don't know why, but it created a number of problems for me. And so I pushed myself into early retirement. I had the ability to do that, and so I retired at 59. At that point, um, I had the opportunity to do more in the PTSD advocacy. And I just one day I said, you know, I'm tired of hearing about 22 veterans killing themselves every day. It's not getting better, and if anything, it's probably getting worse. And so I started looking at it, and in everything I saw pointed, it's actually getting worse, but they're not sharing the data. So I said, okay, I'm just gonna go take those notes and gonna go write a book. That's literally all I did. And so I sat down in a five, six month period and wrote the entire book um on what I thought somebody with PTSD or somebody who may be a friend or a family member of somebody with PTSD would want to hear. And I got it down to 16 topics.

SPEAKER_01: 16:12

When we think about veteran suicide, I I want to spend a moment here getting your thoughts on veteran suicide. I know that I have my thoughts, what I think the VA and communities can do better. First of all, we need to stop mainstream media and entertainment villainizing veterans. In fact, in my own experience, I had a woman that I considered a dear friend whom I took care of after her surgery. She listened to a report on the news that said, if you have a veteran in your life, you're inviting danger into your life. And the message she took away from that was, well, my friend Antoinette is a veteran. And even though I know her to be a very caring person who took care of me in my moment of need, she decided to call me up the next morning and tell me that she could no longer be my friend because of that news story. And my male friends who were veterans said, people write in their dating profile. If you're a veteran, don't even bother. You lots of unfavorable names after that. It was in their dating profile. Also, when you go to the theater, all that you see is imagery of the dangerous veteran who comes home and does something terrible in his community. And I believe that one of the causes is the image that the world society puts on us veterans. Secondly, we leave the military and we're expected to hit the ground running and to be successful, to find a job, to move ourselves and our families to another location out of military housing or barracks or wherever you lived, and be able to provide for yourself immediately without ever any time to decompress. So I think that's an issue. The financial burden on veterans post-military service is incredible. I was very fortunate I left the military and had a job before I left that paid much more money than what I was making in the military. But not everybody has that ability. And often people who are very, very sick, even a friend who had a double amputation, lower limb amputation, it took him five years, 10 years actually, after his military service to receive healthcare benefits and other benefits. So we need to do better when it comes to providing for the veteran and you know the transition training that they give you is it's great and everything.

SPEAKER_00: 18:59

And that, Antoinette, is the key word transition. There was no transition, and even talking today with uh recent veterans, the transition is still not adequate. And that's where I think they've really failed to help the individual understand if you went through A, B, and C, most likely you have a chance of experiencing DENF. And they fail to do that. And there's a lot of things going against veterans when they come out. It's a very difficult transition. The world, even though, say you were in the military four years, the world you come out to is so very different. I remember when I got out, I was just shocked at the horrible work ethic and how slow people were and senior people, their inability to make the most basic decisions. You know, these are all fundamental things. You're learned, you learn. I'm 85 by the time I was 21 years old. And so I was capable of making decisions. And then I get out and you see 41-year-old men that can't even say yes or no, and you're trying to lead them. It makes it very difficult. And I think, you know, that lack of transition and the different world experiences may actually, in fact, make veterans difficult to work with at times. Um, doesn't mean it's bad, doesn't mean they're wrong. Um, but the world standards are pretty low. And I think you hear this from almost all veterans, it's the lack of work ethic, the emotional immaturity in the workplace, behavioral things. You see all of this, and it makes it difficult. For me, I think the transition, I didn't realize I had been damaged as much as I had. And, you know, when you go through severe trauma, your brain gets rewired. Um, your brain can trick you, and it really takes a lot of work to understand what is real and what isn't real and what you can control and what you can't control. If your brain is a muck, it certainly lends itself to that pathway of uh being suicidal. And that's one of the things I talk about so much with veterans is you know, is this real? You know, how do you reframe your situation? How do you move to something positive? You know, when you go through something like PTSD or you have a disability or you're missing a limb, your life isn't over. You just have to figure out where am I going to compensate in my life to offset that disability. And that's been probably some of my greater experiences you can't undo the past. I can't really fix my brain. Um, you know, I certainly can't fix a lot of the experiences. A lot of them are washed, a lot of them disappeared, you know, can't get them back. So you do other things, you know, whether it be, you know, whole health, going outdoors was significant. I would later read, you know, not that many years ago, maybe 10 years ago. Um, there's a Japanese term called forest bathing, where people go out into the forest and they got it. That's exactly and go, oh my goodness, that I figured that out on my own. But once you do it, now I do it on purpose. I go out, I've got five acres. I go into the woods and I just lose myself in there and enjoy it and absorb all the beautiful things that impact your senses out in the middle of the woods. But you have to, you have to compensate. You have to learn how to, you know, pick up other areas of your life that can have a positive uh impact.

SPEAKER_01: 22:30

As you were saying, you have to create your new normal because you're never getting your old life back. And so you can sit and have a pity party about, well, I used to be great at my job and strong and competent, and now I can't even dress myself in the morning because I'm so disabled from all of my health challenges. And I'm speaking for myself here. Let's talk about the strategies for recovery.

SPEAKER_00: 22:55

Sure. I think first of all, you you know, some of the some of the things are obvious, but there are a lot of things that aren't obvious. So the first one is I think there's a place for therapy, but you need the right therapist, at least with PTSD, you want to find somebody who understands trauma therapy. And there are a lot of therapists out there that feign that they have more experience than they actually do. You know, it's like any profession, it's the 80-20 rule. You know, 20% are great, and then 80%, you know, show up. Doesn't matter the job. And you need to find somebody in that 20%. The next thing you have to understand is, you know, depending on the severity of your issues, you know, you're dealing with it possibly half day, all day long. And if you're seeing a specialist or therapist, it may only be for an hour or two a month. That leaves a whole bunch of other time you have to fill in. For me, I sort of looked at the many things I did. And the first thing was I go back to the point I made, what is real, what isn't real, what can I control, and what can I control? And it takes surprisingly a lot of time, practice, and patience to learn how to do that because you know, you may jump to conclusions and you may think things and they may be wrong. You really got to work to reframe your thoughts. And it takes some time to do that. Another thing that I did was that really had possibly the greater impact, and I didn't realize the impact was when you're talking whole health, one thing that I really went down was to change my diet. I I'm 62. I had no idea. I mean, when we talk about it, you're on the news, and when we talk about diet, it's usually about weight loss. I'm not talking about that because I know overweight people that are very healthy, they're just overweight. I'm talking the content of the food you are putting into your body. So I became, for example, um quite aware of dirty carbs. And I didn't realize what a negative impact dirty carbs had been having on my body. I started taking them out. And for the for the new listener for dirty carbs, it's basically white sugar, white flour, um rice, potatoes, all of those things create um, those carbs create sugars in your body. You start pulling those out, even if you just pull out, you know, soft drinks, you know, packed with high fructose corn syrup, you're gonna notice a huge, huge impact. And then the other thing is removing processed foods. Start, you know, that's very difficult. I get it. It's difficult to move the dirt, remove dirty carbs. It's in everything because it's cheap. But going to more, I won't say natural foods, but going more to um real food, you know, fresh food, and being more cognizant and what I was playing in my body. And you know, I will come to learn that, you know, the majority of your serotonin, and he this is a gray, I love that word, serotonin, it's not coming from your head, it's coming from your gut. I had no idea. And so, you know, just what you put in, we've all heard this expression, garbage in, garbage out, but it really is quite true that you do that, and then possibly if you need to, you take a supplement or you take a vitamin. I do both. Um, all of a sudden, I felt better. And this wasn't the placebo effect. I literally felt better. My body was regulating better, I was stronger, I wasn't lethargic, I didn't have, I haven't had, you know, hitting the wall. You know, people hit that wall in the middle of the day. I haven't had that in so many years, I can't remember. And I attributed it to uh to changing the diet, what you are putting into your body. And for anybody listening to this, it is one of the most simple, easiest things to do with the greatest impact that literally anybody listening to here right now can do. Right now, you can get off this podcast, do it right now, make a change in your life. People don't look at it that way. And it is one of those ways.

SPEAKER_01: 27:10

I want to interject something here. We have made this simple for you listeners. We have episodes on removing the toxic ingredients out of your foods, and you can listen to that episode and click the show description and download a list of those toxic ingredients and how they will appear on your food label so that you can avoid them. And we've also developed a collection of vitamins, minerals, and supplements that support mental health and mood regulation. Listen to that episode, go to the show description and download your list. And make sure you sign up for our newsletter at nnbl.blog because you'll get these lists and these downloadable step-by-step plans direct to your inbox every week and it's free for people who sign up for the newsletter. When you're planning an adventure camping, rafting, RV, or mountaineering, you'll need quality food with sufficient vitamins, minerals, and nutrients to fuel your adventure. My partner Ready Hour is here to help you ahead of time. Ready Hour has a long history of providing calorie-rich, reliable, and delicious nourishment for life's unexpected situations and adventures. They're part of a family of companies that have served millions of people like you for decades. My family and I use Ready Hour products for camping, mountaineering, and disaster preparedness for five years now. They're not just reliable, they're also your affordable option too. Long-term storable food shouldn't break the bank. That's why they have great sales and payment options for you. It's your bridge to safety and survival when you're on an adventure. So make your next decision, your smartest decision. Be ready for adventure tomorrow, today. Trust Ready Hour. Ready to shop? Use my affiliate link in the show description. I want to talk also about selecting the right therapist. And here's my philosophy on choosing a good therapist. In my experience, any person, whether it's your family member, your therapist, or anyone else in your life, if they are telling you what to do, what to think, and how to feel, they don't have your best interests at heart. They have another agenda. But the folks who will help you process what you're thinking, feeling, and help you develop some action steps to take afterwards, those are the people who truly have your best interest at heart. And that's one sort of litmus test that I use when I was talking with a therapist. I don't need one now. Uh, but I hope you'll find that helpful, listeners.

SPEAKER_00: 29:48

I'd like to add to that. Um, what I have discovered is, and people think this sort of crash to say it, remember, they work for you. And what I said earlier, if you see a therapist. Therapist, if you're fortunate, maybe you see them twice a month, maybe you only see them once a month. In my same journaling notes over time, I still do it now. Is if I meet with anybody, I take notes and I prepare for my meeting. I said, I'd like to accomplish this today. You work for me, help me get to here. Why am I thinking this way? And just don't let the conversations ramble because there are a lot of clock counters out there. And they're just, you know, just trying to drive the clock until they get you the next episode. And if you don't feel like you're accomplishing something, you probably are. It's hard work. You will know if you are working, you will feel you may not feel miserable, but you most certainly will feel uncomfortable. There may be topics depending on the trauma that could be very sensitive and hurtful. I get it. But if your conversations aren't making you uncomfortable and difficult for you to manage, you're probably not doing the work and they're probably not the right person.

SPEAKER_01: 30:56

Amen to that. I agree with that completely. I also want to ask you about something that comes up often, especially in the veteran community, particularly among combat veterans, this discussion of suggestions on what things that you find helpful when the demons come up, when those bad times arise, when anniversaries of trauma arise, or just something happens in the news that might take you back to a place where you don't really like going. How do you handle that?

SPEAKER_00: 31:32

Well, again, this sort of goes back to the journaling. I know what my triggers are and I'm waiting and ready for them. Now I don't like them, they happen. They did different types of triggers. I have one smell, I have two smells actually that can set me off. Um, there's certain sounds or certain images sometimes that will trigger me, but I'm ready. You know, that's part of managing yourself. You have to be honest. Okay, I have these triggers, and what will I do? There are they they call them grounding techniques. I really don't like grounding techniques. It's too generalized because there's literally, if you put it into Google, you'll get literally dozens and dozens of them. But you find things, activities, things you can do when the trigger comes up that that you default to. So, you know, one of the bigger ones, and this is actually helpful overall, is learning how to breathe. I did not know how to breathe. I taught myself how to breathe. Um, if I feel anxiety or a panic attack coming on, I have an ability where I sit down and I slow down my world and I breathe through my nose and I count and I just slow down. And I go back to what I said earlier. Is this real or not real? And can I control it? Can I not control it? And you do that and you acknowledge it, but you just work with it. And I'll tell you, it is a little awkward at first, but after practicing it, you what you find to help you is uh good. So, like for uh uh for me, I know October 23rd, you know, the bombing of the barracks, I know it's gonna make me, I'm gonna be sad that day. So, what am I going to do? I know I'm going to be doing some walking, I'm going to be some do positive affirmations, positive thinking. I'm going to, you know, um reframe my thoughts. All of these things, which you can practice, is how you deal with that. And you have to deal with it. They because it will happen. I am now 30 plus years of my healing, and I still have triggers. I don't have them as often as I used to. They're not as intense. I don't have the nightmares. I don't have the night terror like I did, but they do happen. But you have to be responsible and you have to you have to head them straight on and deal with it, even if it's uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_01: 33:47

If you're listening and you're struggling with a mental health challenge and you don't know how to get started or even when to get started, and you can work for, I recently interviewed uh Greg Forest and Michael Nolan about their innovative health and uh mental health and addiction recovery. And you can listen to that previous episode. It came out just before the release of this one. So that will be helpful if you're just starting out on your journey or thinking maybe it's time for me to start working on my mental health. And then also I want to go back to talk about managing yourself. Uh, when I spoke with uh Dr. Julie Seymours about her book, Surviving Your Hospital Stay, we talked about not just surviving your hospital stay, but how to choose a good healthcare provider. And she gives a lot of good insights on what your rights are as a patient and what words you can use when you feel like you're not being heard or um your opinion isn't being valued by your healthcare provider. One of the things that you talked about here, Kevin, is journaling. And that's one of the first steps to managing yourself because if you don't write down what you're thinking, what you're feeling, what happened in the moment, our memories, especially when we're managing trauma and we're managing stress, are not good. You might think you remembered what happened, but it's through this lens of trauma and this lens of how you react to trauma. But when you write it down, it helps you to like put the trauma at arm's length, step back, and um you're an observer of what happened and how you felt about it and all of the things related to that situation. So I highly encourage journaling, and I highly encourage, like Kevin was saying, that you need to be an active participant in your own mental health recovery. It there are no magic pills. And Kevin, I know that you have some thoughts on um medication that I really want to make sure we get to.

SPEAKER_00: 36:12

Yeah, I think you know, there's there is a place for medication, but you know, it didn't go easy for me. Um, certainly on the front side of it, um, my body did not like it. And um, you know, you hear how it takes time, they have to adjust the amounts. It didn't matter. My body just did not like it. And I'm not saying it is necessarily a bad thing, but I give an analogy. When you go into some of these medications, there has to be an off-ramp. And it's it's very similar to like taking ibuprofen. You don't take ibuprofen every day waiting to hit your hand to get a sore hand. You take it when you have a sore hand, you take it for a while, and then you stop. And that that's very simplistic, but it must be part of your conversation with who's prescribing your medication. Okay, we're going to go into this. How long are we going to, you know, use it? How long is it needed? For some people, there are certain medications that are a godsend. Um, for others, not so much. And, you know, I think within the veteran community, and I hear this a lot, is that many feel they're over-medicated. And it may be a little sinister, but people generally the feeling is you're being medicated just to calm you down, numb you out so they can get to the next person. You're a number. It's an easy, quick way to manage you. But the reality is it is a foreign substance and you have to go into it with um with a plan. Just don't assume that. And if they give you medication, just remember one thing we have today is the internet. You put in that, you know, medication there, and you can even do on your cell phone in the doctor's office, say, let's talk. What are some of the symptoms we have? And okay, oh, it has this symptom. What do we do if this happens? And so you again, usually it's the psychiatrist, sometimes nurse practitioners can give you these medications. Remember, they work for you, you just don't have to default with them. And one of the things I want to add here, and it goes with the doctor and psychiatrist, things that are having very big impacts on your well-being. I strongly suggest either taking a friend or you taking a partner with you to the appointment if it's a key appointment. Okay, so like if you're new in medication, um the the value of taking somebody there is to guide you, remind you, support you, advocate for you. There's a lot of roles that person can do. You know, you get in there, your mind could be drifting, and you may be only picking up half of what that person is saying to you. That other person's gonna help you. Hey, you know, get get centered here, you know, let's get back. And I think that's very important. And again, even in my journaling, I'm gonna mention this again. Anytime you go to a doctor's appointment, journal it. Take notes with them, review your notes with them, you know, date it. And then one of the things I I do talk about in my book about doing with the journaling, I call it purpose-driven writing, is the underline keyword. So you can go back and find it very quickly. So the thing with journaling just isn't the processing of downloading information, it's to use it. I found that over time I kept journaling the same thing and coming up with the same thought. And I wonder, you know, this is this is interesting. I keep coming. Why do I keep coming back to this one thought or two thoughts and then processing it? So, you know, that's just some input on how to manage that. And I talk about how to manage this in my book. I think it's useful.

SPEAKER_01: 39:55

My personal thought on medication is that it can be very beneficial for you, especially when you're in the acute phase of any illness, any dis-ease, and whether it's mental health or physical health. However, what I've noticed is that most physicians, once they put you on a drug, they really don't want to help you work your way off that drug. If you are feeling like your senses are being dulled by the drug to the point where you're not thriving, you're just surviving day to day, but you really don't have a real life because you're so numb and um sleepy all the time from the medications of what they call side effects. Then have that conversation with your doctor and um advocate for yourself. Let's make a plan to step down or re or at a minimum reduce it. Because, like Kevin was saying, in my own experience, uh I had all of the very worst side effects from every medication I've been on, including anaphylactic shock. And you can only survive anaphylactic shock so many times before maybe you don't make it through that. So um be your own patient advocate, get someone else that can advocate for you, because it's very important that you can communicate with your care providers about how you're feeling on the medication. They may still tell you, I think at this point you should stay on it, and that's valid. But over time, if you are really feeling like I don't need to be on this medication, maybe talk to another healthcare provider about the human feeling.

SPEAKER_00: 41:52

That's exactly it, Antony. And that's sort of what happened with me. Now, I had one provider, and this was during the COVID period, and I had my wife with me, and my wife was a nurse, and my wife started questioning what she was saying. We were telling her what was going on with me, and she was sort of fighting me, and my wife's going, something seems wrong here. And I actually shifted doc I shifted uh VA facilities and and and got a better doctor, and then they changed me, and uh, and that wasn't my doing. I told them what was going on. He said, Yeah, this isn't the best thing for you. So it's okay to question. Remember, I'm gonna say it again, they work for you, and you have never forget that, and don't be rude, you know, right, but they work for you, and um, if you don't feel something's right, it's very possible it isn't right, right?

SPEAKER_01: 42:41

You know, and and the more that you can calmly say, express your thoughts and feelings, then the more the easier it is for your healthcare provider to really listen to you. But the more agitated you are as you're talking to your healthcare provider, it kind of feeds into what they're saying, which is I don't think you should get off this medication, and your agitated state tells me reinforces that I'm right, the meaning that the provider is right to keep you on the medication. So stay calm, use your words. Uh, Dr. Seymours gives you a lot of uh advice on what to say. Before we um end this conversation, which has been so insightful, Kevin. What more do you want the listeners to know?

SPEAKER_00: 43:31

I think it depends where you are in your healing journey, but I meet a lot of people early on in their healing journey, and uh there's two things. One is it does get better. You know, there's so much more information today, so many resources. There's podcasts, there's YouTube, there's papers, there's articles you can read on the internet. We had none of that 30 years ago, and it would have been a huge help to say, you know, okay, it is going to get better. The other one is you're not alone. I am just amazed by the number of veterans, the percentage of veterans that have PTSD related issues. It's no small number, very high percentage. So the chances if you can get in some type of support group or if you can meet up with other people similar to you, more likely than not, you'll have a support network because they get it, and that's a beautiful thing. The other thing is one of the practices I tell everybody to do is you're gonna be learning some new things. They may sound different, they may sound strange, but fake it till you make it is the approach. You're gonna, you know, particularly in therapy or you know, grounding techniques or any of these things we're talking about, it's gonna feel uncomfortable, it's gonna feel awkward. It does just hang in there, stick with it, because if you keep doing it, your behaviors and your approaches will change, and and that helps you find hope and makes you feel better, and things do get better. But I can tell you after being 30 years in the healing process, it gets better. And honestly, some miraculous things can happen. I mean, I wrote a book. Who would have ever thought, you know, I'd write a book and the book would take off? I mean, technically speaking, I'm I'm a nobody, you know, I'm one guy, but I'm in the realm of, you know, there's probably two, three hundred thousand, you know, mental health books and twenty, thirty thousand PTSD books, and my book continues just staying right there at the top. And uh, you know, don't make it harder than it is, but just you're gonna have to confront your demons and you're gonna have to work at it.

SPEAKER_01: 45:43

Well, thank you for that. We wish you continued success with your book and your speaking in your veteran advocacy. Until next time, friends, I'm Antoinette Lee, your wellness warrior here at the New Normal Big Life Podcast. I hope one day to see you on the river, in the backcountry, or in the horse barn living your best life. Struggling with health problems or seeking natural health solutions? Don't miss our latest podcast episodes, exclusive blog posts, and free ebooks packed with life-changing wellness tips. Join our newsletter at nnbl.blog to unlock this bonus content and start living your best life today. Magnesium, an unsung hero, fuels over 300 bodily reactions from heart health to stress relief. Magnesium expert Natalie Girado, founder of Rooted In, found freedom from anxiety, insomnia, and pain through topical magnesium. It transformed my life, she says, inspiring her mission to share this mineral's power. Cardiologist Dr. Jack Wolfson calls magnesium essential for heart health, helping regulate rhythms, blood sugar, and reduce inflammation. Up to 80% of people may be deficient facing issues like depression, migraines, insomnia, or muscle crap. For women over 40, magnesium eases menopause symptoms, boosts energy, and supports bones. Choosing the correct type of magnesium matters. Real stories, Natalie's in mind, highlight its impact. After interviewing magnesium expert Natalie Girato, I became a customer. I was already a magnesium fan, having been told by two cardiologists to take magnesium for a minor heart arrhythmia. Natalie explains it best in the Magnesium The Mineral Transforming Lives episode of New Normal Big Life, number four in Alternative Health on Apple Podcasts. Listen wherever you get your podcasts. Fast forward after the interview, I bought the Rooted Inn bundle for sleep, tranquility, and pain relief. As a spine injury survivor with several other health challenges, I'm in constant pain. However, I don't take any pain medication. Rooted in is now one more source that nature provided to give our bodies what it needs when it needs it. You can find magnesium in natural bodies of water like lakes and rivers and in soil. But modern farming practices have stripped magnesium out of the soil and our food. That's why today, Rooted In's rest, relief, and tranquility are part of our afternoon and nightly sleep routine. My guy who did two tours kicking indoors in a rock with the Marines now has no trouble falling asleep. I no longer have to take melatonin before bedtime to fall asleep. So after I became a customer and saw how well these products work, I applied to become an affiliate. I've been sharing the secrets of Rooted In with friends and family from age 38 to 68, and everyone has gotten amazing results within minutes of applying the cream. Do something naturally good for yourself. Get Rooted In. Click my affiliate link in the episode description to shop now.